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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Renesme View Post
    I think each public school needs to get money based on their needs rather than just having money poured into it for the sake of it because it's "equal". I don't think that private schools should necessarily get as much funding as public schools but they should certainly be entitled to some money.
    I think that's what most of us are advocating though - needs based funding with some money still going to private schools but only to top up the cost per child to educate. If a school charges above that 10-13k and parents want to pay that, great. But they should not be entitled to anything above those fees. Anything above that is just widening the gap.
    Last edited by delirium; 12-04-2016 at 15:00.

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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    Of course! Air con is a basic necessity and the govt (Lib and Labor) should be ashamed that this issue still exists. To be fair, we put in the hard yards and apply for every grant we are applicable for, so it wasn't part of our basic funding.

    But having ipads, which I frankly see as a necessity in this day and age is a world away from swimming pools. Saying that somehow our school is blessed to have them and putting them in the same sentence as pools against those that don't have air con isn't fair or logical. The fact that ipads in a public school seems so amazing really highlights my point here. It shouldn't be amazing it should be standard.

    As a teacher you know the value of these items to bridging the gap for low income families who don't have one at home and the equity issues that exist if schools don't provide a few per classroom.

    I'm not sure I would consider it a 'drama'. It's a very valid discussion about the haves and have nots and whether the tax payer should be funding rich schools that simply don't need it.
    That's an interesting view about the ipads being a neccessity. Our (private) school doesnt have ipads, I wouldnt have seen them as a basic need. We do have interactive whiteboards though. ETA - my school does have an unusual view on screen time, though. Stats say that kids get 5 hours a day screen time at home, so we tend to limit their use at school.

    Probably a poor choice of words with drama'. I juat mean the us vs them, private vs public mentality. I do think it's a great discussion to be had.
    Last edited by cheeeeesecake; 12-04-2016 at 15:00.

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  4. #83
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    Given the movement in technology, yes I do consider it a necessity, particularly as I said, that lots of low SES families don't have access to these at home. Therefore these kids aren't being exposed to them.

    I guess every school is different. Our local catholic high makes each family fork out almost a grand per child for laptops on top of fees and it's non negotiable.

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    Funny how the air conditioning debate comes up! My last private school before I went on msternity leave finally got air conditioning. Because the p&f raised money for it.
    My friend's public school doesn't have it - and will never have it because the classrooms weren't built for them. Asbestos! No insulation etc etc. So they need new buildings. However they have an awesome IT program.
    A public school I worked in recently had 2 ovals..air conditioning. ..tennis courts and a swimming pool! !
    Another private school I know gives laptops at enrolment. .and another makes parents all buy surface pros for year 4 and up.

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  7. #85
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    The link won't work because it comes from a rival parenting page, so I've pasted part of an interview with Simon Birmingham, Federal Minster for Education and Training. If you want to read the full article, it's called "Every child deserves some support from the government" and is from kid.spot


    Why are private schools funded from the public purse?

    There’s a big disparity between what a government school gets per student versus a private school. In NSW the funding for a government school student sits at around $16,000 per student. In a private school it’s around $9,000. It’s been accepted since the 1960s that every child deserves some support from the government.

    In recent years, at a federal government level, our funding for government schools is growing faster than for private schools.

    Ed’s note: It’s true that Federal rates of funding have slowed for private schools and risen for state schools. The states and territories are funding in the opposite direction - decreasing their funding for state schools and increasing for private schools. Overall, total government funding for public schools fell by $224 per student, in real terms, between 2009 and 2013 while funding rose by $716 per student for Catholic schools and $574 per student in independent schools.

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  9. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by cheeeeesecake View Post
    That's an interesting view about the ipads being a neccessity. Our (private) school doesnt have ipads, I wouldnt have seen them as a basic need. We do have interactive whiteboards though. ETA - my school does have an unusual view on screen time, though. Stats say that kids get 5 hours a day screen time at home, so we tend to limit their use at school.

    Probably a poor choice of words with drama'. I juat mean the us vs them, private vs public mentality. I do think it's a great discussion to be had.
    The kids from your school probably have them at home.

    We have children who don't have access to the Internet or a computer or any other device.

