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  1. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by binnielici View Post
    I agree that it is probably human nature to do it. It is how we express it that matters.

    I am far less judgmental than I used to be. As I get older I realise very little of what we see of people is actually real.

    I do try to keep my thoughts to myself if they are negative. Having been on the receiving end of judgmental behaviour many times in my life I know how hurtful it can be - particularly when the judgments are unjustified and based on limited information.
    Exactly this

  2. #142
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    Default Spinoff - when does it become okay to judge?

    Quote Originally Posted by A-Squared View Post
    But I (and others) are now apparently not allowed to say we think the actions of another parent are selfish, because God forbid we can't disagree with the BH majority! But we would be justified in making a dig about other 'big' issues in parenting, just not this.... I don't get why!?
    I think i may have an explanation.
    Could be right, could be wrong, I'll put it out there anyway.

    Judging is still a practice that is frowned upon publicly (as it's not PC) yet it is revered and practiced in private. So it's ok to judge as long as you don't highlight the judgement by making a whole thread out of it. Or as long as the judgement isn't highlighted by tonnes of people (aka the BH majority or clique) saying they disagree. Keep the judgement to little digs here and there in threads and it's more acceptable (the more covert the better so you can claim the "whoopsie I didn't mean to judge" defence).

    So as long as judging isn't in your face it's fine.

    On that note I'm going to rephrase my feedback on the original thread that sparked this spinoff:

    Regarding the finches, it's totally their choice I don't understand how people think they have a right to butt in. That being said (no offence or nothing) it's not a choice I would make as I value the time I spend with my kids. If they want to choose to not spend 2 nights per week with their kid - fine. Good luck to them.

    (But y'all still know what I'm really thinking!)
    Last edited by VicPark; 14-05-2016 at 08:04.

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  4. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    You're missing the point - it's not about total hours, it's about the hours that a parent could have chosen to be with their kid but *chose* not to for reasons some perceive as *self indulgent* and *frivolous* reasons.

    While I'm at it - geesus poeple.
    Stop comparing someone who gives up *2 nights per week* with their kid so they can shag their husband with someone who puts their kid in childcare so they can earn a living.
    It's like me comparing SAHM's with dole bludgers. I mean both *choose* to stay at home and both usually receive some form of benefit from the Government to do so. Not.the.same. The comparison is offensive.
    Not comparing it to people who work to earn the minimum they need to get by, comparing it to people who work extra than what they need to or who don't need to work at all from a financial perspective.

    I'm going back to work in a couple of weeks, we don't need the money, we could scrape by without my salary by cutting back a few 'luxuries' but I'm going bat **** insane being a full time stay at home parent. So much so that I'm still actually investing my time in this thread!! I'm comparing Rachel's situation to that. We are both giving up time with our child when we don't 'need' to. Maybe my situation isn't acceptable in your eyes, and that's fine, but in general it's accepted in our society and therefore I think Rachel is unfairly getting scrutinised. And yes she would be silly to think that wouldn't happen.

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  6. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    Yes I applaud her for using her village...to relax with her hubby 2 nights every.single.week. Not!
    Yeah, I mean, come on!
    If she's not suffering like the rest of us then she's not really living in the real (parenting) world!

    I think two nights a week is pure indulgence and my conscience wouldn't let me do that but if I got the offer of no kids once a fortnight I'd be all overt that! Oh yeah

    Also, if they need two nights a week off parenting duty then they probably shouldn't have any more kids.

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  8. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phony View Post
    As for when it's OK to judge.
    I don't think we can control it, but we can control our mouths and who we might *gossip to. I have to say, I'm much more judgemental now after having kids, than I was before. Before kids I just didn't give a hoot who was doing what. It was only my business if it crossed my path. Now I watch everything, I'm concerned with a lot more going on around me and yep I judge (inwardly). I definitely think we should do it. Our world is relatively small and we need to make decisions every day on who we let in to our lives, judgment when done right and not some idiot behind a keyboard plastering for all the world to read, is healthy imo.
    I agree with this 100%. I've called BS on here when people say they never judge - it is a vital survival strategy. Assess each situation and make a judgement based on our experience and knowledge. I don't call expressing those views outwardly 'judging' I call it criticising or complimenting.

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  10. #146
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    In regards to the OP, it's only natural to judge. I mostly keep those judgements to myself because they are just judgey mcjudgey thoughts. The only time I believe it's ok is when a life is at risk, not just because something goes against our beliefs or something we wouldn't personally do. I don't agree with circ because I personally feel it is unnecessary amongst a few other things but I don't judge others for doing it because a life is no one is at risk.

