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  1. #1
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    Default To transfer two embies or not!

    Hi girls

    just doing some research and getting info and wanted to see if anyone has any ideas, opinions etc.

    my DH and I have just had our second BFN with IVF and we have 7 two day old embies left. We will only do IVF this year, and after our next transfer we will take a break for a few months. If it doesn't work out this year we will hop off the baby trying rollercoaster. Hopefully it won't come to that!!

    we need to make up our mind if we transfer 1 or 2 embies for our next transfer. I'm 37.5 so not getting any younger. Our clinic will transfer two at 38 but will make an exception for us so long as we sign a waiver form. I know the chance of twins is increased if your embies are 5 days old but ours are only 2 days old.

    what would you do, one or two? Appreciate any thoughts!!

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    Two embies. Reasons -

    1. twins are less likely the older you are.
    2. twins have less complications the older you are. (I know, wierd!).
    3. This strategy also makes getting UTD cheaper, and faster, because although the successful numbers for SET vs DET are roughly equal that is CUMULATIVE for SET. Per cycle, you're more likely to achieve a take home baby with DET.
    4. They are 2 day old embryos, not blasts
    5. You will be almost 38 at the time of transfer, the rate of genetically competent embryos (embryos capable of making babies) at 37/38 is roughly 50%. So the likelihood is that one would be abnormal and not implant, which is why older mummies have less twins overall.

    I like to transfer the good ones fresh because of the chance of them not thawing properly if I elect for a frozen later.
    This is just my personal preference though, based on losing a good blast to a thaw. I think the successful defrost rate is 80%.

    Of course if you couldn't possibly manage twins and have the time/inclination/cash, stick to your guns and go for one.

    I hope this helps, and really hope you have a bubba in your arms soon!!! X
    Last edited by Butterfly39; 21-05-2014 at 18:42.

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  4. #3
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    Two, for the reasons above.

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    Two definitely. If they were 5 day embryos I would consider 1, but you're wasting your time transferring 1 when they are at day 2 stage.

    I had 25 eggs collected for my sister. At day 2 we had 17 embryos. We went to day 5 and ended up with 5. She transferred 2 and got BFN, transferred 1 and got a chemical pregnancy. She would have been transferring what are clearly duds for over a year if she did single transfers at day 2.

    What clinic are you at? I didn't think many people did day 2 anymore. I would consider moving to a bigger clinic that does day 5. No offence but at 37 you need to be going to the best if the best and not wasting anytime.

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    Can you ask them to thaw all, grow to day 5, see how many make it? Then you could make a decision about one or two with a little more information about the embryos. If there are still multiple on day 5 you can re freeze. I know a lot of people doing this if they have multiple frozen day 2 embryos. You would be doing it as a selection tool not expecting all to make it to day 5.

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    I would do 2

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    I don't know anything about day 2 embies but just a thought...i was 39, we transferred two, one split into identical twins and the other progressed but didn't make it. So we very nearly had triplets. Anything is absolutely possible so don't assume it won't happen. Make a good decision based on coping with multiples just in case.

    By the way....twins have been awesome

    Sent from my GT-S7500T using The Bub Hub mobile app

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    Thanks girls , you helped us make up our mind! We will go with two.

    i rang the clinic and said we will and the nurse told us that our FS said he would advise against it being so early in the IVF game, I reminded the nurse that he had been okay with it a few weeks ago when I told him we are only doing IVF this year, so only a few transfers left...she was pretty snarky at me and said "well read the information and the buck stops with you"...sheesh !

    As as for wondering about why they do 2 day embies, I asked the same and then did some reaserch. It seems it's pretty inconclusive about when it is best to have an emby back in the uterus , lots of mixed evidence to suggest that it's best not to grow out to 5 day...I did ask for them to do blasts early back but was advised against it...but yeah, no choice of clinics with where we live . The very cynical part of me wonders if it's a money making spin on their half! But then, he does have good success rates.

    so double it is And that will basically mean only 3 more transfers...4 if all make it to thaw, before it's all over red rover. Hopefully one of em makes it!

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    I agree that the evidence is inconclusive about benefits regarding early vs late transfer. There is a suggestion that the embryos are more likely to become babies if they are returned to the embryo sooner, and that it may favour their development as the uterine environment is so much better than we can in the lab reproduce. Whats more important prognostically speaking is what the embryos actually look like comparatively at that earlier stage (polar bodies, fragmentation, cell number etc). What we do know from CGH anyway is that even the most perfect looking blast can still be incompetent anyhow. It appears that whichever way you look at it, its still a bit of a craps shoot. Definitely inconclusive at this point but its sure interesting to read about. Google scholar is your friend!

    Good luck in your quest for the golden egg! Oh, and don't be railroaded by nursing staff, just return the signed paperwork. Sometimes you have to push. (No offence to any lovely nurses here). Wow a reduced number of transfers really is going to cut down your ivf dollars spent not to mention the general disruption to your life. You can use the saved $ to go on a holiday if it doesnt work out or decorate the babies room with it instead if it does. You have plenty of great options. Again, all the very best, Blossom X
    Last edited by Butterfly39; 22-05-2014 at 09:40.

  11. #10
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    @Butterfly39 ahh google scholar is my friend too. And you got it, we are already making loose travel plans to Nepal in December - that will be our journey should our baby not come along. Some may some pessimistic but for me it just keeps things real as IVF is such a hit n miss game! All the very best to you too! X


 

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