This topic was being discussed in that other thread and I found it very interesting so I thought I'd start up another one so we can continue the discussion.
***disclaimer - Any inference whatsoever about christians or creation believing people being of lower inteligence will not be tolerated. No belittling, antagonising or condescending either. I WILL ask a moderator to close this thread down if anyone is seen doing this. I want this to be a peaceful and respectful...thank you*****
This is interesting, I've never seen it like that before. Although isn't Satan talked about as being a fallen Angel etc?Satan is an interesting one. "Satan" and "devil" we're used to describe anyone "accusing" or "opposing", Jesus even called one of disciples "Satan". I don't believe that any of the "Satans" or "devils" were spiritual beings or a fallen angel. I believe the Satans and Devils of the bible are simply people who opposed the faithful at certain points, and people's own human nature. I don't believe there is a bad or evil "being" that tries to make me do sinful things.
This I find interesting also "Age-lasting", I looked into 'universal salvation' before. It's a big no no among religious folk but I'm a firm believer of letting God reveal things to you rather than man dictating (been there...done that) and the word 'age' or 'era' has actually been replaced by 'ever' or 'everlasting' quite a bit throughout the bible. Which answers the question that I've been asking for some time...When the last enemy (death) is destroyed....where do the dead people go?Interlinear translation:
Thus for loved the God the world, so that the son of himself the only-begotten he gave, that every one who believing into him, not may be destroyed, but may have life age-lasting.
Would love if some of you would come back and discuss this with me. It's a huuuuuge topic but I'm interested in picking people's brains about this as I firmly feel that leaving myself open is the best way to accept God's instruction so I'm open to anything in regards to differing interpretations to the bible and how much man influenced the scriptures as they were written and how much 'spin' they put on the inspiration they received from God. (I would imagine it being a fair bit, depending on their personality) James and Paul being an example
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01-03-2012 11:41 #1
Translations of the bible
Last edited by Deserama; 01-03-2012 at 11:43.
01-03-2012 11:55 #2
I think a lot of things are 'lost in translation' when it comes to the Bible.
Many words in our language are not the exact equivalent to the word when written in Hebrew.
"Virgin" is a great example.
Then there's the confusion when people take passages and stories 'literally' and some declare it is metaphorical.
01-03-2012 12:03 #3
It's hard sometimes because I have found, and I know others have too, that what I take out of a passage could mean something to me one day....then a few years later I can get something totally different out of the same passage or an even deeper meaning, depending on what I need at the time. What happens in religion is that you get someone getting a message out of a passage then preaching this as gospel and that this is what the passage means and should mean to everyone!
Or taken out of context - that's my favourite LOL None of the who said it, what was said, when was it said, how was it said or why was it said....just...it was said - that's that!
01-03-2012 12:12 #4
Subscribing, I"ll come back later.
01-03-2012 13:53 #5
I’m glad you started this thread, I was quite interested in discussing what justwanttobemummy said further.
I do agree that I can read a passage of scripture, and God can reveal something to me through it, and then read it again and find something completely different. That is the beauty of the bible, but I guess it also leads to misinterpretation – we can all read the same scripture and sometimes interpret it differently.
I often find that the bible is misrepresented by people who do not study it for themselves/ are not practicing Christians, but perhaps had some form of religion in their upbringing, and don’t quite understand the Word of God. For example – I once had someone say to me, in regards to revenge, “But the bible says an eye for an eye!” It can be difficult to explain in a few words the OT/NT, and that, although the OT is filled with law, Jesus came to fulfil the law & bring life and grace.
To be honest, I’ve always thought of Satan as a ‘being’, a fallen angel. I have looked before about all of the bible scriptures that refer to Satan, and I agree that they are quite vague. I can see how ‘personifying’ Satan could very well be something that WE have done, rather than what the bible says.
I have also looked into the ‘Satan as a fallen angel’ thing before, because I find there is not a lot of information in the bible about this. I think the main reference scripture is Isaiah 14:12 – 15, which talks about the Day Star fallen from heaven, cut down to the ground, etc. Also, Revelation 12:9 – 10 talks about the great dragon, it also refers to the same creature as an ancient serpent, being thrown down to the Earth… which raises the question, I guess, about where Satan resides? My reference for Hell has always been the place of death and hades, where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth, and eternal separation from God.
Revelation 20:12 also talks about the devil who had deceived them being thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
So I guess with the understanding I have from the bible, I do believe that Satan is a ‘being’, (possibly a fallen angel?), with ‘demons’ who are his agents of evil, in the same way that God’s angels are his agents of good. I believe that the Revelation scriptures speak of the end times, when Satan is defeated. I believe that Hell is a place of eternal separation from God – I don’t know if that is a physical ‘place’, or just the absence of spending eternity in heaven with God. I believe that Satan has other names – the accuser of the bretheren, the deceiver, the father of lies, etc, which are based on his ‘character’.
I am interested, though, to hear other views – I am trying to evaluate my own perspective as I type – do I believe that Satan is a ‘being’ because it is what I have always known, or is it possible that Satan is just the evil in the world around us that takes on many forms?
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01-03-2012 13:56 #6Senior Member
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I've never heard anyone explain how they know which parts of the Bible are true (usually Jesus) and which are metaphorical (usually the talking snake). As Prof. Jerry Coyne puts it: In science, a falsified hypothesis gets tossed on the scrap heap; in religion, a falsified hypothesis becomes a metaphor.
01-03-2012 13:56 #7
Also, in regards to translations of the bible, and things getting lost - I think that can happen when translating from any language. I think that when the bible was translated into Latin, and the church went through periods of corruption, the leadership of the day didn't WANT people to know and understand the bible for themselves. It is not like that today. In general, we as christians like to think for ourselves, not just blindly accept. I think that (Correct me if I am wrong?) has previously been translated from Latin into English, but the more modern translations of the bible have gone back to the original Hebrew, because Christians in general want to be assured that meaning is not lost in translation.
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01-03-2012 14:06 #8
Excited about this! I will come back tonight
01-03-2012 14:06 #9
Being Jewish I can comment from our perspective if that's ok
Jews don't believe in Satan, in the Hebrew Bible ( old testament) "the Satan" was one of G-DS angels who appeared in the book of Job , his role was to challenge people, his job was to make choosing good over evil enough of a challenge so it can be a meaningful choice
Rabbis would never believe any being had G-d like power other than G-d ( which is why The Satan had to ask permission from him to test Job)
This is the only time he was ever mentioned
The original Jewish texts are written in Hebrew and Aramaic , apparently they were translated into Latin and Greek then English so yes i think a lot was lost in translation !
Last edited by Elijahs Mum; 01-03-2012 at 14:09.
01-03-2012 14:28 #10
hi, im glad you have started this discussion. I have read the bible a few times, and the new testament many times. I think there is a 'being' that is Satan, and that there are 'his devils' that do his works. I also think there is always temptation and if we allow ourselves to give in to the temptations, we can become evil. As for the translations of the bible; I look at the bible as a living thing, the Living word of God if you like. It has been written by so many people, over so many years, and then translated dozens of times from two or three languages into english, I think it is not meant to be taken as an historical, or literal account. I think it is valuable as an instruction manual for the best way to live your life. I have also read a translation of the Koran, and many books from the Dali Lama, and buddhist teachings. Marie .
By FiveInTheBed in forum Religion / SpiritualityReplies: 7Last Post: 03-07-2012, 16:07
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