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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by kw123 View Post
    I disagree. The article is how being a mum is the most important job. Not being a SAHM. Unless working parents somehow don't qualify?

    Not saying that's what you meant though. Just how it could be interpreted.
    The author wrote
    There is also a curious sliding scale to the argument. "Working career mums" are at the lower end of the spectrum, and stay at home mothers are at the highest echelons, with ascending increments for each child you have. The more hours of drudgery you endure the more of a mother you are and, therefore, the more important your job is. The more you outsource domestic labour and childcare to participate in the workforce, the less of a mother you are.

    This is encouraging the divide between SAHP and working parents. I do not know any SAHP IRL who actually thinks this bull twaddle, nor do I know any working parent IRL who believes the same. But this is the same manure that gets spread regularly to attempt to create this divide.



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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by trustno1 View Post
    The author wrote
    There is also a curious sliding scale to the argument. "Working career mums" are at the lower end of the spectrum, and stay at home mothers are at the highest echelons, with ascending increments for each child you have. The more hours of drudgery you endure the more of a mother you are and, therefore, the more important your job is. The more you outsource domestic labour and childcare to participate in the workforce, the less of a mother you are.
    I've actually found it to be the opposite of what she says. Working mums are high five'ed for being 'productive', 'driven', 'good role models' while SAHM's are told they don't contribute, are bad role models to their kids and do nothing all day. You only have to read this forum to see the latter.

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  5. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    I've actually found it to be the opposite of what she says. Working mums are high five'ed for being 'productive', 'driven', 'good role models' while SAHM's are told they don't contribute, are bad role models to their kids and do nothing all day. You only have to read this forum to see the latter.
    Exactly!

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  6. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by kw123 View Post
    I agree with this although this is only my experience in BH not irl. Probably because there are so many more SAHMs on here than I know irl!

    You rarely see comments from working parents about how they choose to work for reasons OTHER than financial, and I think it's because they feel they would get shot down. Examples being I want to be a good role model and believe that to be in work is better than to be out of work, I don't want to be solely dependant on another, I don't want years out of the workforce because I will probably struggle to have a meaningful career, I don't think a child needs to be or should be with a parent 24/7, I want to contribute to a wider society outside of my own family unit, etc.

    I am NOT saying that any of the reasons above are more valid than another parents reasons to stay home, not would they even apply to lots of people, but they are true and valid for many. It's just that it's a minority group on the Hub. Which is fine.

    SAHPs are somewhat revered on here, I feel. But it is a parenting website after all!
    I think it's about perspective. I'm a SAHM and feel anything but revered, on here or anywhere (except for when I'm around MIL and grandMIL. They think the sun shines because I quit my job to be a SAHM). I mostly feel a bit tiny as a SAHM and have even had my own father comment on how I need to stay in contact with the working world because I'll regret it when I have to get another job when the kids start school and I don't have anything to show for the 5-6 year gap. Um, thanks.

    I'm not fan of Catherine Deviney, but I have to say, this passage is spot on IMO "...if you're using "motherhood" to assert that you care more about humanity than the next person, if you're using it as a shorthand to imply that you are a more compassionate and hard-working person than the women and men standing around you, then feel free to get over yourself."

    I think parenting is the most important task a person can undertake. Without parents, without good, loving parents who try their hardest and do the best for their families, we wouldn't have people to do the most important or difficult jobs in the world (neurosurgeons, cardiologists, teachers, emergency service workers etc). But then who am I to say that these jobs are the most important? Without the guy that works at the petrol station or the girl that packs shelves at Coles or farmers who provide crops - without them we wouldn't be able to live our lives as we know it in this country.

    I don't see parenting as a job. I've had a job. I got awesome pay, sick leave and had a huge amount of respect because I was good at what I did. That sure as sh1t ain't the case now. In fact, I don't even get performance reviews and won't know the outcome of my current project until at least another 15 years or so :-0 Parenting is to me, another phase of my life. It's no more a job than being a school student was a job or going through adolescence was a job.

    I have to say, I am sick of motherhood being in the limelight all the time. It's tiresome and tedious. There are mostly awesome, underrated fathers out there who don't even get a look in when it comes to parenting kudos. Similarly they also escape the bashing that happens all too often in the media and IRL. Let's focus on parenting rather than mothering, unless we're on the topics of BFing and the actual physical birthing process.

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  8. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    <font size="3"><span style="font-family: times new roman">The word bitter comes to mind. And I do think it was a stab (yet again) at SAHM's since she talks several times about unpaid labour of child raising and &quot;<font color="#333333"> It only encourages mothers to stay socially and financially hobbled&quot;. Clearly directed at those at home.