    Consider the following.. .

    "Hi BH. This is my first post here. I'm after some advice and I'm torn on what I should do. Due to work commitments, Dh and I hardly see eachother. I work days and he works nights. We decided when Dd was born that we would do this so Dd didn't have to spend so much time in CC but it's now having a negative impact on our marriage. I find Dd difficult at times and her behavior is not ideal and I often feel depressed because I can't cater to both her and Dh needs let alone myself. Although I feel blessed that my job is flexible enough to allow me to spend every day with Dd, it's requirements are often demanding with some very long days. The only time we see eachother is Friday night to Monday morning (which includes some public appearances for work for me where Dh and I attend as 'happy' couple), and I can't even remember the last time he we were intimate. I love my husband and we feel like we are neglecting eachother and falling apart. I'm really struggling to cope with this and can feel PND creeping back.

    I have a great relationship with MIL and she has offered to have Dd on the weekends from Friday night to Sunday morning then we can spend all day Sunday together as a family. Dh and I both feel that this could work. We can spend time together to rebuild our relationship and Dd gets to spend quality time with her grandmother who she absolutely adores. I do feel that two nights might be too much and I will miss her terribly, but for a few other reasons it is the only option."

    Sooo, I know exactly how we would all respond to a post like this. We would be encouraging her to take MIL offer. We wouldn't question any other motives. We wouldn't say she just wanted uniteruppted shag time and many of us would be saying how much we wished we had more support.

    We don't know the full Finch story and despite not being what we may be comfortable doing with our own children we have no right to judge even if she has left herself open to it. Being a public figure doesn't mean we can criticise her parenting choices. The mummy shaming needs to stop, especially when a family unit is happy and healthy.

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  12. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    You're missing the point - it's not about total hours, it's about the hours that a parent could have chosen to be with their kid but *chose* not to for reasons some perceive as *self indulgent* and *frivolous* reasons.

    While I'm at it - geesus poeple.
    Stop comparing someone who gives up *2 nights per week* with their kid so they can shag their husband with someone who puts their kid in childcare so they can earn a living.
    It's like me comparing SAHM's with dole bludgers. I mean both *choose* to stay at home and both usually receive some form of benefit from the Government to do so. Not.the.same. The comparison is offensive.
    It's only being compared as a break down of hours. At the end of the week she spends a decent chunk of time with her daughter...so why does the internet get to tell her how she should spend her child free time?
    That's my point that you're missing (I get your point btw...I just don't find it awful that she chooses to be indulgent). We shouldn't be judging how someone spends their free time, or how much of it they need. If a woman is a better mother because she regulalry recharges her batteries (and may need more time than others), or a child grows up in a loving family because their parents invest a good chunk of time to each other every week to keep their relationship strong, then we can choose to just accept that there is a child growing up feeling loved, safe and secure and raised by family in a dynamic that is different to the majority. Different doesn't mean wrong, and the negative judgement surrounding this is that it's wrong. We don't know the back story...we don't know her mental health or relationship history...we know none of it. She's being judged on face value. I take issue with that. I also take issue with mothers slamming mothers about how they choose to spend their spare time. As if once you've had a child you have to live by the 'rules' or be judged severely. What purpose does it serve? Live and let live.

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  14. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ngaiz View Post
    In regards to the OP, it's only natural to judge. I mostly keep those judgements to myself because they are just judgey mcjudgey thoughts. The only time I believe it's ok is when a life is at risk, not just because something goes against our beliefs or something we wouldn't personally do. I don't agree with circ because I personally feel it is unnecessary amongst a few other things but I don't judge others for doing it because a life is no one is at risk.

    Consider the following.. .

    "Hi BH. This is my first post here. I'm after some advice and I'm torn on what I should do. Due to work commitments, Dh and I hardly see eachother. I work days and he works nights. We decided when Dd was born that we would do this so Dd didn't have to spend so much time in CC but it's now having a negative impact on our marriage. I find Dd difficult at times and her behavior is not ideal and I often feel depressed because I can't cater to both her and Dh needs let alone myself. Although I feel blessed that my job is flexible enough to allow me to spend every day with Dd, it's requirements are often demanding with some very long days. The only time we see eachother is Friday night to Monday morning (which includes some public appearances for work for me where Dh and I attend as 'happy' couple), and I can't even remember the last time he we were intimate. I love my husband and we feel like we are neglecting eachother and falling apart. I'm really struggling to cope with this and can feel PND creeping back.

