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  1. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    I think it's the private system that cares about naplans. They tend to be more elitist and want kids on their books that outwardly perform well. I don't think anyone, teacher or parent, is saying naplans are meaningless. Just that there are many complexities that scores don't reflect about both students and schools. I certainly believe far too much stock is placed in them.

    And as an example, my DS1 sat the yr 3 naplans. He scored well above school and above national average but his maths wasn't good. That would be bc he got bogged down on a few questions and spent literally an hour stressing and trying to work them out rather than leaving them and moving on. So he only completed half the test lol So on paper his score wasn't good, but had he actually kept moving and left them he would have scored really well.
    Isn't that then up to his teacher or you to let him know before the test to skip questions he's not sure on and come back to them? I can see why he would have stalled on a difficult question, he wouldn't have known to leave it, so isn't it an adults responsibility to teach them how to sit tests and skip difficult questions until the end?

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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Squared View Post
    Isn't that then up to his teacher or you to let him know before the test to skip questions he's not sure on and come back to them? I can see why he would have stalled on a difficult question, he wouldn't have known to leave it, so isn't it an adults responsibility to teach them how to sit tests and skip difficult questions until the end?
    Yep. I asked him if his teacher had pointed that out beforehand and he said no. But she's ready to retire, doesn't prepare them at all and is a bit of a battle axe

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  4. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    I think it's the private system that cares about naplans. They tend to be more elitist and want kids on their books that outwardly perform well. I don't think anyone, teacher or parent, is saying naplans are meaningless. Just that there are many complexities that scores don't reflect about both students and schools. I certainly believe far too much stock is placed in them.

    .
    That's not true - selective public schools and catholic schools want them as well , plus when taking out of area kids public schools also asked for them ( well they did in my SIL case) I've got clients who get their kids tutored for NAPLAN to help get them into selective public high schools so it's unfair to say it's only private schools

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    Catholic schools are private, as are anglican, steiner and many non religious.

    Selective schools are a completely different ball of wax. My DD is going to one and we've just gone through the whole process so I know exactly how selective works. Given it's a gifted program obviously it's going to be based on ability and it certainly isn't just NAPLAN. They sit several very difficult exams needing certain marks, and the current school is required to provide their marks to dept of Ed but that is required to rank kids who may be from the same school applying. NAPLAN is just a small piece in the puzzle, and while DD's selective wanted her primary marks, and obviously her exam marks, they didn't even want NAPLAN.

    I do stand by what I said. It's by far the private schools that want the results.
    Last edited by delirium; 15-09-2016 at 10:35.

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    I totally disagree public schools don't put pressure on their students for NAPLAN -
    I'd say there are many parents of public school kids who will agree - many on here have already said they do - our private school does not as really what is the benefit to them? Our boys don't need NAPLAN to get into high school as its automatic entry , i would guess the public primary schools would be under way more pressure so parents can have a choice of what high school to send their kids too

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elijahs Mum View Post
    That's not true - selective public schools and catholic schools want them as well , plus when taking out of area kids public schools also asked for them ( well they did in my SIL case) I've got clients who get their kids tutored for NAPLAN to help get them into selective public high schools so it's unfair to say it's only private schools
    We have just enrolled DD for high school next year. She is going to an out of area high school. We weren't asked for NAPLAN results, but were asked for her year 5 and 6 reports. She also had to fill out a questionnaire and we had an interview.

    DD got into the out of are high school and they are full to the brim and have actually gone over their planned intake numbers. So I know we were very, very lucky to get in. But I'm so glad we did and without showing any NAPLAN results

    NAPLAN wise it is one of the best state high schools in our state. Interestingly, throughout the whole orientation process and open days their NAPLAN results were not mentioned once by any staff. Our area high school which is still in the top 10 (I think) state high schools, went on and on about their NAPLAN results. In the introduction to the school by the principal about 20 minutes was spent on what a great school they are and how their results compare to the surrounding private and public schools.

    The only reason I know the results of the high school DD are going is that I went and had a look at their results are hearing our area high school go on and on about them.
    Last edited by PomPoms; 15-09-2016 at 11:06.

  9. #177
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    Default Kinder program in childcare if funding isn't approved?

    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    Bottom line if students from your school are not in need of extra attention then why are their educational results in the bottom of the results table? You can't put it all down to other schools doing a dodge by keeping their 'worst' performers home. Not saying the kids are bad or the teachers aren't doing a great job. Just that the kids and teachers face some extraordinary challenges and thanks to the Mygov website as it helped me realise that and hence some to the theoretical decision that your school wouldn't be suitable for my eldest child.