    The article doesn't surprise me in the least. </font></span></font>
    Yes in hindsight I do agree it was mainly aimed at SAHMs.

  9. #36
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    I'm a fan of Catherine Deveny. I appreciate her bluntness.

    Basically the article is expanding on the idea that, ''Motherhood is not a 'job', it is a 'relationship'''

    And I think she makes some interesting points.

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  11. #37
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    For those who can't click the link:

    'I never hear that being a father is the most important job in the world'. Photograph: Alamy


    Being a mother is not the most important job in the world. There, I said it. Nor is it the toughest job, despite what the 92% of people polled in Parents Magazine reckon.

    For any woman who uses that line, consider this: if this is meant to exalt motherhood, then why is the line always used to sell toilet cleaner? And if being a mother is that important, why aren’t all the highly paid men with stellar careers not devoting their lives to raising children? After all, I never hear "being a father is the most important job in the world".

    The deification of mothers not only delegitimises the relationship fathers, neighbours, friends, grandparents, teachers and carers have with children, it also diminishes the immense worth and value of these relationships. How do gay dads feel about this line, I wonder? Or the single dads, stepdads or granddads? No matter how devoted and hard working you are, fellas, you’ll always be second best.

    I’m also confused as to what makes you a mother. Is it the actual birth? Or is a "mother" simply a term to describe an expectation to care for children without payment? Is this empty slogan used to compensate women for gouging holes from potential careers by spending years out of the workplace without recognition?

    Enabling this dogma devalues the unpaid labor of rearing children as much as it strategically devalues women’s worth at work. If being a mother were a job there’d be a selection process, pay, holidays, a superior to report to, performance assessments, Friday drinks, and you could resign from your job and get another one because you didn’t like the people you were working with. It’s not a vocation either – being a mother is a relationship.

    Even if it were a job, there is no way being a professional mother could be the hardest when compared to working 16 hours a day in a clothing factory in Bangladesh, making bricks in an Indian kiln, or being a Chinese miner. Nor could it ever be considered the most important job in comparison with a surgeon who saves lives, anyone running a nation, or a judge deciding on people’s destiny.

    There is also a curious sliding scale to the argument. "Working career mums" are at the lower end of the spectrum, and stay at home mothers are at the highest echelons, with ascending increments for each child you have. The more hours of drudgery you endure the more of a mother you are and, therefore, the more important your job is. The more you outsource domestic labour and childcare to participate in the workforce, the less of a mother you are.

    It really is time to drop the slogan. It only encourages mothers to stay socially and financially hobbled, it alienates fathers, discourages other significant relationships between children and adults and allows men to continue to enjoy the privileges associated with heteronormative roles in nuclear families (despite men sucked into this having their choices limited as well).

    It’s fine to use "motherhood" as a credential if you're talking about something related to actual motherhood, like vaginal tearing during birth or breastfeeding (despite not all mothers experiencing either). But if you're using "motherhood" to assert that you care more about humanity than the next person, if you're using it as a shorthand to imply that you are a more compassionate and hard-working person than the women and men standing around you, then feel free to get over yourself.

  12. #38
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    And I want to add I don't think either is better. I don't think I'm a better mum for being at home. Each has it's benefits and difficulties. I'm in pain with my back atm dosed up on forte, so I'm maybe a bit tetchy lol

    Live and let live. Working mums are fab, SAHM's are fab. Dads are fab too. I have a wonderful husband who is active with his kids so he deserves a high 5 too. I just take issue with these sort of articles.

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  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by FiveInTheBed View Post
    Basically the article is expanding on the idea that, ''Motherhood is not a 'job', it is a 'relationship'''

    And I think she makes some interesting points.
    I actually agree with that to some degree. I chose to have my kids, we want another. But the truth is, there is a lot of work involved with being a parent. And not just the direct tasks of making lunch for them, bfing, changing their nappy. But the mountain of washing, the P&C meetings at school, helping with homework.

    I would agree parenting is a relationship, but caring for them is a job. A hard one sometimes, and that's the case no matter your employment status.

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  16. #40
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    Live and let live. Working mums are fab, SAHM's are fab. Dads are fab too. I have a wonderful husband who is active with his kids so he deserves a high 5 too. I just take issue with these sort of articles.[/QUOTE]

    I think that was my point, that I have an issue with these articles. There doesn't need to be any judgement we should be supportive


 

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