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  1. #181
    Ana Gram's Avatar
    Ana Gram is offline 2008 WINNER - straight shooter award
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    Quote Originally Posted by FiveInTheBed View Post
    I look forward to chatting with him at the awards tonight!!

    Please tell me he is still your date!?

    Damn straight

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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    If evolution wasn't the start of evolution - how did evolution start?
    I can't even begin to imagine what that might mean.

    There is a tendency for molecules to group together and begin to develop (evolve to develop) characteristics of lfie, such as movement, reproduction etc.

    This starts at the cellular level.

    This happens in many places - the deepest parts of the ocean, the most frozen parts of the ice, on Mars, everywhere. Life finds a way.

    From these humble beginnings, through the process of mutation changes arise. Mutation is a result of flaws in reproduction, from solar radiation, all sorts ofthings.

    Offspring with an adaptive trait will have an edge over their brethren. They will live longer to breed more. Over time, the adaptive trait will spread through the species.

    I have absollutely no idea whatsoever what this has to do with the big bang.

    Scientists have been able to prompt chemicals into life in the lab. It's just a characteristic of complex compounds that they group into life.

    As soon as you have life, you have evolution. it is a fundamental process of life.

    Whatever has an advantage, breeds more, thus resulting in species change.

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  4. #183
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    Pegasus what did you major in?

  5. #184
    Pegasus's Avatar
    Pegasus is offline and all that the Lorax left here in this mess was a small pile of rocks with the one word...UNLESS
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    I find it interesting how evolutionists want people to explain how creation explains certain traits that are prevalent in different species but ask for an explanation as to why we are here, or a lot of human nature issues, evolution has no answers.

    The problem is that Creation is not a theory - you either believe it or you don't, nobody who believes it is going out to make hypotheses and prove them. People who believe in Creation know that it can't be proven.

    As for vestigiality - some of that is explained by evolution, (and this is where I buck at others who say that people can't believe in some evolution even if you do believe in creation), but I also do believe there are some holes in the findings of some of these "remnant organs and muscles". I think in some instances, man has tried to explain for their own purposes something that is just "what it is".

    Eg. I've just been reading that some believe that the grasp reflex in infants is a vestigial reflex left over from holding onto hair on a primate's chest. After studying both neuroscience, children's development, plasticity of the brain, reflexes, and hand development I believe the grasp reflex is required in the child's development of prehensile grasp. Something that primates do not have.

  6. #185
    Ana Gram's Avatar
    Ana Gram is offline 2008 WINNER - straight shooter award
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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post

    Eg. I've just been reading that some believe that the grasp reflex in infants is a vestigial reflex left over from holding onto hair on a primate's chest. After studying both neuroscience, children's development, plasticity of the brain, reflexes, and hand development I believe the grasp reflex is required in the child's development of prehensile grasp. Something that primates do not have.
    I've read this over and over and am still trying to work it out. Primates do not have prehensile grasp I studied primatology and bio anthro and nowhere in either of those did it ever say that primates do not have prehensile grasp.

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  8. #186
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    Pegasus - before we go further -- do you 'believe' for lack of a better word... that humans are related to other primates?

    You do know that some primates have a 'prehensile tail' or can grasp with their feet?

    Some primates don't have opposable Thumbs like humans do, but that - again is explained by the theory of evolution.

    I'm sorry - but your last post doesn't make much sense.

    Again, all it does is try to poke holes in the theory of evolution - without backing it up with another given reason.

    There have been MANY posters in this thread who suggest 'The Theory of Creation' should be taught along side the Theory of Evolution.

    So if you were going to TEACH creation in a science class -- HOW would you do it??
    Last edited by FiveInTheBed; 14-04-2012 at 20:28. Reason: **added 'some' back infront of the word primate as I learnt more about opposable /apposable tonight :)

  9. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    I find it interesting how evolutionists want people to explain how creation explains certain traits that are prevalent in different species but ask for an explanation as to why we are here, or a lot of human nature issues, evolution has no answers.
    AND - evolution has never declared that it tries to answer WHY we are here.

    I believe you are referring to 'Philosophy'?

  10. #188
    Pegasus's Avatar
    Pegasus is offline and all that the Lorax left here in this mess was a small pile of rocks with the one word...UNLESS
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    I went to a government school where in science we were taught that the big bang was a theory - but just that some people think the world started that way - we were not taught of any other ideas. I was also brought up going to Sunday school - where I was taught about creation. I was taught RE at school from about year 3 to year 7 - but in those days no one protested about it. You either sat in on the class or went to another room to do alternate activities.

    The construct I have difficulty with is that I don't know any different. I don't know how I'd think if i hadn't had exposure to both ideas.

    (Just for the record, although I was brought up Christian, it's only been in my 30's really that I've really questioned what I believe and why I believe it). I'm not going to go into this all here, as I also try to keep some anonymity here, but I don't blindly follow what I was taught as a child.

    I'll come back to answer about primates later - got to go finish dinner for the kids

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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post

    As for vestigiality - some of that is explained by evolution, (and this is where I buck at others who say that people can't believe in some evolution even if you do believe in creation), but I also do believe there are some holes in the findings of some of these "remnant organs and muscles". I think in some instances, man has tried to explain for their own purposes something that is just "what it is".
    I just skipped to the end of this thread and was so fascinated by the ideas in Pegasus' thread that i went off to read more - imagine my surprise when i was reading about vestigiality only to hear in the background "Two and a half men" mention a vestigial penis lol! sorry totally OT I know but its not exactly a word you hear everyday so was a fair coincidence

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  13. #190
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    Witwicky is offline A closed mouth gathers no foot.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ana Gram View Post
    I've read this over and over and am still trying to work it out. Primates do not have prehensile grasp I studied primatology and bio anthro and nowhere in either of those did it ever say that primates do not have prehensile grasp.
    I have studied both as well and I am equally confused.


 

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