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  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moxy View Post
    I never said you did. My point is the two are not comparable. Genetic manipulation is possible. It is a door that could be opened. There is a rational, scientific ground for concern. There isn't with marriage equality. The only concern there is bigotry.
    I just wanted to be very clear. I still think as an analogy it's sound because I think both arguments are ridiculous but I see your point.

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  3. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frankenmum View Post
    Not trying to single you out, but just saw that your comment echoed some earlier posts, and my earlier response to this argument seems to have been lost amongst the fast pace of posts.

    So just wanted to raise it again as I'm in interested in people's thoughts on this -

    What really is the difference between gender dissapointment from only getting the non-preffered sex, or having a child of the preferred sex who doesn't live up to the gender stereotype?
    I don't think gender disappointment would have the same effect. My understanding of gd is you grieve the loss of a child you will never have but still love your actual children the same. But I guess everyone is different. I don't think the two possibilities are commesurable.

    My perspective is not really the disappointment of the parent not have a "girly girly" for example, but the impact on the child having to fit an arbitrary standard the parent has set. It isn't nice being valued only because of your gender.

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  5. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frankenmum View Post
    What really is the difference between gender dissapointment from only getting the non-preffered sex, or having a child of the preferred sex who doesn't live up to the gender stereotype?
    Good question. For the the key difference is the timing.
    One is shining a negative light on your baby before they have formed. One is shining a negative light on your child after they have become who they want to be.

    There are similarities. In both cases the parents are putting the focus on themselves and their needs, not the child. Both have the potential to damage the child and the parent/child relationship.

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  7. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by BettyW View Post
    We're not talking designer babies here - when you have a baby the first question is always 'boy or girl?' Some of us just want to have the opportunity to experience both.
    I don't think this should be the first question people ask. I think it's just enforcing gender sterotypes and inequality. It's where it starts.

    Eta. I guess my opinion is that gender should be a non-issue. And I'm not sure how that affects gender selection. But I don't want our society to get to a point like in China where they have 17 million men who will never find at partner because the gender ratio is skewed so much by past policies (which I believe they have recently relaxed as it's becoming a problem).
    Last edited by AdornedWithCats; 22-05-2016 at 09:15.

  8. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdornedWithCats View Post
    I don't think this should be the first question people ask. I think it's just enforcing gender sterotypes and inequality. It's where it starts.
    I don't think so. It's only one question out of many that you ask.

    I didn't know the sex of 2 of my babies when they were born. Was I supposed to ask a bunch of other questions first?

  9. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonja View Post
    I don't think so. It's only one question out of many that you ask.

    I didn't know the sex of 2 of my babies when they were born. Was I supposed to ask a bunch of other questions first?
    I'm not talking about the parents...I'm talking about extended family, friends etc. How about "how is your pregnancy going", or "are both Mum and bub healthy"?

    The two biggest questions I got when pregnant were "do you know what your having" and "which hospital are you going to". Both which annoyed me a lot.

    Anyway, we'll have to agree to disagree that it's where gender inequality starts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AdornedWithCats View Post
    I'm not talking about the parents...I'm talking about extended family, friends etc. How about "how is your pregnancy going", or "are both Mum and bub healthy"?

    The two biggest questions I got when pregnant were "do you know what your having" and "which hospital are you going to". Both which annoyed me a lot.

    Anyway, we'll have to agree to disagree that it's where gender inequality starts.
    People ask these questions as they are showing an interest in your pregnancy and it's the first things that pop into their head. I don't think it has anything to do with gender inequality.

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  12. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdornedWithCats View Post
    I'm not talking about the parents...I'm talking about extended family, friends etc. How about "how is your pregnancy going", or "are both Mum and bub healthy"?

    The two biggest questions I got when pregnant were "do you know what your having" and "which hospital are you going to". Both which annoyed me a lot.

    Anyway, we'll have to agree to disagree that it's where gender inequality starts.
    Again I think this probably comes back to your own life experiences. As I had zero expectation of what sex any of my babies would be to me it's just another question. Honestly it has not really occurred to me (before Bubhub) that parents would be that invested in the sex of their baby.

    My second pregnancy was a high risk pregnancy and I didn't care one jot what she was just that she came at full term and had 10 fingers and 10 toes. My first question to the ob when she was born was actually "is it ok?" My obstetrician said "she's perfect" and I knew then she was a girl. It dawned on me later I didn't even ask.

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  14. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyno1onboard View Post
    People ask these questions as they are showing an interest in your pregnancy and it's the first things that pop into their head. I don't think it has anything to do with gender inequality.
    People would say to dh "you must be so excited to be having a boy!" He would reply that he didn't care and would be just as happy having a daughter. Often they would be shocked or surprised that dh wouldn't be disappointed having a girl.

    I know it's just our experience but we find ds is sterotyped all the time...it's been constant since he was born. So I don't see it as separate from those original questions of "what are you having".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alicia111 View Post
    A friend of mine is against the blood test as she has heard of a couple using it to determine whether they would keep the baby.
    I know this is potentially opening up a whole other can of worms, but don't the majority of people use pre-natal tests (harmony, NT, CVS) to determine if they will keep the baby?

    It is just my opinion, and I always feel in the minority with this, but I feel that all those tests are the beginning of the slippery slope. Soon more and more 'problems' will become a medical reason to terminate that can be tested for. We're potentially going to be stripping out all our gene diversity.

    Sorry, I know my view upsets people who have chosen to medically terminate for trisomies etc.

    I know that it feels like a bit of a tangent, but many would argue that certain medical conditions create a great financial and emotional strain on families and financial burden on society. Yet in some cultures girl children are seen as a burden, requiring large dowries to be married off etc.

    I struggled reading gender disappointment thread titles while TTC my 2nd with 2 miscarriages along the way. But I am not them, I don't know their journey and what got them to that point. I'm sure many who were struggling to conceive their first thought I should stop sooking and just be happy that I have a child.

    I do like the idea of compulsory counseling to work through the reasons for sex selection. I just don't know who decides what is an appropriate reason.

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