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  1. #351
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    Quote Originally Posted by magicmashie View Post
    I thought the same. Hopefully this isn't been abused?
    I hope it isn't being abused also, as that would look bad on those of us that are actually educating our children. In NSW I think it wouldn't be very common for people to abuse the system simply based on great fact we are the hardest state to become registered to home educate our children.

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  3. #352
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild Rose View Post
    My understanding of unschooling came by watching it in action for 3 days and reading about it to truly understand it. My relatives are in Connecticut. I looked up the education guidelines for that state and read about it. I came across an article that they linked to where a home educator had explained the differences. This lady mentioned that parents who say they unschool yet ask their kids if they want to do educational things, are having their cake and eating it too. The article was written in 1999. Maybe unschoolers have now realised that they have to ask their children as the children weren't asking themselves. The ideas of unschooling may have changed hence you now asking your kids what they wish to learn that day.

    The author of the article starts off by quoting a line from the book, The Unschooling Handbook, which is
    "Unschooling means learning what one wants, when one wants, in the way one wants, for one's own reasons. ... choice and control reside with the learner ... She may find outside help in the form of parents, mentors, books, or formal lessons, but SHE is the one making the decisions about how best to proceed. Unschooling is trusting that your children are at least as clever and capable as you are yourself."

    Amongst other things the author then writes:-
    Partial Unschooling…Isn't
    Some parents think that you can have "partial unschooling" where the parent leads and teaches "a little." But you can't have your unschooling cake and eat it, too.
    Parent-initiated teaching contradicts the fundamental aspect of unschooling: that the child is in control leading and teaching herself. In unschooling parents may be available to answer questions, to provide materials, and to facilitate learning to match the child's interest, but parents don't teach the child according to what they think the child ought to learn. With unschooling the child decides what, when, and whether she wants to learn.
    Those who call themselves "partial unschoolers" are parents who, quite sensibly, cannot fully resign themselves to trust their children's supposed innate ability to completely direct their own education. These parents continue to pay lip service to unschooling, since they may not be following a rigidly defined curriculum and want to distinguish themselves from homeschoolers who follow a strict schedule and a "school-ish" curriculum. Instead, so-called "partial unschoolers" teach their children the subjects they think are essential, and still give them as much freedom to pursue their interests as is possible.

    http://www.mhea.com/features/unschool.htm
    I think you haven't actually understood this at all. Offering educational things isn't having your cake and eating it too. It is simply offering, no forcing but offering is okay. Like I said in another post, we are showing our children a love of learning, they have that behaviour modelled for them just like anything else they learn before they head off to school. I fully resign myself to trusting my children.

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  5. #353
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    And that really kind of skirts around what I've been wondering....

    if a child consistently saying they aren't interesting in learning anything, and just want to watch tv/play the play station and sleep all day, what is the response to that?
    I myself have never come across this with my children, oh except one whom is making a career out of it, so I am unable to truly reply to this comment. But if it did arise in my family I would obviously re-evaluate things.

  6. #354
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    Quote Originally Posted by BornToBe View Post
    Instead of hounding unschooling4 for personal information about her situation, I did a quick google and came up with the VIC registration requirements. http://www.vrqa.vic.gov.au/registrat...spx?Redirect=1
    http://www.education.vic.gov.au/scho...omeschool.aspx

    For those who keep saying things like, "only teachers know the answer to every single question a child asks the moment they ask it, and that is the only teachable moment". Are you serious? Do teachers really learn the answers to everything during their 4 year degree? Or do they learn how to seize that moment and harness the information from others sources, i.e. textbooks or perhaps even the internet. Any willing, informed parent with brains & skills can do that. Any engaged homeschooling parent can and will plan tomorrow's lesson/information/discussions and be ready to know as much as they can possibly find out, from the same resources that public school teachers use.This is not strictly the domain of those with a degree, and it's arrogant to think that it is.

    Yesterday during nature study/science, we went outdoors to study the Scarlet Robins whom are so active on our bush block at present. We discussed why they appear so present during the colder months, spotted both a male & female and searched around for a nest, while discussing what they use to build them. We went indoors and drew pictures of them. It was awesome. All that information came from online the night prior, and the idea for it from a pre-purchased curriculum. Of course, this was after an hour of maths and phonics, and before our 2 hour social visit at the local home school gymnastics class. We listened to our Spanish teaching CD in the car on the way there & back.

    Most unschoolers do exactly this kind of thing. Some don't. Most public school families enrich their children's lives equally. Some don't. That's life.

