+ Reply to Thread
Page 7 of 8 FirstFirst ... 5678 LastLast
Results 61 to 70 of 73
  1. #61
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    572
    Thanks
    164
    Thanked
    582
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonja View Post
    I actually think the reason we s.l.u.t shame is more complicated in the context of sexual assault.

    It's often an attitude of self preservation. "She was asking for it", or "she encouraged it", give us some sense of protection that it won't happen to us. We think if we don't dress provocatively, or we don't dance provocatively, then it won't happen to us. But that's a red herring as its not about how a person dresses.

    I remember when Jill Maher went missing what was so confronting for so many of us was that she did nothing that unusual that put herself in harms way, yet she still was hurt.

    This is such a hard area as I have daughters and I don't want them to dress to attract attention, yet don't want them to feel shame for hiding themselves.
    I heard about people saying "why was she walking home alone at night?" about Jill Maher. People will always find a way to blame the woman. There was an article about a woman who was at home in her underwear when a man broke in and assaulted her. Guess what they said "she shouldn't have been half naked"...she was in her own house. It's so frustrating. And these same people critisize survivors for not coming forward. And these same people deny that there is a rape culture.

  2. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to hopeful1986 For This Useful Post:

    BettyW  (12-06-2016),KitiK  (11-06-2016),Wise Enough  (11-06-2016)

  3. #62
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    At the beach
    Posts
    10,495
    Thanks
    1,430
    Thanked
    9,003
    Reviews
    3
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 postsAmber Star - 2,000 postsAmethyst Star - 5,000 postsEmerald Star - 10,000 posts
    Awards:
    Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 17/10/14100 Posts in a week
    Quote Originally Posted by hopeful1986 View Post
    I heard about people saying "why was she walking home alone at night?" about Jill Maher. People will always find a way to blame the woman. There was an article about a woman who was at home in her underwear when a man broke in and assaulted her. Guess what they said "she shouldn't have been half naked"...she was in her own house. It's so frustrating. And these same people critisize survivors for not coming forward. And these same people deny that there is a rape culture.
    Re Jill maher though the only people who really said that weren't from inner city Melbourne. It's one of safest places I've ever felt. When we lived in north Fitzroy I'd regularly run from home to Brunswick at 10pm on a week night, or into the city. You never felt threatened. I think that's part of the reason so many felt confronted by what happened - it was all something so many of us have done before.

    But yep when I did criminal law we studied juries and attitudes to rape victims. Fascinating and frightening.

  4. #63
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    1,228
    Thanks
    1,043
    Thanked
    786
    Reviews
    2
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts
    Quote Originally Posted by maternidade View Post
    Sorry I should have been more clearer. I wasn't it a comparison to your situation it was a comparison to society siding with the victim. There have been numerous cases where a girl has dressed provocatively, flirted all night with verbal and non verbal communication, accepted drinks etc then willingly goes into a bathroom with a football player ( as an example), states yes at the time but then regrets her actions later and plays the victim. The media is to afraid to call it as it is in the fear they will be called victim blamers
    Have you see the consent as asking if they want tea analogy?

    http://metro.co.uk/2015/10/28/this-n...liant-5466392/

    Ok, so it isn't exactly like this, this is a very simplified analogy, but it works for the purposes. Say 2 people were sharing their teapots, and tea collection, discussing how wonderful another person's teapot looked and how they loved a good cup of tea, and extolling all the virtues of tea, and how wonderful high tea was, and so on and so forth. Would it then be right for one of those people to automatically assume that the other person wants tea, and force a cuppa on them? Yes, completely imperfect analogy, but I am sure you can work around the gaps and issues this analogy presents.

    Even if consent is given, it can then be refused at any time.

    Men are not prey to their "base instincts" any more than women are. In fact if a woman claimed the reason she raped a male was because he was walking around with skinny jeans/no shirt/a singlet/shorts, there is no way that would be viewed as an appropriate response, and the male would not in anyway be held accountable for walking around in whatever it was that he was wearing as a reason that he was raped.

