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  1. #121
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    Default Sonia Kruger - glass house?

    Quote Originally Posted by GingerKat View Post
    I know it's a bit of a competition to see who can be the most compassionate and most loving, but if you don't start opening your eyes to what the real issues are then we will be one very divided country.
    Wow! Do you really think that? Why would anyone bother pretending to be "compassionate" on an anonymous forum? I think the reason people are so vehemently disagreeing with you isn't to win a popularity contest, but to neutralise hateful and ignorant rhetoric, in the hopes that either (1) your opinion may change (unlikely, I know) and (2) that someone coming across this thread who doesn't have an opinion on the matter isn't swayed in the wrong direction. And I'm sorry but your direction is the wrong one.

    I can say with absolute certainty that every single Muslim person I know is a decent, hard working, kind and honest member of society. And I know quite a lot.

    Some of my closest family friends are Muslim. Most of my uni friends were Muslim and I still see 2 of them on a regular basis (they are Iraqi twins, one of them has just finished a post-grad degree in theology). The other twin started up a company that sells e-books and donates all the profits to charity.

    A lot of my clients are Muslim, they run very successful businesses, and they employ dozens of people.

    These people are contributing positively to society, which is more than I can say for many "Anglo-Saxon" Australians who abuse the social security system and choose to be long-term unemployed.

    I remember travelling in Turkey almost 10 years ago with my sister, and deciding on taking a side-trip to Italy on a whim because the weather was turning bad.. We spent 5 days in Rome and couldn't wait to get back to Turkey because the people there were so much nicer! And don't get me wrong, I love Italians!

    There needs to be some serious government spending on programs to make minority groups feel more included, and to make the rest of society more educated. I feel like the electoral shift toward people like Pauline Hanson is the result of lack of education.

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  3. #122
    harvs's Avatar
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    Default Sonia Kruger - glass house?

    @J37, I'm scared too. My fear has been getting exponentially worse since 9/11. I agree with you on that.

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  5. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by harvs View Post
    I thought Israel was responsible for/contributed to a lot of violence in Lebanon?

    I understand you have strong personal views from your experience, and I'm not devaluing that. I just don't think that it is *only* because of your parents' attitude after you moved that you were fortunate to escape to a better life. I also think it's because you moved to a more peaceful country. I just don't get the logic behind denying that chance to others, I suppose.
    Well if you consider that the war wouldn't have happened if Israel didn't exist, then yes, it does have a lot to do with Israel.

    But basically, since the Palestinians set up camp in Lebanon, there has been ongoing conflict. Hizbollah shoot rockets into northern Israel and the Israeli defence force retaliate.

    I think it's more correct to say that Israel is quite largely (but not entirely) responsible for the horror going on in the Palestinian Territories.

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  7. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by J37 View Post
    Not sure about you girls, but I am becoming increasingly scared. Not exactly terrorised, but getting close. In Nice, there were little kids "mown down" in their prams. I am still bloody traumatised by the images of 9/11, possibly the worst atrocity we shall ever see in our lifetime, enacted in the name of Allah.

    I was in a busy shopping centre on the Sunshine Coast recently, and a kid burst a balloon. The place went silent, and I swear my heart stopped. It sounded like a shot. I had my 2 young kids and my Grandma with me.

    People may say "If you are scared, the ISIS terrorists have won". Well then, they've won in my mind, because I am scared. I don't want to die, I don't want my kids to die, and I don't want to watch others die, in terrorist attacks. Whether the terrorist is a "true ISIS" member or a lone nut-job claiming to act on behalf of ISIS, is irrelevant to me. Killing is killing.

    I do think people are almost completely fed up with the ridiculous, over-the-top, political-correctness which effectively gags people from speaking their mind. I don't believe all Muslims are members of ISIS, obviously. That's insane. But I will say this...I would like A LOT more "decent Muslims" to be publicly OUTRAGED by what is being committed in the name of their religion. Evil triumphs when good men do nothing, etc...Well, I think it is VERY important that "good Muslims" express their disgust and outrage toward those Muslims who function on their religious hatred.

    Even in Australia, when you have Senior Muslims (I have forgotten the recent blokes' names) saying that homosexuals should be killed...Australia needs our decent Muslim population to be vocally and insistently bloody outraged. And this hasn't really happened. I don't think a few Muslims saying "It's not all of us, etc" is really good enough at this point.

