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  1. #1
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    Default Intralipid infusion

    Hi everyone
    im posting to ask those who’ve had intralipid infusions - how much did the infusion cost? And how frequent did you have the infusions during a cycle?

    I recently did 2 freeze all cycles (planned freeze all as I’m high risk of ohss and need another laparoscopy for endometriosis and taking out my left tube before I attempt a transfer) Bith cycles were hugely disappointing- got 15 eggs, 14 fertilised, none made to freeze first cycle. Second cycle got 18 eggs, 16 fertilised and only 1 made it to freeze. My clinic refuses to tell me the grade of the frozen embryo but told ‘it’s poor quality’.

    Im in the process of changing clinics and FS and this will mean going interstate either to Sydney or Brisbane as I’m very unhappy wth my FS and his total lack of willingness to try different protocols (amongst a lot of other issues). I have severe endometriosis, adenomyosis, rheumatoid arthritis and high NK cells.
    So next cycle will be requesting intralipid infusions and have been advised this by another FS I consulted recently. I also have MTHFR mutation and have had 3 previous miscarriages.

    Im interested if anyone is willing to share how much the intralipid infusion cost?? as I know all places have different prices. And also would appreciate any recommendations of FS to see who are really good with autoimmune issues and ‘complex’ cases in either Sydney or Brisbane? TIA

  2. #2
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    Hi @jess03

    I also have Endometriosis, Adenomyosis, MTHFR and immune issues.

    I see Dr M in Sydney (Reproductive Immunologist) and did Intralipids with him. He charges $650 each but there is a clinic in Randwick that only charges $450 but you will need a referral from an specialist to use them.

    The first intralipids was I think 1-2 weeks before transfer. Then if you have a BFP an intralipid transfusion every 3-4 weeks till about 12-15 weeks I think.

    BB

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    jess03 (23-06-2018)

  4. #3
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    Hi @jess03

    Firstly sorry it’s been a rough ride!

    I second the recommendation for Dr M (Gamal Matthias) with your combo of RA, MTHFR, NK cells and miscarriages.

    I have MTHFR, high NKs, high ANAs, m/c and autoimmune markers we think is pre-RA based on family history.

    Most FS’s don’t really believe in immune issues and those that do tend to focus on NK cells and the Bondi protocol only.

    Dr M is an OB-gyn and reproductive immunology specialist (not an FS) in Sydney. He’ll look at all the factors and customise a protocol based on your blood work. So you use your FS protocol for stim cycle and Dr M’s immune protocol for transfers and to maintain pregnancy. He does Skype appointments for interstate patients. You can do bloods at any Laverty’s pathology.

    He told me Intralipids 7-10 days before transfer, on BFP, then monthly - but will tailor to you. He does it at Hurstville Private usually on a Saturday night. Out of pocket cost $650 (ouch!). He believes how Intralipids are done is important - so slow infusion rate with a saline flush before and after (instead of concurrently). Takes 6hrs or so. I guess if you found somewhere local he would write the script.

    Now for an FS! 2 options:
    - find one who believes in immune issues
    - find one who you think will be best for their core task which is to get you some decent frozen embryos and (secretly) use Dr M for immune protocol.

    Brisbane - Charlotte Mooring or Warren DeAmbrosis at QFG. Both excellent FS’s with and a comprehensive immune protocol. (Waz on extended medical leave until Sept). You can do cycle bloods/scans at any Virtus Health clinic for free (QFG, IVFA not sure of names in other states) or find your own place locally (extra cost). Need to fly in for first appointment, final scan before EPU and for procedures. I see both Charlotte and Dr M. Her Intralipids protocol for me was 500ml on cd7-10 (or about 10 days before transfer) + 250ml top up on transfer + every 10 days. They do it at St Andrews hospital or at the clinic day surgery after EPU or transfer. With PHI, only cost is hospital excess if not paid already. St Andrews has the better, slower infusion rate machines. They run saline concurrently with the Intralipids over 5-6hours.

