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  1. #131
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    Default Sonia Kruger - glass house?

    I must be either incredibly lucky or naive but I'm not scared in the slightest. I spent 8 years in Melbourne regularly visiting and spending hours each week in largely Muslim communities and never for one moment felt nervous. And this was after September 11.

    As for categorising that as the worst atrocity, I think there are many wars in Africa and deaths on a large scale where people might disagree. It may be one of the worst in the western world in recent history, but that's as high as I'd put it.

    I'm not daft. DH has a sabbatical in 2 years and we were looking at taking the kids to Europe for 2 months but now we'll stay in Australia.

    The world has been at war with itself in one form or another for generations. Now we have the Internet and social media it's more in our face.

    I genuinely don't believe we have more to fear.

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  3. #132
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    @GucciDahling, thank you for that honest heartfelt post.

    For my part, I'm not scared of terrorism. It's statistically so unlikely. Horrible when it does happen of course - but thankfully very unlikely to happen. Like that plane fuselage falling out of the sky in Donnie Darko.

    What is a bigger threat for me, and what I am increasingly worried about for me and my family, is what seems to be the upswing in bigotry and intolerance generally.

    I'm more afraid of bigots than terrorists.

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  5. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustJaq View Post
    @GucciDahling, thank you for that honest heartfelt post.

    For my part, I'm not scared of terrorism. It's statistically so unlikely. Horrible when it does happen of course - but thankfully very unlikely to happen. Like that plane fuselage falling out of the sky in Donnie Darko.

    What is a bigger threat for me, and what I am increasingly worried about for me and my family, is what seems to be the upswing in bigotry and intolerance generally.

    I'm more afraid of bigots than terrorists.
    This is exactly how I feel

  6. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustJaq View Post
    @GucciDahling, thank you for that honest heartfelt post.

    For my part, I'm not scared of terrorism. It's statistically so unlikely. Horrible when it does happen of course - but thankfully very unlikely to happen. Like that plane fuselage falling out of the sky in Donnie Darko.

    What is a bigger threat for me, and what I am increasingly worried about for me and my family, is what seems to be the upswing in bigotry and intolerance generally.

    I'm more afraid of bigots than terrorists.
    And you know the bizarre thing?!?!
    When the logical and unafraid among us post rational, logical posts, it brings me straight back to this side!
    I'm afraid of bigots too! I'm more afraid of angry reclaim Australia bigots, than I am of my Former Muslim neighbours who spent time watching their kids ride bikes in the street, who had parties, who had friends over, exactly like my family did growing up.
    And THAT's why we need to have these conversations. So we can be reminded of the facts, in amongst the fear. And clear rational thought can prevail.
    We shouldn't mock people's fear - even SK's - because it doesn't actually achieve anything. But gentle reminders of the facts can and does shift viewpoints, over time. I hope...

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  8. #135
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    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?sto...d=107787018440
    Excellent speech by waleed aly on the topic.

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  10. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by J37 View Post
    I'd be genuinely curious to see the breakdown of that number, and I am certainly not doubting you @JustJaq

    Does that include the Australians killed in the MH17 flight shot down, the Bali bombings, etc? It's not specific to ISIS-related terrorism?

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    @J37, I wasn't able to find a good breakdown of those figures for the number of Australians killed in terrorist attacks, but I did find this Crikey article with more information - it's interesting reading.

    https://www.crikey.com.au/2014/09/04...y-the-numbers/

    From my Googling, I suspect the 113 figure includes the Bali Bombing victims, but not the MH17 victims (38 of them) - I suspect the figures given were mid-2014 figures for Australians killed by terrorists in Australia and overseas. It seems to get a bit complicated sometimes by some figures including citizens and residents, and some just citizens too.

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  12. #137
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    I'm still unsettled and scared. And @Sonja, if you and your family have cancelled your plans to go to Europe, then you must be too, surely. Else that doesn't make sense.

    The thing that really had me rattled about Nice is that loads of Australians go there for a holiday, and most would take a stroll down the "Promenade des Anglaises". I know I have/did. It's a very popular tourist destination, not a poor war-torn African nation. So these days, I don't think you can really say that being caught up in a terrorist attack is "extremely unlikely".