    But getting offended by another member on Bub Hub is a bit silly. I never do. I might think "that person's a moron", but I try to keep that thought to myself!

    Sent from my SM-N910G using The Bub Hub mobile app
    Well said and I agree. Muslim leaders and Muslims in general should publicly denounce these acts of terror.

    That doesn't mean that Muslim immigration should stop.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JustJaq View Post
    Things to be afraid of... in context.

    Attachment 82695
    I'd be genuinely curious to see the breakdown of that number, and I am certainly not doubting you @JustJaq

    Does that include the Australians killed in the MH17 flight shot down, the Bali bombings, etc? It's not specific to ISIS-related terrorism?

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  9. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by witherwings View Post
    Well if you consider that the war wouldn't have happened if Israel didn't exist, then yes, it does have a lot to do with Israel.

    But basically, since the Palestinians set up camp in Lebanon, there has been ongoing conflict. Hizbollah shoot rockets into northern Israel and the Israeli defence force retaliate.

    I think it's more correct to say that Israel is quite largely (but not entirely) responsible for the horror going on in the Palestinian Territories.
    Oh absolutely! I was just pointing out that there was more than one source of violence for the sake of balance :-)

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  11. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by witherwings View Post
    Well said and I agree. Muslim leaders and Muslims in general should publicly denounce these acts of terror.

    That doesn't mean that Muslim immigration should stop.
    I agree; I can't see exactly how that would make a difference, and no-one has yet put forward a theory as to how it would?

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    I'm a couple of pages behind in reading this thread, but just came across this interesting article -

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/ent...w41zw0a5x9a4i=

    "In the U.S., most mass shootings are related to domestic violence. Last year, Everytown for Gun Safety examined five years’ worth of data on shootings in which at least four people were killed with a gun (a common definition of mass shootings), and found that in 57 percent of the attacks, the perpetrator targeted either a family member or an intimate partner.

    These acts of carnage, in general, do not make front-page news. They might not seem as scary to the public, because they don’t involve random targets or typically occur in public places. But it’s important to recognize that in these shootings, the victims are predominantly women and children."

    ...

    "This story is tragically familiar. In the past few years, many of the men who have committed heinous, unthinkable acts of violence against the public have had a history of abusing the women in their lives. Prior to unleashing their deranged violence onto the world, it appears they practiced it against the most vulnerable and accessible targets ― those living inside their homes. "

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  15. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by harvs View Post
    @J37, I'm scared too. My fear has been getting exponentially worse since 9/11. I agree with you on that.
    This is me too. I'm almost embarrassed to admit it.
    I know rationally and intellectually that there are many more things likely to do me harm in Australia:
    Car accident
    Family violence (poor harmless DH)
    Child birth
    But that doesn't stop me being afraid and anxious. And it doesn't stop me thinking about the lone wannabe terrorist psycho and the element of surprise about where they might be.
    Don't think for a second I don't realise how ridiculously loony I sound! I know it!
    I know I really have nothing to fear statistically but I am afraid. I was afraid when I was full of anxiety after DS was born and I was on mat leave eyes glued to the tv for the Lindt siege.
    And I was afraid when I was the last Caucasian living in my street. And I hate myself for that fear. Because I know I had no rational or logical reason for that fear.
    So I overcompensate. And I eat way too much Albanian food from the local take away and I learn their names and their kids names to prove just how accepting of diversity I am. All the while in the back of my head being grateful that I don't live in a city and the farm is a nice out of the way place!
    But I can still shake my head at SK because at least I know how irrational I am and at least hope I'm trying to work through that. And my fear.

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    Default Sonia Kruger - glass house?

    I must be either incredibly lucky or naive but I'm not scared in the slightest. I spent 8 years in Melbourne regularly visiting and spending hours each week in largely Muslim communities and never for one moment felt nervous. And this was after September 11.

    As for categorising that as the worst atrocity, I think there are many wars in Africa and deaths on a large scale where people might disagree. It may be one of the worst in the western world in recent history, but that's as high as I'd put it.

    I'm not daft. DH has a sabbatical in 2 years and we were looking at taking the kids to Europe for 2 months but now we'll stay in Australia.

    The world has been at war with itself in one form or another for generations. Now we have the Internet and social media it's more in our face.

    I genuinely don't believe we have more to fear.

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