    Assault is about power and control. The view that the woman is somehow accountable for her assault also leads to issues with men being assaulted in terms of reporting and being believed, etc.

    Just because a woman does not act or dress in the same manner as you does not mean she is "asking for it." Some people are naturally flirtatious. Some people are just naturally nice, or trying to not offend the person (I've seen men get cranky quite quickly when a woman who has literally done no more than smile and exchange polite pleasantries has refused a drink/dance/date). Accepting drinks/food/gifts does not mean that they want that to go any further. Some women dress for themselves (shocking thought I know). This is not about what the woman has "done," but why some men see that they have the right to react the way they do.

  5. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Tiny Dancer For This Useful Post:

    atomicmama  (11-06-2016),BettyV  (11-06-2016),BettyW  (12-06-2016),KitiK  (11-06-2016),Mokeybear  (11-06-2016),SSecret Squirrel  (11-06-2016)

  6. #64
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    12,705
    Thanks
    9,557
    Thanked
    12,687
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 postsAmber Star - 2,000 postsAmethyst Star - 5,000 postsEmerald Star - 10,000 posts
    Awards:
    Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 9/1/15Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 7/11/14Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 3/10/14100 Posts in a week
    Quote Originally Posted by turquoisecoast View Post
    men $lut shame as a way to exert control over women and keep them under the thumb.
    True. And women have been known to use their sexuality as a means of gaining control. (Not saying that's what's happened here).

  7. #65
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    12,705
    Thanks
    9,557
    Thanked
    12,687
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 postsAmber Star - 2,000 postsAmethyst Star - 5,000 postsEmerald Star - 10,000 posts
    Awards:
    Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 9/1/15Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 7/11/14Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 3/10/14100 Posts in a week
    Quote Originally Posted by atomicmama View Post
    By comparing a bull charging at a red flag with women having some accountability for others' reactions is ridiculous. Nothing, absolutely nothing, gives another person the right to assume permission based on the way a female (or male, but let's face it, majority of victim blaming is aimed at us) acts. Permission isn't based on assumptions; it's as clear as "yes".
    .
    In regards to physical touching I would agree with you.

    As for having a gawk I don't necessarily think verbal permission is necessary. In the ops case I think 2 ladies taking risqué photos in public implies permission has been given to others present to have a gawk.
    I think it's understandable and ok to make that assumption.

    There is no victim blaming in this particular case as there was no victim or perpretrator. A couple of ladies put on a show and a couple of guys had a gawk. No one was hurt (apart from the OPs DH).

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to VicPark For This Useful Post:

    amyd  (11-06-2016)

  9. #66
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    online
    Posts
    1,146
    Thanks
    247
    Thanked
    461
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts
    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    In regards to physical touching I would agree with you.

    As for having a gawk I don't necessarily think verbal permission is necessary. In the ops case I think 2 ladies taking risqué photos in public implies permission has been given to others present to have a gawk.
    I think it's understandable and ok to make that assumption.

    There is no victim blaming in this particular case as there was no victim or perpretrator. A couple of ladies put on a show and a couple of guys had a gawk. No one was hurt (apart from the OPs DH).
    I would have agreed with you if we were indeed 'putting on a show' but it was posing for photos, there was no show or putting on. Once those photos we taken we went back to talking to people. It was hardly a show.

  10. #67
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    12,705
    Thanks
    9,557
    Thanked
    12,687
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 postsAmber Star - 2,000 postsAmethyst Star - 5,000 postsEmerald Star - 10,000 posts
    Awards:
    Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 9/1/15Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 7/11/14Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 3/10/14100 Posts in a week

    Default My partner and I are debating. Need help.

