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    Default People's opions on the Infanrix - Hexa Vaccine

    Hi All,

    New here, after some information from other parents, particularly regarding the infanrix-Hexa vaccine used for the 2 month schedule. I am worried about a couple of things regarding the vaccine, my number one concern is the amount of Aluminum in it, I have found, but not sure, that it contains the following concentrations:

    0.5 mg Aluminum Hydroxide content

    0.32 mg Aluminum Phosphate content

    0.82 mg total

    Would this be correct? or this the amount of aluminum element only? I have read the "Vaccine Book" by Dr Bob Sears and he recommended "Daptacel" which is not available in Australia but has an Aluminum only content of 0.33 mg but a 1.5 mg Aluminium Phosphate content in total. Which makes me a little confused does the 0.82 mg for the Infanrix be for the Aluminium only or is it combined with the Hydroxide and Phosphate, which if is the case, the total Aluminium element content would than be lower then the "Daptacel" brand? Really looking for a pharmacist or a really researched individual for an answer.

    Thank you

  2. #2
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    Can I ask why you are concerned particularly about aluminium? We natural ingest 10-15mg daily, that is far more that what is contained in those vaxxes.

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    Hi beebs,

    Thanks for the reply. here is why I am concerned about aluminum:

    With regards to indigestion of aluminum compared to injection of aluminum there is a research paper "Aluminum toxicokinetics regarding infant diet and vaccinations" http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12184359 which shows the aluminum content from indigestion to be less then 0.1 mg while injections reach over 1 mg.

    Please also see the World Health Organization (WHO) research http://www.inchem.org/documents/ehc/ehc/ehc194.htm section 5.3.6. Aluminum uptake, shows that aluminum is absorbed in the body at less then 1 percent from the various research articles.

    With regards to why I think Aluminum is a neuro toxin, please again refer to (WHO) http://www.inchem.org/documents/ehc/ehc/ehc194.htm section 7.6 Neurotoxicity and section 7.3 Reproductive and development toxicity.

    I am also very concerned about the latest research findings "Aluminum hydroxide injections lead to motor deficits and motor neuron degeneration" http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19740540 and "Do aluminum vaccine adjuvants contribute to the rising prevalence of autism?" http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22099159.

    The other reason why I ask about the Aluminum Hydroxide and Aluminum Phosphate question too, is also they seem to act differently when injected in the tissue, please see research paper "Elimination of aluminum adjuvants" http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12184363, the aluminium hydroxide realeases most of the aluminium into the body in the first couple of days from the souronding tissue muscle where the phospapte takes over a month to relaease aluminium content. However the aluminium retention content in the brain after 28 days, was still the same amount whether for aluminium hydroxide or aluminium phospahe. This was using Rabbits not humans for the study, but it would suggest to me that it would be better to get a vaccine with the total lowest aluminium content if at all possible.


    Anyway, I still think vaccinations are important, I will still be vaccinating my child, but I would really like to do it in a way that is safest as possible, just looking to try and get around minimizing the aluminum side of things if at all possible, any thoughts?

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    Quote Originally Posted by beebs View Post
    Can I ask why you are concerned particularly about aluminium? We natural ingest 10-15mg daily, that is far more that what is contained in those vaxxes.
    Just because you ingest something doesbt mean it is absorbed

    When you inject something then there is usually a much higher percentage is absorbed.

    Subbing!

    Sent from my GT-I9100T using BubHub

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    Wow! Looks like you've really done your research. I doubt many people on this forum would have looked into it in that much depth - I know I didn't. Very impressed!

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    Interesting articles. I see one group in Canada I think? Did a few studies. I couldn't see the full studies but I would be interested to know their sample sizes and other intricacies of the study. I suspect that if the studies showing a link between aluminium and autism were large and well performed that they would have made it to a much bigger paper than the journal of inorganic chemistry.
    And interestingly, the study that looked at blood concentrations of al after vaccination, showed that although the levels of al after vaccination were (temporarily) elevated above the norm, they still remained below the level that it becomes risky.

    Sorry OP, I have no answer to your question, but I just wanted to make a few points on those articles before people skim read them and decide vaccinations are the devil. It is easy in an abstract (which is what you have quoted) to make your study seem really wonderful, but you need to read the entire article to see if it is credible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wrena View Post
    Wow! Looks like you've really done your research. I doubt many people on this forum would have looked into it in that much depth - I know I didn't. Very impressed!
    It's not too hard to go on pubmed and search for 'vaccination and aluminum and risk'. But I've got a science background so maybe that's why I think it's easy.

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    SpecialK  (16-04-2014)

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    Thanks for the replys so far.

    Have thought about the overseas travel, but would seem to me that you could capture a disease on the plane due to the closeness and recycled air.