    Yeah, maybe school could provide that. Maybe it can't. But I know I'm grateful to have the option to learn alongside my child. You get one life and I sure won't regret these early years together.
    I hope you didn't take my post as me saying "only qualified teachers can do this" because even some of them suck at facilitating learning! I was more pointing out that Winter's experience would be a definite advantage - he certainly sounds like he takes his job as the facilitator of his child's learning as seriously as any career. I don't believe that the majority of parents would be able to do as good a job as he is (please note, I'm not saying the majority of homeschoolers, just referring to the general population of adults with children).

    I actually passionately wish that EVERY parent took their job as their child's first and most important educator as seriously as many homeschoolers do. Unfortunately, too many parents think they can leave ALL teaching to schools (including manners and courtesy!).

    I credit Reading Eggs as teaching DD her foundation reading skills (which I could then build on) and I also frequently Google concepts my knowledge is rusty on before teaching them. I have YouTube to thank for most of our successful bathroom renovation! We are so lucky to have these resources at our fingertip now if you know how to use them well.

    I can also see that, in the right environment, the curriculum could be covered in about 2-3 hours a day plus unstructured investigation time for topics like science, technology and visual art. I can teach DD a concept in 10 minutes that would require 30 for my class where I'm providing for a variety of learner types rather than just one.

    What I don't think is that home/un schooling is the best choice for the majority of families because the majority of parents would not have the skills (or commitment to build up their skills) required for such an important job.

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  8. #355
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    Default WWYD? Trouble settling into big school

    Quote Originally Posted by sparklebug View Post
    I think this is what it keeps coming back to pp's keep asking what happens in unschooling, but the answers are very vague, mostly.
    We all get its hands on, but being a mum is hands on, my kids at school but I wouldn't say I'm not hands on. I think we all love our kids and want a bright future for them, main****** school does not mean we are not interested in their wants, these are the things that get people riled up, because we're talking education it has nothing to do with 'if you love your child'
    You are articulating my thoughts so well. There are obviously some home/unschool parents in this thread that care very much about ensuring their children are educated and have the world at their fingertips. What I am struggling with with some comments regarding unschooling is what I asked earlier, how does an unschooler's day look any different from my weekend or preschool free afternoon or day? Ds1 goes to sports classes and music. We go to museums and the theatre. I read him books and do arts and crafts at home, build lego and train tracks and do puzzles with him. This week's theme at his preschool is dinosaurs, he will be learning about them at school with various different activities and I know I will expand on that at home, whether it be reading to him, going to the natural history museum, making one out of playdoh, etc. My thoughts are that he is getting various benefits that attending preschool provides him and then I am expanding off of that. But a child his age that is being 'unschooled' is only getting the parent/home bit.

    I don't doubt that some unschoolers, and definitely some home schooled children will go on to higher education, I grew up with quite a few kids that were homeschooled and a few have definitely gone on to graduate Uni. But these were kids who followed a curriculum and whose parents were held accountable for their education. What I'm struggling with, and maybe the state of Victoria is the only issue, is the lack of accountability these parents seem to have for their child's education. They can say they are doing certain things, but nobody is actually ensuring that happens. Surely most feel that's a worrying situation. Mains.tream isn't perfect, but at least it ensures *most* children have somebody on their side. If they are being neglected at home they have the opportunity for their teacher to notice to and inform authorities, or just show they care. If they have a **** teacher, they have parents to intervene, etc. if a child is being unschooled by a **** parent, who intervenes?
    Last edited by HollyGolightly81; 09-05-2017 at 18:47.

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  10. #356
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    Yes. The idea of homeschooled children slipping through the cracks so to speak, is a scary one. I think it is a bigger problem in the US, where many states have similar or lower standards than we do here in Victoria. I've read websites full of stories from adults who were homeschooled as children and are adamantly against it because their experiences involved strict isolation and the bible as their only school book. We need transparency so we can be sure children are not just being indoctrinated in a possibly damaging world view, with no "out".
    (Not saying Christianity is damaging or anything like that. Just that zealots of any kind are scary!)

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  12. #357
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    I loosely fit some of this discussion (main****** school, homeschool/distance school and special needs) so thought I would just join the conversation.

    I have a 7yo and 5yo in main****** school. The 5yo has autism.

    My 4yo is enrolled in distance preschool (School of the Air).

    My 3yo will be enrolling in that next year.

