If he did the crime for which he is in jail he has no 'right' to be allowed to create a child. (they can't actually have s3x with their wives, yeah?) so no I dont believe he should be allowed any exceptions to the fact he's serving a life sentence for murder.
If he is innocent of murder I hope this comes to light in his retrial. But once someone is actually in prison he can hardly be consider 'innocent until proven guilty... Again...'
As for his wives right to try to have a baby - IMO there's nothing anyone but herself has done to prevent her from having a baby. She has as much right as anyone else to do with her body as she wishes. Be it TTC naturally, through a donor or IVF. I don't see her rights as being violated unless a law is passed to say a woman cannot conceive a child not of her husbands making. She's made a choice. The law shouldn't have to bend to suit her wants.
Although - if they do allow conjugal visits and she happens to fall pregnant then lucky them. My opinion on whether it's a particularly good or healthy idea aside, if they can fall pregnant within the existing system then they have a right to have that child.
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23-01-2012 08:59 #51
Last edited by Boobycino; 23-01-2012 at 09:01.
23-01-2012 09:24 #52
in a case like this, the rights of the child should definitely outweigh the rights of the two people in question. That's all I'm going to say on this.
23-01-2012 09:37 #53Senior Member
- Join Date
- Oct 2009
I think we're in very dangerous territory if we base legislation concerning who can or cannot have a child on whether they are a good person, whether they will provide an appropriate environment for a child, and whether the father will be around to support the child.
I don't think anyone 'deserves' or 'doesn't deserve' a child. It really comes down to whether, as a society, we allow prisoners (irrespective of crime) to have a baby or not.
I raised a question about who was funding the IVF, as I believe that many factors come in to play about whether this legislation (to have a child) should exist. I don't think it can be made on emotional grounds, and I think that if the decision were made that way then we would be opening up a can of worms about who was allowed IVF/ treatment/ to have children in the greater whole of society.
ETA: People have also spoken of the child's 'rights'. Again, I think this is dangerous territory, if we are trying to decide whether a potential child should be conceived/ born based on parental circumstances.
23-01-2012 09:51 #54
While I realise that prisoners do retain certain rights, INHO, when you go to gaol you should have no rights. I think Australia is very soft in this regard. If the prison in question grants the pair conjugal visits then the sentence is a farce.
My answer is no, they should not be allowed to start a family. They're both delusional if they think they can offer the resulting child any positive quality of life in that circumstance. A child is not a commodity and yes, there are people in this world who do not deserve to have children. I apologise if this hurts your sensibilities. Speak to someone who works in Child Protection and they'll raise the hair on the back of your neck with some of these people who 'have rights' and abuse them day in and day out.
I'm not afraid to say no. They don't deserve it.
Let the do-gooders flame me. I grant you that none of them will have had ANY experience with criminals or the corrections system. My stance is rather staunch in this respect for reasons I don't want to go into on this forum.
Last edited by Caviar; 23-01-2012 at 09:53.
23-01-2012 09:55 #55in a case like this, the rights of the child should definitely outweigh the rights of the two people in question
23-01-2012 09:56 #56Senior Member
- Join Date
- Nov 2007
I do agree Girl X that it could be a slippery slope, although, if there is no s3x allowed within prison then so be it. He broke the law so has to deal with the consequences.
There's nothing stopping HER from having a baby I wouldn't imagine, but I don't believe people in prison for murder should be claiming their 'human rights'.
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23-01-2012 11:58 #57Senior Member
- Join Date
- Jan 2010
As a victim of crime, I feel strongly 'NO WAY'.
I dont think he should have been allowed to marry while in prison either
I dont feel that marriage or having children are human rights. They are privileges.
He had his chance to choose a future with a wife and child etc. He chose to kill a man instead.
It really p*sses me off how many privileges prisoners (particularly in australia) have.
feed them, cloth them, provide them with shelter - in my opinion that is ALL they should get while they are in prison.
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23-01-2012 12:22 #58
I find it interesting that he was allowed to marry while in prison. Not saying whether it's right or wrong. But if you let prisoners get married while serving life sentences then you open up even more cans of worms like these- do they allow conjugal visits, IVF etc.
My little munchkin due May 2012! So to keep me busy till then, I'm learning how to use my iPhone.
23-01-2012 12:25 #59
I think they should be made to wait til they're released before they marry or have kids, not during their time of punishment.
23-01-2012 12:32 #60
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