    As for 9/11 being the most atrocious act of terror we are likely to see in our lifetimes, I'm happy (well, not happy obviously) to stand by that statement. Not necessarily in terms of lives lost/people injured (although there were many), but the calculated nature in which it caused absolute terror - indescribable terror - and maximum and concentrated destruction, injury and death.

    Sent from my SM-N910G using The Bub Hub mobile app

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  14. #138
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    That Crikey article is really worth a read.

    https://www.crikey.com.au/2014/09/04...y-the-numbers/

    More Australians have died in the last 10 years from falling off ladders or falling out of bed than have died in terrorist attacks in Australia or abroad.

    "The point of all these numbers isn’t to cavalierly dismiss the threat of terrorism. It is a real threat, which has claimed the lives of over 100 Australians in recent decades. But many, many other things that we can also prevent kill many more of us, and particularly target people the media and politicians have less interest in, like indigenous people, the elderly or victims of domestic violence. If the focus of policymakers should be on the lives and wellbeing of Australians, terrorism should be far down the list of their priorities.

    Yet, politicians only have to say the word “terrorism” for Australians, and especially the media, to abandon all reason and demand “whatever it takes” to “keep Australia secure”. The vague and trivial threat of being killed by an evil ideological force — unWestern, non-white, non-English speaking, unChristian — pushes our buttons in a way that far greater threats to our lives — “normal” homicide, domestic violence, preventable diseases and accidents — that kill many, many more Australians and cause persistent economic losses, do not."

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  16. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by J37 View Post
    I'm still unsettled and scared. And @Sonja, if you and your family have cancelled your plans to go to Europe, then you must be too, surely. Else that doesn't make sense.

    The thing that really had me rattled about Nice is that loads of Australians go there for a holiday, and most would take a stroll down the "Promenade des Anglaises". I know I have/did. It's a very popular tourist destination, not a poor war-torn African nation. So these days, I don't think you can really say that being caught up in a terrorist attack is "extremely unlikely".

    As for 9/11 being the most atrocious act of terror we are likely to see in our lifetimes, I'm happy (well, not happy obviously) to stand by that statement. Not necessarily in terms of lives lost/people injured (although there were many), but the calculated nature in which it caused absolute terror - indescribable terror - and maximum and concentrated destruction, injury and death.

    Sent from my SM-N910G using The Bub Hub mobile app
    Last year my younger brother had booked his trip to Nice for Bastille day this year. He cancelled his trip earlier this year due to the increase in terrorist attacks. I'd hate to think what would have happened if he hadn't cancelled. My father is going to Lebanon this year because he has to sort out some issues with land. I'm afraid for him. These are some of the reasons I have the opinion that I have, It's getting too close to home for it to be ignored..

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  18. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by J37 View Post
    I'm still unsettled and scared. And @Sonja, if you and your family have cancelled your plans to go to Europe, then you must be too, surely. Else that doesn't make sense.

    The thing that really had me rattled about Nice is that loads of Australians go there for a holiday, and most would take a stroll down the "Promenade des Anglaises". I know I have/did. It's a very popular tourist destination, not a poor war-torn African nation. So these days, I don't think you can really say that being caught up in a terrorist attack is "extremely unlikely".

    As for 9/11 being the most atrocious act of terror we are likely to see in our lifetimes, I'm happy (well, not happy obviously) to stand by that statement. Not necessarily in terms of lives lost/people injured (although there were many), but the calculated nature in which it caused absolute terror - indescribable terror - and maximum and concentrated destruction, injury and death.

    Sent from my SM-N910G using The Bub Hub mobile app
    No I'm not scared. My husband is currently in London for work and will be for a week. Am I worried something will happen? No. I was in London during several IRA bombings. London has been a dangerous place on and off for years. Still can be.

    My reason for not taking the kids to Europe (specifically France) is because I believe that France is going to experience some very bad times over the next few years. That will target and be specific to France. We were thinking of going to France and Spain. If the proverbial hits the fan in France I don't want to be caught up in it. I was in Germany when the Balkan war erupted and living through one humanitarian crisis is enough for my life time.

    But I'm not scared living my day to day life in Australia. And we still travel to Asia (real Asia not Bali) so it doesn't limit how I live my life. I wouldn't go to the Middle East for a holiday. But that doesn't mean I live in fear.


 

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