Talk to me about your experiences with 'pee sticks', in particular FRERS. I have been searching online for answers but can't seem to find any so here's my question.
What level of hcg does your urine contain before it will show up on a FRER? I ask because my maths just doesn't add up with what happens. Allow me to explain 😊
Typically clinics say that your levels should be over 100 by day 16 and that they typically double every 48hrs so let's work off that.
16dpo - 100
14dpo - 50
12dpo - 25
10dpo - 12.5
8dpo - 6.25
Now I know first hand that FRERs show quite a nice line with a level of 6 because I had bloods on the same morning as this misleading beauty.
ImageUploadedByThe Bub Hub1461273077.220706.jpg
So if I am now 9dpo (4dp5dt with no type of support or booster) would I be getting a line like that if I was UTD? I don't understand how it all works.
I know people don't generally get lines this early so does that mean that when hcg kicks in its generally already quite high? If it's not then how does it get to 100 by day 16?
I have read about so many people getting false positives and having levels of even under 5 with FRERs lately so surely anyone who is really pregnant should be getting really early reading as their levels builds or does it not work like that?
As you can see I'm driving myself loopy and any wisdom would be appreciated!
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22-04-2016 06:16 #1
Wanted: Pee Stick Wisdom.
Last edited by TortoiseNotTheHare; 22-04-2016 at 07:22.
22-04-2016 07:54 #2
Some of my musings:
Hcg leaves blood before it leaves urine as that's how it's secreted out of the system, so it's possible your bloods were 6 but you still had, say 10+ leaving your urine.
False positives are very uncommon so personally I think if you've had a faint positive and it goes onto to be a negative it's one of the following:
- you were taking supplementary HCG for fertility treatment and it's just the remains of that or;
- you had a chemical pregnancy.
People say a line is a line but I tend to think a faint line is a bit iffy and what really counts is if it gets darker.
Also, with when people get positives, I think it would depend on your resting hcg as well as when your embryo implanted.
Normal women have resting hcg of 0-5. So if your resting hcg is 5, your levels theoretically will rise faster than if your resting hcg is 1.
Of course that's assuming they double every 48 hours which is not often the case in very early pregnancy as they usually start off doubling closer to 24-36 hours. When DP had her miscarriage, her hcg went from 1.8 at 10dpo to 12 at 12dpo. Way more than doubling. In early pregnancy it's necessary for levels to be high enough to keep AF away so biologically it makes sense for those with late implanters or generally lower hcg levels overall to have their hcg increase faster in the early days so the levels are high enough to promote progesterone production and stop AF showing it.
I'm sure others will disagree with me but I tend to think most pregnancies will show at least a faint positive by 12dpo. An embryo that implanted on day 6, in a woman with a higher resting hcg and that doubles every 24 hours could easily show up by day 9, or even day 8, however, while an embryo that doesn't implant until day 9 even with the same other factors might not show a positive until day 11 or 12.
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22-04-2016 08:05 #3
That makes sense... I've seen people getting positive as early as 8dpo or 9dpo but I've always wondered if they got their dates wrong with ovulation. It's impossible to have dates wrong with IVF though but yes does get thrown out depending on when the embryo implants.
It also makes sense that my blood hcg may have only been 6 but it may have been higher in my urine. I hadn't thought of it that way. I just didn't know if I should be expecting a line like that right now and what happens if I test tomorrow at 10dpo and don't get a line like I've had with bloods of 6 (that's really what I'm trying to work out lol).
It's so hard to know what shows on FRERs because I've seen others on the hub that have had a line and then very low bloods like mine so it makes me wonder how sensitive these tests are but yes the urine could have higher levels than blood I guess.
Keep the wisdom coming! I know there are plenty of POAS addicts out there 😊
22-04-2016 08:14 #4
Hi, I have no idea how they work for levels but I just wanted to say that I was getting positive results at 5DP 3DT & it ended up being a true positive (now have an almost 10month old dd) so it can happen.
Good luck, I hope those lines keep getting darker for you over the next few days
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22-04-2016 08:45 #5
I think it works out that if you have a positive HPT at 8 dpo, which would be probably between 6-12 hcg, then if it doubles roughly each 36 hours you would reach the 100 mark by 16 dpo. For every one of my pregnancies (4) I have had a positive pee stick on 8 dpo - morning. Yes there is definite room for error as home pinpointing of ovulation could be influenced by many factors, but it wouldn't be by too much for an experienced charter, maybe 24-48 hours at the most.
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22-04-2016 08:55 #6
Wanted: Pee Stick Wisdom.
Hmm I'm not sure if I should test tomorrow. I'll be at 10dpo (5dpdt) or if I should wait.
That's really what I'm trying to work out because if I should be at 100 for 16dpo then I should be at 50 for 14 dpo, 25 for 12dpo and 12.5 for 10dpo which might show on a FRER? Who knows?!
ETA - as its been said increase rates can be all over the place at this point so I might not be 12.5 tomorrow even if I was UTD because it might start lower and then shoot up.
22-04-2016 09:35 #7
I think the 48 hour doubling rate is more like the minimum they would like to see, and even then it’s so variable it’s a fairly loose guideline. In my experience, my levels have doubled much more quickly. With my current pregnancy, I started testing with FRERs at about 6dpo (2dp4dt) and I had stark white negatives until my first hinter of a squinter at 10dpo (6dp4dt). It was really faint with barely any colour at that point. Then only 4 days later at 14dpo (10dp4dt) my hcg was 271. Going by the 48 hour doubling rule, I should have been getting positives on a FRER at 4po (i.e. day of transfer!) which clearly would have been impossible!
22-04-2016 09:47 #8
22-04-2016 10:04 #9
Oh I totally get that! This business really messes with your head, hey. Going by my experiences, and from everything else I have read, I wouldn't place too much importance on any result before 10dpo. It's just so incredibly variable that any bfn before that point would not be all that reliable. I believe most true bfps would show up sometime between 10dpo and 14dpo (of course there are always exceptions, but I'm talking most cases). Good luck for the next few days - fingers crossed for a lovely line for you
22-04-2016 10:19 #10
I only used FRER when TTC as I found them good for sensitivity and being able to see darkening over a few days.
I had a 5dt and got a positive at 5dpt. It was a squinter, but definitely there.
My levels at 18dpo were 2000, so I don't think you can neccesarily take the values and halve them down to get a figure on urinary hcg for 10dpo, if you know what I mean. Basically, you can get a positive at 10dpo is what I'm saying (sleep deprived and having trouble with words).
I got positives at 10dpo with all my pregnancies regardless of the outcome. My chem looked just like the other two pregnancies at 10dpo, the difference was it never got any darker. Good luck with whatever you decide- update us!
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