    I have a great relationship with MIL and she has offered to have Dd on the weekends from Friday night to Sunday morning then we can spend all day Sunday together as a family. Dh and I both feel that this could work. We can spend time together to rebuild our relationship and Dd gets to spend quality time with her grandmother who she absolutely adores. I do feel that two nights might be too much and I will miss her terribly, but for a few other reasons it is the only option."

    Sooo, I know exactly how we would all respond to a post like this. We would be encouraging her to take MIL offer. We wouldn't question any other motives. We wouldn't say she just wanted uniteruppted shag time and many of us would be saying how much we wished we had more support.

    We don't know the full Finch story and despite not being what we may be comfortable doing with our own children we have no right to judge even if she has left herself open to it. Being a public figure doesn't mean we can criticise her parenting choices. The mummy shaming needs to stop, especially when a family unit is happy and healthy.
    👏👏👏

  15. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ngaiz View Post
    In regards to the OP, it's only natural to judge. I mostly keep those judgements to myself because they are just judgey mcjudgey thoughts. The only time I believe it's ok is when a life is at risk, not just because something goes against our beliefs or something we wouldn't personally do. I don't agree with circ because I personally feel it is unnecessary amongst a few other things but I don't judge others for doing it because a life is no one is at risk.

    Consider the following.. .

    "Hi BH. This is my first post here. I'm after some advice and I'm torn on what I should do. Due to work commitments, Dh and I hardly see eachother. I work days and he works nights. We decided when Dd was born that we would do this so Dd didn't have to spend so much time in CC but it's now having a negative impact on our marriage. I find Dd difficult at times and her behavior is not ideal and I often feel depressed because I can't cater to both her and Dh needs let alone myself. Although I feel blessed that my job is flexible enough to allow me to spend every day with Dd, it's requirements are often demanding with some very long days. The only time we see eachother is Friday night to Monday morning (which includes some public appearances for work for me where Dh and I attend as 'happy' couple), and I can't even remember the last time he we were intimate. I love my husband and we feel like we are neglecting eachother and falling apart. I'm really struggling to cope with this and can feel PND creeping back.

    I have a great relationship with MIL and she has offered to have Dd on the weekends from Friday night to Sunday morning then we can spend all day Sunday together as a family. Dh and I both feel that this could work. We can spend time together to rebuild our relationship and Dd gets to spend quality time with her grandmother who she absolutely adores. I do feel that two nights might be too much and I will miss her terribly, but for a few other reasons it is the only option."

    Sooo, I know exactly how we would all respond to a post like this. We would be encouraging her to take MIL offer. We wouldn't question any other motives. We wouldn't say she just wanted uniteruppted shag time and many of us would be saying how much we wished we had more support.

    We don't know the full Finch story and despite not being what we may be comfortable doing with our own children we have no right to judge even if she has left herself open to it. Being a public figure doesn't mean we can criticise her parenting choices. The mummy shaming needs to stop, especially when a family unit is happy and healthy.
    Exactly!!!!!!!

    Thank you. As a previous shift worker and a partner of a husband who works random hours I understand the need for some quality couple and alone time.

    I find it odd that grandparental care is less welcome than child care. Often parents are advised to put thru Kids in CC for respite even if not working. But grandparents??? No way.

    Very very bizarre.

  16. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Squared View Post
    It's because there are so many perfect people who don't judge and think everyone is wonderful.... Unless they disagree with them then ���������������� ���������������� ��������

    I'm admittedly a bit tipsy right now and so feel okay to say.... This thread highlights the hypocrisy that is BH.

    SOOOOOOOO many of you who are sticking up for her are always the first to have a dig at others on BH when they disagree with how they treat their children. And that's okay apparently,

    But I (and others) are now apparently not allowed to say we think the actions of another parent are selfish, because God forbid we can't disagree with the BH majority! But we would be justified in making a dig about other 'big' issues in parenting, just not this.... I don't get why!?
    I certainly don't think you are being judgmental, I think we just have different perceptions, that's all. Same with VP. I do get where both of you are coming from, truly. 2 days in our home every week just wouldn't happen, bc we are child centered, it doesn't fit with our parenting style.

    I just don't see working beyond paying the essentials as any more of a valid/reasonable/appropriate reason to be away from your kids than their reason. I don't feel money is any more a good reason that parental bonding.

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