  10. #87
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    Default Taxpayers fund private school orchestra pits and swimming pools...

    Quote Originally Posted by atomicmama View Post
    The link won't work because it comes from a rival parenting page, so I've pasted part of an interview with Simon Birmingham, Federal Minster for Education and Training. If you want to read the full article, it's called "Every child deserves some support from the government" and is from kid.spot


    Why are private schools funded from the public purse?

    There’s a big disparity between what a government school gets per student versus a private school. In NSW the funding for a government school student sits at around $16,000 per student. In a private school it’s around $9,000. It’s been accepted since the 1960s that every child deserves some support from the government.

    In recent years, at a federal government level, our funding for government schools is growing faster than for private schools.

    Ed’s note: It’s true that Federal rates of funding have slowed for private schools and risen for state schools. The states and territories are funding in the opposite direction - decreasing their funding for state schools and increasing for private schools. Overall, total government funding for public schools fell by $224 per student, in real terms, between 2009 and 2013 while funding rose by $716 per student for Catholic schools and $574 per student in independent schools.
    I think Simon Birmingham is telling lies.

    http://www.saveourschools.com.au/fun...-be-overhauled

    For those who like graphs

    http://www.saveourschools.com.au/file_download/207
    Last edited by BigRedV; 12-04-2016 at 15:55.

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  12. #88
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    Default Taxpayers fund private school orchestra pits and swimming pools...


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  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRedV View Post
    Then an exclusive private school like Pymble Ladies' College gets $25795 per child. But the local high school down the road (Killara) only gets $11691 in comparison. I really don't think that's fair. But again, makes me proud of everything public schools achieve.
    The government contribution to Pymble is about $3000. So $22k comes from parents.

    I know 'government' funding for schools is an emotive issue. I often get frustrated when people compare federal contributions to public (state) schools and private or independent schools. States are constitutionally responsible for their schools. Historically, Federal Governments have contributed towards non-government schools. It evolved into also topping up state school funding. And now all of a sudden if they aren't meeting the entire cost of educating children through the state system they are doing the wrong thing.

    What's the solution? Abolish all non-government schools and specifically tax parents that were previously paying $30k a year at their private school so that money can go towards their local state school?

    I agree with BigRed that the quality of teaching isn't automatically better at private schools, and per student funding certainly isn't a way to judge the quality of teaching - nor is naplan, of course. But the fact remains, parents want options, the States have no obligations to fund independent schools so the federal government does. It doesn't have an obligation to fund state schools, yet it does as well.

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    I nearly started a spin off thread about airconditioning but will have my rant here.

    I think it is an exorbitant waste of money to install aircon in all classrooms, for what two really hot months of the year - Feb and Nov. At state schools (in Qld) the P and F needs to fund the purchase, running costs and maintenance of airconditioning units. Our school is currently raising money to install it in every classroom. It will cost in excess of $300k and the P and F will also need to find the money to pay for running costs on top of that. It makes me feel sick to the stomach when I think of how that money could be better spent. For example the school is grossly underfunded when it comes to supporting children with additional needs. I understand that the P and F raise money for extras, and funding for teachers aides etc come from government funding. But sheesh, something is very broken with the system when the P and F is rich enough to commit current and future parent's money to something as ridiculous as air conditioning when there are so poorly underfunded in other areas. I have doubts that air conditioning would improve learning outcomes in classrooms in most of Australia. (note, I said most, far north Qld, WA and Northern Territory may be a different story). I have concerns our children are becoming so precious that they can't be expected to cope with temperature fluctuations, and wider concerns about the environmental impact of the unnecessary use of resources in the manufacture and running of the units.

    **phew off my soap box**

    RE ipads and computers.

    I have a personal dislike for apple products in general so am not a fan of ipads at schools. That aside, I think it is vital in todays world that all schools have the resources available to incorporate the use of technology into the curriculum. I find it hard to be supportive of BYOD programs because they discriminate against children in low SES areas and I don't think students should be on them all day everyday.

    I do strongly support the idea of having school purchased banks of laptops and ipads available for use by students at school in their lessons. So not enough devices for every child, but enough for them to be on rotation around the school or in dedicated technology labs and for every student to access them as needed.


 

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