They compared other big volcanic erruptions and the things that came about from them, like the locusts, the water turning red etc.
They then tried to pinpoint the time Moses lived and which pharoah it was, there was a pharoah that suddenly changed religions and went against all traditions.
Then they showed how at a certain time the sea can part.
I know I'm being really vague and not giving details. I read this about 10+ years ago and can't remember exactly. I can't even remember where I read it? I think it was a book I borrowed from the library, and it wasn't specifically about this, it was about Tutankamuns pyramid But anyway, it was interesting. I then remember seeing something on tv, but it wasn't really the same as what I read, but close.
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03-03-2012 18:44 #321Guest Guest
03-03-2012 18:52 #322
That's interesting Lilly and explains a lot. I love the historical side to ancient times particularly religious
03-03-2012 18:57 #323Guest Guest
If only I could remember the name of the book I don't have it so I'm pretty sure I borrowed it. Maybe I'll do a quick google. You'd really enjoy it cause I still remember it (well bits of it!)
03-03-2012 20:22 #324
After speaking with my sister she ( being the religious one in the family) said to tell us all that Rabbis and holy men have been trying to figure out the meaning of the bible for thousands of years and are still learning and that we may all be on this thread for a while!
The Hebrew word for earth translates as land ( as pp said earth was not a word) but land means the whole earth in regards to what the Hebrew bible is implying as G-d created the whole earth not just the middle east ( if that makes sense!)
So yes the Hebrew bible ( and the Talmud) means the flood covered all of the earth and all of the animals and all of the humans except who was on the ark , she also said ( which makes sense!) that there is maybe thousands of species of animals so the bible would not mention them all but she is sure G-d would not forget our marsupials !
One of the Rabbis she met in Jerusalem said that Noah's Ark was a metaphor for Jewish life, in times of crises ( ie: a flood) even though we live in different countries with different lives ( the animals symbolize this) we will all come together and become one
( the lions won't eat the zebras etc) to protect our faith
She also said its important to understand that Jewish tradition teaches that all sacred text contains infinite levels of meaning as that it is a reflection of G-d who is infinite , she believes some things are literal and some are metaphorical in ways our ancestors could understand
I hope that made sense- I'm putting DS to bed and will be back later!
04-03-2012 07:34 #325
Just to throw something else into the mix...
Some people have asked a few questions that I will come back and have some input into once I'm back from church. I just wanted to say something about the flood, though.
When reading the old testament alongside the new, the flood of Noah really is a parallel of baptism. Sin covered the earth and God sought to cleanse it, to save it, to start over. As I have said previously, the word for baptism does mean full immersion. This is another reason I believe the waters would have covered the whole Earth.
I don't know if this makes any kind of difference to those seeking some more logical explanation for things, but before the flood the bible says the
the earth hadn't had rain before, that a heavy mist every morning watered the earth. Just another reason society thought Noah was bonkers... Building an enormous ark when they'd never even seen rain before?! I can understand why they didn't believe when Noah warned them of what was coming. (Gen 2:4-6)
I believe God created the Earth so don't really have an issue with him sending huge masses of water then taking it away again.
04-03-2012 07:51 #326Guest Guest
Womens roles in religion.
Women were given the same possibility of salvation as men, for the first time in history by Jesus Christ. Baptism in Christ now enabled both males and females to be equally saved (Galatians 3:27-28). Christ also broke many of the social Jewish customs of that time, for example, by speaking with the Samaritan woman by the well, which was not permitted for any Jew to do. So Christ elevated women to the same status as men, but maintained their different roles in society. In other words, women are seen as equal, but different.In the Orthodox Church, the highest place that any human being has ever reached, was achieved by a woman, not a man. The Virgin Mary was the only human being to be elevated to the second highest position in Heaven! Second only to God Himself. After God, comes the Virgin Mary, and then the highest male,who was John the Baptist, and then the Apostles and others. So the highest position that any male on earth has ever reached was achieved by the Prophet St John the Bapstist, but even he is lower in status and importance than the Virgin Mary.
(Jesus was not seen as man but God by orthodox translation)
04-03-2012 08:35 #327
Does the orthodox church ( I honestly do not know any thing about Christian orthodox ) then allow female priests/ministers ?
04-03-2012 09:17 #328Guest Guest
No because Jesus chose male apostles, we dont know why but its not up to us to question Jesus.
They do allow priests to marry however unlike catholic. I agree with this because the apostles were married and if Jesus and god saw them fit to spread the word of Jesus there's no need to be celibate. But I'm pretty sure they have a reason, can't remember what it is?
04-03-2012 09:19 #329Guest Guest
I also think it was a different time and I don't think men would have accepted their wives traveling and being chosen by Jesus over them. It would have caused conflict and outrage.
04-03-2012 12:40 #330
So much more....
Basically it's amazing I'm still actually a christian. But I had faith and I never lost nor will I lose my faith and my faith is something they could never mess with. The Holy spirit is what got me out and it's the Holy Spirit that saved my life when I thought suicide was the only way out and it the Holy spirit that keeps me.
Ok, so I definitely see your point about Noah and the Ark (I think I do anyway). Like I have already said, I take the bible 100% literally, that what was written was what God wanted to have said. So, in some ways, I tend to agree with Maria02, and when I checked over the verses she provided about the ark, it does seem fairly clear that it says ‘all of the earth, everything under the heavens’, etc.
BUT I do agree that the context and culture of the day would have influenced how it was written. Perhaps it WAS only ‘the whole earth’, as only a portion of the Earth that the writers knew as was the whole Earth at the time. Perhaps it has not been translated correctly from Hebrew? (I wish I knew Hebrew!) So I absolutely do see that it is entirely possible.
I guess the important thing for me is that, whether it was the ENTIRE earth, or just a portion of the earth as known to the people of the day, either way, I believe that the story is true. I don’t need to rationalise it to make it more ‘believable’, if that makes sense. If it is a completely plausible story, or a completely impossible story, either way, I believe that it happened. Again – because of faith J As someone put earlier (Deserema?), faith is the evidence of things unseen. I don’t need evidence, because my faith is stronger than that. But please, I am NOT criticizing if someone does need to rationalise the story and make it plausible in order to be able to believe it. If that is how you see the bible, I think that is completely valid for you J But I personally, believe the story either way.
Another topic on the subject of context, if you are interested in discussing it, is related to how women are seen in the bible (Uh oh – I hope I don’t start something controversial). In 1 Corinthians 14:34 - 35, the women are instructed not to speak in church, to be silent. Because of this, I feel that women were silenced in the Church for a long time. But I have read that, in church at those times, women would loudly question their husbands, like ‘WHAT DID HE MEAN WHEN HE SAID THAT, DEAR?’, when the speaker was trying to preach, which made it difficult for people to listen and for the speaker to speak. So, I think when the women were told to be silent, it was more of a ‘please stop asking your husbands questions during church, and distracting people from listening to the speaker. Save the questions for when you are at home. So, when you put the verse into context, it really doesn’t mean that women are ‘lesser’ beings than men in the church – just that everyone should be respectful of the person speaking.
So, when I say I take the bible literally, I don’t mean that I agree that women should still have to be silent in church, and shouldn’t be allowed to preach, etc. just because it’s written in the bible. I think that they were trying to set a standard of people not chitter chattering through the service. I personally don’t know of any churches that do not allow women to speak, etc. and in my church, a woman can be a pastor just as much as a man can – but I’m sure that there are some religions where that is not the case.
Anyone else care to add anything in relation to their religion or denomination?
By FiveInTheBed in forum Religion / SpiritualityReplies: 7Last Post: 03-07-2012, 16:07
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