So I was sent this article today and needless to say I'm shocked and disgusted! I actually feel like vomiting.
Before clicking on this link please e aware this is with regard to Paedophilia
Am I reading this right?
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31-10-2013 14:14 #1
***TRIGGER WARNING*** anyone heard of this?
31-10-2013 15:09 #2
I find that VERY disturbing. I didn't read the entire article. But I wonder if society & the medical profession adopts the attitude that it is a sexual orientation, does that set us on the path of believing it to be acceptable?
I sincerely hope this is a joke, and simply cannot see how it could be considered anything other than a mental disorder, and even that as far as i'm concerned, is pushing it.
31-10-2013 15:39 #3
I honestly don't see the issue. Well actually, I take the point that language is powerful... this makes it sound more acceptable.
I don't think there's anything WRONG with what they've done though. In all likelihood there are pedophiles who target children because it gives them a sense of power, because it seems easier to get away with, and a host of other reasons.
There are people though who genuinely have a sexual preference for children. People who have no more CHOSEN to be attracted to children than I have chosen to be attracted to my partner, than a gay man has chosen to be attracted to men etc.
Now, this in no way justifies acting on those attractions, of course it doesn't. A child doesn't have the ability to give informed consent and so sexual activity with children can't, under any circumstances, be accepted.
What this change in definition does do though, is acknowledge that noone chooses their sexual orientation consciously. I would hope that this also would assist those with an attraction to children to go and seek help, rather than hiding it/fighting it on their own.
Imagine being a straight woman (given that the majority of bubhub users probably are). You're attracted to men, but (for whatever reason) it's illegal and immoral to have any kind of sexual contact with them. On top of that, porn etc. (including hand-drawn) of men is also illegal and immoral. You have no legal or moral way of fulfilling your sexual desires, but if you try to seek help then you're also going to be ostracized and thought of as a despicable human being who should be locked up for the rest of your life.
31-10-2013 15:44 #4Senior Member
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There are no words.....
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31-10-2013 15:49 #5
Wtf! I was molested as a child and this is not cool by me.
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31-10-2013 15:58 #6
Homosexuality between consenting adults is nothing like pedophilia though. If it's a homosexual act with a child then it's statutory rape just like it would be for a straight couple.
I do wonder if this is an attempt to remove it as a mental illness and thus perps can't use it as a defence? if not then it's just wrong.
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31-10-2013 16:06 #7
Yeah, look, I'm with Renn on this one.
Whilst language is a powerful tool and we do need to be careful with how we use it, ultimately, naming something as a 'sexual orientation' is taking away the notion that someone consciously chooses the person type that they are attracted to.
I in no way defend the act of paedophilia, not at all, but we, as a society, have to acknowledge the fact that there are people out there who feel a genuine attraction towards those much younger than themselves, and yes, sometimes they are children. We also have to acknowledge that there are also people who there who do not act on their attractions and that they want help, they don't want to feel the way that they do. But with such a (rightly so) stigma surrounding paedophilia it makes it hard for those to seek out help. They are labelled as creeps, sick, they should rot in gaol, which is an attitude that is not at all helpful to those who do not act on their feelings and instead (want to) seek help.
I also think it is important to note, that just because this change has been made, does not mean that those who do act on their feelings, are not going to be prosecuted to the full extend of the law, for whatever that is worth, as sadly we all know that the law punishment is very lacking in a myriad of areas.
Hopefully, with the kind of change, practitioners will be more open and willing to work with those people who do want help and those will be more willing to seek out the help that they need.
I do not, ever, see paedophilia being accepted in our society, at any stage. We are far too protective of our children and their rights.
What Delirium has said is also very true, removing it as a 'mental illness' reduces the likelihood that mental illness can be used as a defence in a criminal setting, but then, it could also now be argued that 'they couldn't help it, that it's biologically wired into them'. So I guess in the end, the point is moot.
Last edited by Lillynix; 31-10-2013 at 16:08.
31-10-2013 16:19 #8
I can see how this would upset some people but on closer inspection, to me this is an issue about words and money.
The DSM-V is a manual issued by the American Psychiatric Association for use in America and is utilised by the health profession as well as the insurance industry. So if you've been diagnosed with a disorder, it depends on how it's classified in the DSM that determines whether you can get insurance for it and how extensive the treatment will/could/might be.
The article is incorrect in stating that paedophilia is being 'rediagnosed' as a sexual orientation. It's not really. There's a differentiation being made between paedophilia and paedophilic disorder to correlate with the information published in the DSM-IV. This is to keep in line with classifications made by insurers. Over in the States, this is a huge thing.
I found a fact sheet here to explain further what is being done. You will also see that there have been a number of changes concerning other illnesses such as Autism and Bipolar.
What concerns me more is the way certain elements of society have embraced paedophilia but call it something else. In the American Gay Pride march the Man-Boy Love group was very vocal about marching and being included in the community although many in that community drew the line in their own moral compasses as to what they felt was an inappropriate reflection of both the gay community and what they felt was or wasn't a sexual orientation.
As a last thing if I may is to add that I don't agree with Renn in the justification for the claim that paedophilia is a sexual orientation, that people don't choose to want to have sex with kids consciously. That's like saying people choose to have Bipolar or Autism so they're orientations not disorders. Or saying, as the Catholic Church does, that being gay isn't a sin per se, only if you remain celibate. To me, that's just a washing of hands (to use a religious metaphor! lol)
There are strict criteria for diagnosing and paedophilia does remain in the realm of disorders, particularly in Australia and rightly so.
31-10-2013 17:05 #9
I guess the thing is that language depends on social context. What's considered a disorder and what's considered normal variation depends on our society. There's not one inherently "normal" way to think/feel/behave, with all else being inherently abnormal. There's a wide range in the way that human brains adapt and respond to situations. The fact that a particular mental condition causes problems for a person doesn't necessarily mean that there's something WRONG with their brain, but that it differs significantly from the "average". So the way that someone's brain is structured doesn't adhere with what's required or expected in their society, and hence causes problems.
So in theory, for example, a society could be structured such that Aspergers would be the norm and not problematic... hence it wouldn't be a disorder.
31-10-2013 22:00 #10
So when these people have to fill out forms that indicate their sexual persuasion will it now say
(I realize not many forms ask this but I'm trying to make a point)
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