    I am lucky with my main******ers as it's a small school, perfectly suited to us. It has about 22 students between from (nsw) k-12. So my 7yo in grade 2 and my 5yo in kindy are actually in the same class. The classes are k-2, 3-6 and senior. The two primary classes often mix and do classes together too. Plus the seniors do a lot of stuff with the littlies. So I'm really comfortable with the amount of interaction my kids get with older kids (and how much they will have with younger kids when they are older). My eldest has a best friend in grade 1 and one in grade 4. Excursions are usually whole school excursions. The last camp, was an overnight and was open to all grades. So both my boys went, I chaperoned, and they were learning right alongside teenagers and preteens.

    They are a very practical school. Lots of play based learning. They have play sessions between periods. They do a lot of constructive play. They are also quite nature based. Look after the chooks, help garden. Lots of stuff like that.

    They are also shifting their focus more to "passion projects" and interest based learning. In fact, the principal and one of the teachers recently went away to visit another school that has already implemented this way of learning, so that they can better understand it and apply it to our students. The basic idea is if one child loves horses, her schooling is based around that. Her assignments will be horse based. Her maths will be horse based. She will write stories about horses for literacy. And each child will have the same.
    It's already started and it's fantastic seeing the kids do their presentations about things they love.

    I feel very lucky that my children are exposed to an education, away from me, that are as passionate about my kids as I am. Especially my son with autism.

    I'm not entirely sure my son would qualify for a supported class if we were at a bigger school. But he would need it. The teachers here have trouble keeping track of him sometimes. The likelihood of him leaving a 30+ student class without the teacher noticing, and him going missing for hours would be so incredibly high. He's almost made it out the gate here and there's only 8 kids in his class. So if we didn't have this school, we would maybe have to look into homeschooling. Purely for his safety. I don't have enough confidence in myself to do it long term though, so we would have to find a way to fight to get him back in a school. Safely.

    With my daughter, the 4yo, she is enrolled in school of the air for preschool. We don't have a local preschool so it was my only option. I have no issues with the content. I think myself quite intelligent usually. It's the teaching aspect I get caught up on. I struggle to find ways to explain things sometimes. Like when teaching her a new skill, I lack the ability to draw it back to basics. "I don't know, just pick it up and do it" isn't a great way to explain things, but sometimes that's all I can think of. The specifics of teaching is where I get caught.

    I do what I can, but I prefer to leave that kind of stuff to people who are, in my opinion, experts. Teachers. People who have specifically gone to school to learn to do those niggly bits that I simply cannot do. That's why I am glad my kids go to the school they do, and that I don't have to homeschool my son. I know I would be doing him a disservice. It might even end up with me hiring a governess to take over for me. Either way, it would have to be a very structured and rigid homeschool. Not like unschooling at all, I would say.

    That isn't to say we don't teach our kids. Actually, funnily enough, as I was setting the table for dinner, 7yo was talking to DH about what machines he wants to invent when he becomes an engineer (he hasn't decided what type so its very generalised). DH grabbed a curtain rod and a handful of other things and as soon as I heard the word fulcrum, I thought of this thread and had a chuckle to myself.

    We love engaging the kids. We go camping every second weekend when we go into town for shopping and my sons therapies. We talk about all sorts of things. We star gaze and talk about orientation. We talk about eco systems, animals, erosion and forestation. Anything we come across, we have great discussions about. We stay up late discussing all sorts of things.

    We also make sure, when we take longer trips, that we visit museums and stuff. We visit botanic gardens and historical sites. Before we go, we research stuff with the kids and they help us decide where they want to go. Mr7, at the moment, really wants to go to Maralinga, where the nuke testing was done. He watched heaps of videos (YouTube) about it with DH and he really took an interest.

    So now that I've gabbled on a bit, for no real reason, I'll cut it off now. I've just been following the conversation and thought I might chuck my 2c in.

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  14. #358
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    Quote Originally Posted by BornToBe View Post
    Yes. The idea of homeschooled children slipping through the cracks so to speak, is a scary one. I think it is a bigger problem in the US, where many states have similar or lower standards than we do here in Victoria. I've read websites full of stories from adults who were homeschooled as children and are adamantly against it because their experiences involved strict isolation and the bible as their only school book. We need transparency so we can be sure children are not just being indoctrinated in a possibly damaging world view, with no "out".
    (Not saying Christianity is damaging or anything like that. Just that zealots of any kind are scary!)
    Exactly! There was a family in my town that was incredibly religious and homeschooled and in a town of 300 people, I only saw their two daughters who were my age twice growing up! They kept them incredibly, incredibly isolated. They would have gotten married ASAP and never allowed to work. I understand not all homeschoolers are like this, but there needs to be some transparency and accountability so that children understand their opportunities and choices.

