According to the Oxford English Dictionary (2nd edition, 1989), whom is "no longer current in natural colloquial speech". Lasnik & Sobin 2000 argue that surviving occurrences of whom are not part of ordinary English grammar, but the result of extra-grammatical rules for producing "prestige" forms.
So now you don't have to worry about getting them confused
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18-04-2011 09:03 #591
18-04-2011 10:30 #592
18-04-2011 11:02 #593-
- Join Date
- Sep 2010
- in them thar hills
Whom is very definitely used in speech and in written language. Working in a language rich profession, the purported redundancy of this word takes me by surprise. It is still very much in use. I would vouch that those who say it's not used do not know how to use the word properly.
Out of interest, how many people in this thread were given formal grammar instruction in high school?
Additionally, I was very fortunate to be in a class where 90% was comprised of immigrants which made the subject of grammar all the more important. In return, I became bilingual. This is something that I find sadly lacking in a lot of schools too.
Back then (70's and 80s), the foundations for literacy were very good. Then the policy writers stepped in with national plans and beaurocratic bs and it all fell by the wayside. It makes me laugh how "educational programmes" laud the "newest educational discovery" and it's just plain phonics (anyone remember the "Word Power" series?)
And aren't we paying for it now!
18-04-2011 16:47 #594
This is completely off the topic of spelling and grammar... however...
I get so annoyed when people refer to cottage pie as shepherd's pie! What's worse, I know I'm being so incredibly petty that I can't even usually admit to it.
My mum does from time to time, and I take the opportunity to call her on it and vent all my frustrations on one person.
"I just made shepherd's pie."
"Does it have lamb in it?"
"No, it's beef mince."
"THEN IT'S NOT A SHEPHERD'S PIE!"
The Following User Says Thank You to lambjam For This Useful Post:
18-04-2011 16:58 #595
18-04-2011 17:08 #596
I never use "cottage pie"
'cos it reminds me of cottage cheese
18-04-2011 17:13 #597
That's not the only difference either, cottage pie has far more vegetables in it than a shepherd's pie (which doesn't have any, except for things like onion and of course the potato).
18-04-2011 18:12 #598
18-04-2011 18:26 #599-
- Join Date
- Feb 2009
I don't say cottage pie either. I know I should, but I don't like the sound of it. I never use lamb mince because once I made moussaka and I'm positive the mince was sheep, and not a sprightly one either, because it stank, not off, just that strong sheep smell. So yes, I call cottage pie shepherds pie, but I do know the difference lol.
18-04-2011 19:00 #600-
- Join Date
- Mar 2008
- The 'Gong, NSW
So Off topic, but I use diced lamb for my shepherd's pie, and beef mince for my cottage pie.
There is a recipe on a packet (OXO cubes maybe) that is for "Shepherd's Pie" but it says to use beef mince. It really bothers me too!
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