    Have thought about the TGA and special access scheme too, have conducted them and they said that the product might not be approved as there is a comparative product already available in Australia. The cold chain worries me a bit too, you can buy tracking goods to place inside the vaccine container to monitor the temperature to make sure it stays cool. But there is no guarantee that the goods were probably handled before they went in the container and that no dangerous stuff such as radiation came near the vaccines, which would make them useless or even dangerous.

    Hi 4underfour, thanks the feedback, I have the full journals if you would like to have a look, I don’t know how to send to you privately, please let me know, its always good to get options with someone with a science degree. With regard to the blood concentrations of aluminium the ATSDR (Agency for Toxic Substances and Disease Registry) had set a MRL (minimal Risk Level) level of about 0.7 (Fig 1) Aluminium for the first 2 months injection from page 4 of the journal if your baby is in the 50 percentile range. The data on the chart indicates the aluminium in the 2 month injection goes over this amount and tops out at 1.0 before coming back smoothing out.

    The paper indicates that the MRL is arrived as the following “ATSDR reviewed a large body of literature and concluded that neurotoxicity is the most sensitive health end point for ingested aluminium compounds. The agency used this end point in developing an oral MRL, or dose which is expected to be safe for human exposure. The basis was an intermediate-duration study in which
    mice were fed a diet containing aluminium lactate. They experienced spontaneous motor activity interference with a no-observed-adverse-effect level (NOAEL) of 62 mg Al/kg per day [31]. Applying uncertainty factors of 3 for extrapolation to humans and 10 for human variability produced an MRL of 2mg Al/kg per day.”

    The paper sited the following works for the animal study to determine the MRL figure “Golub MS, Donald JM, Gershwin ME, Keen CL. Effects of aluminium ingestion on spontaneous motor activity of mice. Neurotoxicol Teratol 1989;11:231–5.

    Does worry me a little that the MRL rating is determined by feeding “not injecting” mice with Aluminium then deciding to multiple by 30 to get a MRL figure that still is being passed by the first 2 months baby aluminium injection. I guess the question needs to be asked is any amount of injected aluminium is good for you?

    But coming back on topic, has anyone looked at this before and found away around it? There does not seem to be many options in Australia, either you have the injection or you don’t. I will still be getting it, but not too keen on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4underfour View Post
    It's not too hard to go on pubmed and search for 'vaccination and aluminum and risk'. But I've got a science background so maybe that's why I think it's easy.
    I also have a background in science and a PhD, although in natural sciences rather than immunology or toxicology I wasn't suggesting that it's hard to find the info, merely that it shows a real dedication to make the effort. I know for myself, I merely read more general papers about the overwhelming scientific consensus regarding the safety and efficacy of vaccines. It impresses me when someone makes the effort to really get into the detail to make an informed decision for their child and when they go back the actual research papers rather than reading opinion pieces that may skew the data any which way depending on their bias.

    Isn't having a research background so helpful when it comes to informing your parenting choices. I love knowing where to look to get the most up-to-date and comprehensive info and the skills to critically evaluate.

    Hope you can find a solution that you feel comfortable with, OP

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    Quote Originally Posted by Parent123 View Post
    Hi All,

    New here, after some information from other parents, particularly regarding the infanrix-Hexa vaccine used for the 2 month schedule. I am worried about a couple of things regarding the vaccine, my number one concern is the amount of Aluminum in it, I have found, but not sure, that it contains the following concentrations:

    0.5 mg Aluminum Hydroxide content

    0.32 mg Aluminum Phosphate content

    0.82 mg total

    Would this be correct? or this the amount of aluminum element only? I have read the "Vaccine Book" by Dr Bob Sears and he recommended "Daptacel" which is not available in Australia but has an Aluminum only content of 0.33 mg but a 1.5 mg Aluminium Phosphate content in total. Which makes me a little confused does the 0.82 mg for the Infanrix be for the Aluminium only or is it combined with the Hydroxide and Phosphate, which if is the case, the total Aluminium element content would than be lower then the "Daptacel" brand? Really looking for a pharmacist or a really researched individual for an answer.

    Thank you
    Just a quick reply as I'm a bit busy tonight.

    The weight of the aluminium phosphate and aluminium hydroxide (ie the 0.82mg) is the combined mass for all the elements in question (Aluminium + hydrogen + phospherous + oxygen).

    Aluminium Hydroxide formula is AL(OH)3, meaning 1 molecule of aluminium and 3 each of hydrogen and oxygen.

    Aluminium Phosphate formula is ALPO4, meaning 1 molecule of aluminium, 1 of phosphorous and 4 of oxygen.

    I would have to sit down and work out the exact proportion by weight that aluminium represents, but it would obviously be far less than 0.82mg.


    All that said, be careful assuming that the effects of a single element are the same once it's been compounded. They almost never are.

    ie, if you look at Chlorine, it's highly toxic to humans. But compound it with sodium and you end up with Sodium Chloride, or perfectly safe table salt.


    I'll try to look at the studies you link to below and get proportions of aluminium over the weekend.


 

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