    Quote Originally Posted by ElastiGirl View Post
    I would have agreed with you if we were indeed 'putting on a show' but it was posing for photos, there was no show or putting on. Once those photos we taken we went back to talking to people. It was hardly a show.
    You may not have intended it to be a show however it was. Taking risqué photos in public, costumes, legs flying in the air, no doubt a heap of chatter and giggling going on. Regardless of the intent it was a show and that is why the dudes came and gawked.

  11. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to VicPark For This Useful Post:

    amyd  (11-06-2016),maternidade  (11-06-2016)

  12. #68
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    online
    Posts
    1,146
    Thanks
    247
    Thanked
    461
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts

    Default My partner and I are debating. Need help.

    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    You may not have intended it to be a show however it was. Taking risqué photos in public, costumes, legs flying in the air, no doubt a heap of chatter and giggling going on. Regardless of the intent it was a show and that is why the dudes came and gawked.
    So are you saying that I am responsible for the way those men reacted and that my dp was well within his right to hold me responsible and accountable for the way those men acted out?

  13. #69
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    At the beach
    Posts
    10,495
    Thanks
    1,430
    Thanked
    9,003
    Reviews
    3
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 postsAmber Star - 2,000 postsAmethyst Star - 5,000 postsEmerald Star - 10,000 posts
    Awards:
    Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 17/10/14100 Posts in a week
    Quote Originally Posted by ElastiGirl View Post
    So are you saying that I am responsible for the way those men reacted and that my dp was well within his right to hold me responsible and accountable for the way those men acted out?
    I've only read your op and haven't seen the photos. Am I correct that all that happened was that a few guys said "she's wild" about your friend?

  14. #70
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    12,705
    Thanks
    9,557
    Thanked
    12,687
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 postsAmber Star - 2,000 postsAmethyst Star - 5,000 postsEmerald Star - 10,000 posts
    Awards:
    Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 9/1/15Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 7/11/14Busiest Member of the Week - week ended 3/10/14100 Posts in a week
    Quote Originally Posted by ElastiGirl View Post
    So are you saying that I am responsible for the way those men reacted and that my dp was well within his right to hold me responsible and accountable for the way those men acted out?
    Yes - at least 50% responsible. Unless there was additional factors not in the original post.

    Not having a dig - been there, done that myself in the younger days (albeit not in German costume).

  15. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to VicPark For This Useful Post:

    maternidade  (11-06-2016),michellead  (11-06-2016)


 

Similar Threads

  1. How do I leave my partner?
    By Gretchen in forum Single Parents
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-11-2016, 13:48
  2. Partner does nothing
    By fluffykitty in forum Feeling alone
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 16-04-2016, 21:35
  3. Centrelink Dad & Partner pay
    By MrsMummaButterfly in forum Family Finances
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 11-12-2015, 23:21

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
free weekly newsletters | sign up now!
who are these people who write great posts? meet our hubbub authors!
Learn how you can contribute to the hubbub!

reviews
learn how you can become a reviewer!

competitions

forum - chatting now
christmas gift guidesee all Red Stocking
Pebblebee
Parents spend hours looking for things they need NOW. The keys, the remote, darling daughter's treasured teddy. Stop wasting precious time looking & start finding with Bub Hub reviewed Pebblebee Smart Tag. Simply attach a Pebblebee and find it fast.
sales & new stuffsee all
The Health Hub
Give a new mum a fitness boost for Christmas & New Year. Studio-based, small group training sessions - cardio, strength, core, Pilates & boxing. Choice of 16 hrs per week, flexible-arrival feature - bubs & kids welcome! Gift vouchers available.
featured supporter
GymbaROO
GymbaROO offers activities for babies & toddlers in a fun learning centre, focussing on developmental education. Classes are available Australia-wide. Enrol today & help your child to reach their full potential. Visit the website to find out more.
gotcha
X

Pregnant for the first-time?

Not sure where to start? We can help!

Our Insider Programs for pregnancy first-timers will lead you step-by-step through the 14 Pregnancy Must Dos!