I have been active in the past in environmental activism and seen the media send fake protesters to make a peaceful protest look violent. You get to know people in the activism community and a couple were known as paid troublemakers. A long time ago though. I dont know how much protesting achieves any more, although I think peoples hearts and motivations are definately in the right place.
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15-06-2012 05:51 #191
15-06-2012 19:30 #192
I thought one thing that is awful but true.
In melb there is a primary school where young boys aged 5 to 7 were forced to give oral sex to the older boys 10 to 12's. It was a common theme there and some little boys had rashes on their mouths from doing it so much. It's a suburb known for being 'rough'.
15-06-2012 19:51 #193Senior Member
- Join Date
- Mar 2011
[this is for the Melburnians out there who are following the recent Melb Water 'scandal']
I know how water is priced and why Melbourne Water is not ripping anyone off
15-06-2012 19:57 #194
15-06-2012 20:14 #195
15-06-2012 20:19 #196Senior Member
- Join Date
- Mar 2011
Essentially, every five years all of the water businesses (this happens in electricity and gas too) submit a plan to an independent regulator which says 'this is how much we think it will cost to operate our assets/network, and this is how much water we think we will sell.'
The regulator (in this case the Essential Services Commission) reviews these plans and determines what they consider to be a fair 'revenue requirement'. They then divide this number by what they think is a fair estimate of the amount of water they will sell. Cost divided by water sold = the price we pay (this is very simplistic - in reality it's a fair bit more complicated). Melb Water don't set the prices - the regulator does.
The last time prices were set was 2009, so Melb Water had to provide an estimate of what the desal plant would cost in 2011 and 2012 (it happened to be a four year pricing period from 2009-2012). The desal plant was supposed to start in 2011 so they forecast an expense in 2011 and 2012 and this flowed through to prices. Then the delays started and the plant now won't start until 2013.
So they got the forecast wrong, but it wasn't their fault. But, anyway this happens ALL THE TIME. No forecast is 100% accurate, let alone one that was made 3 years ago. And it can go both ways of course. What if they overspent against their forecast - would you be demanding that you pay MORE because Melb Water didn't charge enough to recover their costs?
In fact this has kind of happened. Even though MW have collected all this additional revenue (which they're using to offset future prices, even though they're not legally obliged to do so), they actually sold less water than the regulator said they would. So on that particular issue they're out of pocket to the tune of ~$50M. Do you hear anyone saying they should take this into account when calculating these 'refunds'? No.
Sorry, this is a long post, but what we're seeing here is a gigantic media beat up that's really (a) nothing new and (b) completely legal.
15-06-2012 20:28 #197
Last edited by SPC; 15-06-2012 at 20:32.
15-06-2012 20:39 #198
So so true about the government. At times (perhaps often)inefficient yes so definitely NOT coordinated enough to lie, manipulate, cover up or act like big brother. Also true about not being able to tell their side! So many people who complain about the service of govt departments on TV are in the wrong but for privacy that can't be shared. The govt isn't responsible if you made a bad decision, married a d*ck, didn't follow the law or something similar!
And many public servants work really hard! No one ever believes me on that one!
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15-06-2012 20:46 #199
15-06-2012 21:43 #200
I know exactly what happens to your tap water to make it safe for consumption and YES, I do drink it
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