  15. #359
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahalfdozen View Post
    I loosely fit some of this discussion (main****** school, homeschool/distance school and special needs) so thought I would just join the conversation.

    I have a 7yo and 5yo in main****** school. The 5yo has autism.

    My 4yo is enrolled in distance preschool (School of the Air).

    My 3yo will be enrolling in that next year.

    I am lucky with my main******ers as it's a small school, perfectly suited to us. It has about 22 students between from (nsw) k-12. So my 7yo in grade 2 and my 5yo in kindy are actually in the same class. The classes are k-2, 3-6 and senior. The two primary classes often mix and do classes together too. Plus the seniors do a lot of stuff with the littlies. So I'm really comfortable with the amount of interaction my kids get with older kids (and how much they will have with younger kids when they are older). My eldest has a best friend in grade 1 and one in grade 4. Excursions are usually whole school excursions. The last camp, was an overnight and was open to all grades. So both my boys went, I chaperoned, and they were learning right alongside teenagers and preteens.

    They are a very practical school. Lots of play based learning. They have play sessions between periods. They do a lot of constructive play. They are also quite nature based. Look after the chooks, help garden. Lots of stuff like that.

    They are also shifting their focus more to "passion projects" and interest based learning. In fact, the principal and one of the teachers recently went away to visit another school that has already implemented this way of learning, so that they can better understand it and apply it to our students. The basic idea is if one child loves horses, her schooling is based around that. Her assignments will be horse based. Her maths will be horse based. She will write stories about horses for literacy. And each child will have the same.
    It's already started and it's fantastic seeing the kids do their presentations about things they love.

    I feel very lucky that my children are exposed to an education, away from me, that are as passionate about my kids as I am. Especially my son with autism.

    I'm not entirely sure my son would qualify for a supported class if we were at a bigger school. But he would need it. The teachers here have trouble keeping track of him sometimes. The likelihood of him leaving a 30+ student class without the teacher noticing, and him going missing for hours would be so incredibly high. He's almost made it out the gate here and there's only 8 kids in his class. So if we didn't have this school, we would maybe have to look into homeschooling. Purely for his safety. I don't have enough confidence in myself to do it long term though, so we would have to find a way to fight to get him back in a school. Safely.

    With my daughter, the 4yo, she is enrolled in school of the air for preschool. We don't have a local preschool so it was my only option. I have no issues with the content. I think myself quite intelligent usually. It's the teaching aspect I get caught up on. I struggle to find ways to explain things sometimes. Like when teaching her a new skill, I lack the ability to draw it back to basics. "I don't know, just pick it up and do it" isn't a great way to explain things, but sometimes that's all I can think of. The specifics of teaching is where I get caught.

    I do what I can, but I prefer to leave that kind of stuff to people who are, in my opinion, experts. Teachers. People who have specifically gone to school to learn to do those niggly bits that I simply cannot do. That's why I am glad my kids go to the school they do, and that I don't have to homeschool my son. I know I would be doing him a disservice. It might even end up with me hiring a governess to take over for me. Either way, it would have to be a very structured and rigid homeschool. Not like unschooling at all, I would say.

    That isn't to say we don't teach our kids. Actually, funnily enough, as I was setting the table for dinner, 7yo was talking to DH about what machines he wants to invent when he becomes an engineer (he hasn't decided what type so its very generalised). DH grabbed a curtain rod and a handful of other things and as soon as I heard the word fulcrum, I thought of this thread and had a chuckle to myself.

    We love engaging the kids. We go camping every second weekend when we go into town for shopping and my sons therapies. We talk about all sorts of things. We star gaze and talk about orientation. We talk about eco systems, animals, erosion and forestation. Anything we come across, we have great discussions about. We stay up late discussing all sorts of things.

    We also make sure, when we take longer trips, that we visit museums and stuff. We visit botanic gardens and historical sites. Before we go, we research stuff with the kids and they help us decide where they want to go. Mr7, at the moment, really wants to go to Maralinga, where the nuke testing was done. He watched heaps of videos (YouTube) about it with DH and he really took an interest.

    So now that I've gabbled on a bit, for no real reason, I'll cut it off now. I've just been following the conversation and thought I might chuck my 2c in.
    I actually thought of you and your thoughts on this thread when I read about what your daily routine is☺.

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