    Also, a kid having issues doesn't mean they need to be left home anther year - without the details of said issues you are flying blind in terms if making that call. It just means that he shouldn't go to a school where a large chunk of the student population also have issues that require the teachers attention.
    The myschool website doesn't show who is at the bottom. Do you know how they get the red, green and white marks? But in any case, I don't care about the red marks. That has no indication on how my child or your child will perform in NAPLAN or be taught as a *whole* student. It doesn't show what music or dance or art or sport programs they do or what work they do within the community or how loving and caring and nurturing and hard working the principal and teachers are. It doesn't show the school's direction or plan. It doesn't show that the children are happy and friendly and United. It doesn't show the harmonious diversity of the community that come together for school events. It doesn't show the fact that the school was handpicked by the educational director to be a showcase school to demonstrate its innovation for a number of educational leaders and principals. It doesn't show anything except a red or pink or green or white mark that reflects nothing about the school culture. If a parent doesn't want to choose that school because of some red lines or it's not "Australian" enough then they are the ones missing out!

    And what you wouldn't know from myschool is that my children's school has 3x the growth of the national average. In other words, the gains the students make far exceed the national average and surpass most other schools by far. That is much more important than anything else.

    Let's look at the NAPLAN writing test. The NAPLAN only tests for two types of writing. Narrative and persuasive text. They do not reveal anymore which genre it will be. 2014 was the first year they didn't tell teachers/schools which genre. Can you guess what happened? Schools that were previously rushing to tutor their students in the genre in the weeks leading up to the test didn't know and were left guessing. The whole country's writing results took a dive. It's not a coincidence.

    http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/students-s...15-104liu.html

    Just because people have a language background other than English, it doesn't mean they need help. Some of them (shock horror) do know how to speak English. And if they don't, they have a specialist teacher (not the classroom teacher) either working with them in the classroom or withdrawing them from the classroom. Plus there's other teachers helping too.

    ETA - James Ruse Agricultural High School is the most sought after selective high school in NSW. Tops the HSC ladder every year. 97% of students from language background other than English.

    ImageUploadedByThe Bub Hub1473904928.344274.jpg

    Also, a lot of catholic schools in NSW have huge class sizes, my son in a kindy class of 15 currently where my friend's daughter in the local catholic school up the road in kindy as well has 32. That teacher has 17 more students to teach and give feedback to. So my son's class could be double and there would still be fewer students for his teachers to teach. 20 is the maximum for kindy class in NSW public schools.

    If your son needs intervention at school, he wouldn't need it from a teacher whose job is to help students who speak English as an additional language. That argument is moot.
    Last edited by BigRedV; 15-09-2016 at 23:54.

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    I suppose that's also why I've not taken them into consideration as our school didn't mention them at all in the open days either, it's only after hearing people paying for NAPLAN tutors to get into good high schools that makes me think they must be important to some schools

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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    I agree if we are looking at a 100 a day DC in Sydney vs a public school you'll save money.

    But if we look at 60 a day which is what we pay (before rebate obviously), then factor in before and after school, which if you have even a 30 min commute you'll need. Add in everything it costs, uniforms, 'voluntary' fees, excursions, incidentals (which stack up quickly), I think you'll be shocked once both are at school what you are up for, everything told. Then if you plan to send them private....

    We went public bc I believe it's just as good, and I'm atheist. But I admit I was shocked how expensive 'free' public education is..... and don't get me started about the ipads they now want us to buy
    Wow we need to move I think! All the childcares in my area are $100-120/day. I'm in suburban Melbourne, ds's cc is $110 and will be $120 next year before rebates.

    I wonder what the average cc cost is over all of Australia?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elijahs Mum View Post
    I totally disagree public schools don't put pressure on their students for NAPLAN -
    I'd say there are many parents of public school kids who will agree - many on here have already said they do - our private school does not as really what is the benefit to them? Our boys don't need NAPLAN to get into high school as its automatic entry , i would guess the public primary schools would be under way more pressure so parents can have a choice of what high school to send their kids too
    Well my opinion is that as an education system altogether we place way too much pressure and emphasis on naplan. But we were talking about schools that want NAPLAN results for admission. They are two different topics.

    Many 'elite' schools want students with good naplan results bc they believe (IMHO) it makes the school look better on paper bc they will perform better.


 

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