    Gold Coast - not sure if convenient but I did read great things about Dr Kee Ong at Monash. Can’t remember where he stands in immune stuff.

    Sydney - I live in Sydney. Not many true immune believers. A lot do basic Bondi protocol. Dr Alison Gee at Genea will work alongside Dr M though. Dr Gavin Sacks is the creator of the Bondi protocol but really just focuses on NK cells (he will do Intralipids, not sure of cost or where). If choosing Sydney I’d just find a good FS for stim.

    For Intralipids here it’s either Dr M at Hurstville ($650), Dr Sacks (?) or get a script and go to Randwick infusion clinic. They quoted me $350 vs previous posters $450 (interesting!). I haven’t followed up yet to check details - ie 500ml dose, speed of infusion and how they do the saline.

    Melbourne - not sure if an option for you but Dr Nick Lolatgis is another immune believer who works with Dr M. I believe he arranges Intralipids there more cheaply too.

    There’s a series of threads on here discussing immune protocols, latest is #10. https://www.bubhub.com.au/community/...iller-Cells-10

    Also what MTHFR type do you have? Did your FS just tell you to take 5mg folic acid? That’s their standard advice, but from my research its counterproductive and we actually need to avoid folic acid and synthetic B vitamins altogether and take the active forms instead. Well worth researching or pm me.

    R

  5. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Risa78 For This Useful Post:

    Birdface (21-04-2019),Bizmak (04-01-2019),jess03 (23-06-2018),mummanow (29-06-2018)

  6. #4
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    Hi @jess03

    You've had some great info here, I hope things start falling into place for you. I know your question is about intralipids, but having read your post I just wanted to say that if it was me, I would really look into egg and/or sperm quality issues first and foremost. If you're getting 15, 18 eggs with an end result of one poor quality embryo, I honestly think you're dealing with a significant embryo quality issue. I hope you don't mind me saying this, and I think you're doing the right thing by looking into other protocols.

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    jess03 (23-06-2018)

  8. #5
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    Hi Kalina

    Thank you so much for your reply and no I don’t mind at all what you said about egg and/or sperm issues. I’ve actually thought that myself given the results of my cycles and lack of embryos to freeze. I really appreciate you taking the time to reply and your thoughts.

    Can I ask if you’ve had this yourself? Only asking as I’m looking into and wanting to try absolutely everything I can to improve egg quality for my next round. I’m open to ideas, treatments, supplements- anything and everything!
    My AMH is quite high so my FS didn’t expect any issues with egg quality, sperm issues have been ruled out pretty much so I’m lost in what I can do. I know my stim meds I was on were not the right doses and have sought a different FS for my next round who’s going for quality over quantity. He thinks I was way overstimulated and that would’ve contributed to the lack of embryo development, but there’s also other issues that haven’t been able to be identified regarding egg quality so I’m wanting to do whatever I can for next round.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalina View Post
    Hi @jess03

    You've had some great info here, I hope things start falling into place for you. I know your question is about intralipids, but having read your post I just wanted to say that if it was me, I would really look into egg and/or sperm quality issues first and foremost. If you're getting 15, 18 eggs with an end result of one poor quality embryo, I honestly think you're dealing with a significant embryo quality issue. I hope you don't mind me saying this, and I think you're doing the right thing by looking into other protocols.

  9. #6
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    Hi Baby4BB
    thank you so much for your reply. Your information was great and very helpful. I’ve spoken to the clinic in Randwick and they were really helpful. And thanks so much for how much it costs and how often. You’re a gem

    im sorry you have the same as me with endo, adeno, MTHFR and immune issues. Can I ask if seeing Dr M (who I’ve heard heaps of good things anout) and having the intralipid infusion helped you?

  10. #7
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    Risa78 Thank you so much for your post. So much helpful information in there for me. I want to reply properly and don’t have the time tonight as I’m sick, but will come back and reply to you.

    I really appreciate all all the info you’ve giv n in your reply. I’ve actually had a Skype consult with Dr Waz at QFG and he was amazing. Not sure if I can work the travel from being interstate but he was great. Your info for Sydney Drs was so helpful too. I’ll come back to this with you.

