On the broader question, religious circumcision involves an irreconcilable clash of rights: the right of parents to practice their religion versus the right of children to bodily integrity. We resolve this contradiction differently for boys and girls. That's not rational but it's the way it is, and likely to remain for the foreseeable future.
On the religious basis of female circumcision: this is found in the haddith not the Quran, which does not even mention male circumcision. The fact is that genital cutting is a tribal tradition of Western Semitic peoples predating the Abrahamic religions and its real origins have nothing to do with God's will or immortal souls.
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12-03-2013 07:34 #81
12-03-2013 08:00 #82
I agree I have been following this topic for a while and don't find it attacking anyone. Pretty tame considering when it started I thought "whoa this one is going to get interesting"
I am not pro or against. I didn't do Ds as i didn't see the point and really didn't want to cause any pain to my bub unless it was really required. I figured if he had problems with infections or anything we can look at it when he is older.
I think this is a terrible tragedy and I don't believe anyone is saying anything the parents aren't saying to themselves.
I hope if anything this may open eyes to doctors and parents to test for anything that may make a circ riskier before going ahead with the procedure.
I don't believe in exploiting a families grief to suit you agenda but I do think things need to be questioned instead of just accepting "oh it's religion lets not go there" I agree photos are over the top - it should have been kept anonymous.
12-03-2013 08:02 #83
In regard to female circ'ing - I've yet to find the exact part of the section of Koran that mentions this. I have watched a You Tube clip of an Iman saying that the Koran only sanction a tiny cut of the clitorous, nothing more. However, there are many Imans who do support FGM from it's least intrusive forms right up to the most intrusive forms. My understanding is that whilst the Koran or the Haddith don't explicitly require female circ, they do insist that a woman is a virgin for her husband and circ'ing a female is used as proof of virginity. Other forms are used as a measure of trying to suppress a female's sexual urges to ensure she stays faithful to her husband. Female circ'ing is not exclusive to Muslims though, it pre-dates Islam and is undertaken by some Christian Africans as well. When a religion is formed it will take some cultural practices and formalise them or make them holey, which is what I believe has been the case with FGM.
Importantly, NOT all Muslims carry out, condone or approve of female circ'ing/FGM.
12-03-2013 08:26 #84
Last edited by lambjam; 12-03-2013 at 08:40.
12-03-2013 11:00 #85
And one can hardly cede this "right" to Jews and deny it to the more numerous Muslim community. So we are stuck with religious circumcision of male children, and it is likely they will form the majority of procedures by the end of the decade as secular circumcision continues to wither away.
12-03-2013 11:05 #86
I don't recall suggesting we take away the right for Jews to circumcise. Just debating the notion that all religious customs are beyond criticism and inherently deserve respect.
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