    For the MTHFR I am homozygous C677T. I’ve researched it myself as can’t afford to see a specialist in this or a naturopath and I worked out very quickly not to take folic acid and avoid all foods that have folic acid added. I currently take an active form of folate. I’m still trying to work out which supplement to take for the other active B vitamins as a recent blood test for my iron levels showed that I had incredibly high vitamin b12 levels so my GP said to stop any b12 or other b vitamins that have b12 in it. Not sure if that’s right or not but I stopped those but still taking my active folate. On the bioseuticals brand atm but recently ordered some of the Thorne brand. Only knew my high b12 as I needed an iron infusion as my iron, ferritin and saturation had plummeted again although weirdly as I said my b12 was extremely high and my hemoglobin was high which was weird as well - all other times I’ve needed an iron infusion my Hb has been low too.

    Thank you you so much for all your info. I’ll reply properly soon. Thank u

  11. #8
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    Thank you so much to everyone who replied. You’re all amazing. It’s new to me this intralipid infusion so all your information has been so helpful.

    Ive also been advised to use Saizen in my next cycle. Has anyone used this? I know it’s terribly expensive to an already expensive ivf cycle so I’m wondering if it’s worth using?

    And if if anyone else has used intralipid infusions I’d love to hear experiences with it. Thank you

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    Hi Jess

    I took Saizen last cycle. It is expensive!!! Ouch.

    I had a better cycle (more eggs). I had changed so many things that cycle so it’s a bit hard to know for sure what worked. But I plan to use it again.

    Now i am not a doctor so do your own research and take everything I say from here on in with a grain of salt! But after doing a lot of reading about MTHFR, particularly from Dr Ben Lynch, I have a different take on your high B12 level. The way he explains it is you can’t process normal Bs. So if you’ve been taking a standard B supplement then it makes sense you’d end up with high levels of some B vitamins in your blood ****** (ie floating in blood since your body couldn’t convert it). But those high levels are not actually available to your body, so could actually be masking a deficiency.

    When I started TTC, I was taking Elevit and a multi B. I kept getting off the chart results for B6. So I stopped taking them. But then I read about how B6 and B12 are crucial for the methylation process (ie your body needs B6 and B12 to absorb and use folate).

    So it may sound crazy, but I have actually increased my B6 supplements (in the active form though).

    I take...

    Prenatal - Eagle Tresos Natal (active folate, active B12, mix of active and standard B6, and all the usual stuff). Available behind the counter at the health store.

    Thorne Methyl Guard Plus - to get higher dose of active folate, active B12, active B6. (I take corticosteroids so need a higher dose of folate).

    The active forms are:
    B12 - methylcobalamin
    B6 - pyridoxal-5-phosphate (p5p)

    I’ve been on this for a few months, so hoping to do a follow up blood test this week to see if my levels have dropped.

    Unfortunately so much conflicting advice as MTHFR is still very new and factors don’t know much about it. But Dr Lynch’s explanation made sense to me so I’m giving it a try. But really important to do your own research and do what feels right for you.

    R

  13. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by jess03 View Post
    Hi Baby4BB
    thank you so much for your reply. Your information was great and very helpful. I’ve spoken to the clinic in Randwick and they were really helpful. And thanks so much for how much it costs and how often. You’re a gem

    im sorry you have the same as me with endo, adeno, MTHFR and immune issues. Can I ask if seeing Dr M (who I’ve heard heaps of good things anout) and having the intralipid infusion helped you?
    Hi Jess

    No problem at all. I've had so much benefit from these forums the least I can do is help out where I can.

    That said I am not sure if I can be much help though. I think seeing Dr M has helped me finally get a BFP but I miscarried at 7 weeks (with a PGS tested 5 day embryo).
    I have my doubts if intralipids did anything, I think it was more the Prednisone. But intralipids are part of Dr M's protocol and we will do them again for our next transfer.

    I may look at going to the Randwick clinic next round to try and save some money.

    Good luck and keep us posted with how you go!


 

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