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  1. #161
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    I dont think anyone was criticising anyone else on here for their school choices. I know the discussion went on a number of tangents, but the core issue is about government funding for private schools. No one was asked to defend their choices, as far as I can see. This is definitely a loaded topic, same as when people talk about private hospitals vs public when having a baby (I vote private! so sue me ).

    On the topic of selective schools, this makes me question whether its even fair to look at school rankings, since the highest academic achievers will always get into selective schools, and the majority of non-denominational parents would rather have their kids go to a free selective high school that is among the top performing in the country, than pay thousands of dollars for private school. This leaves the rest of the student population which is made up of students who didnt sit for or didn't succeed in placing in a selective school, or who for whatever reason, their parents didnt want to go to a selective school.. Now please correct me if I'm wrong, but private schools (let's say, non-catholic, just for this argument) are also selective with their students. They can only take X-amount of students per year, and I believe they will give preference to students with exceptional grades or who show some form of talent?

    Given the above, is it really surprising that private schools often outperform public schools? They are under no obligation to take in children with learning difficulties, and children from low socio-economic backgrounds generally cant afford to attend. My point is, I think the 2 major contributing factors to a student's academic achievements are socio-econimic background and natural intelligence. The fact that a person's parents can afford to send them to a private school is not a crucial factor, and neither is whether the school has beautiful facilities etc.

    FWIW, in NSW, out of the top 10 HSC results in 2015, #1-8 were selective and the last 2 were private (ranked #10, was Sydney Grammar School -Darlinghurst; the average school fee parents paid per child was $31291 ).

    The top 2 non-selective government schools were Willoughby Girls High School and Killara High School (#51 and #57)

    The school with the highest government contribution per child ($27,588 ) was the Conservatorium high school which is a selective creative arts school near Sydney opera house.

  2. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    I'm certainly not asking people to justify, like I said, I was honestly just interested. Maybe I'm just really lucky to be in a community with great public schools, small class sizes etc so I'm not really exposed to many of the reasons people choose private. Thus why I asked.
    DSS 1 and DSS 2 go to a private school (it's the most elite in our area but not sure if it's as elite as the schools others have described) because DF grew up in a low SEC area, went to crappy schools and wants to give his kids all of the opportunities he never had. Whether a private school offers more than the local public school in terms of opportunities I'm not sure (and agree it's very debatable) but that's DF's perception. I'm concerned that we won't be able to afford the fees once DDSs are at high school and DD starts primary. It will be about $40K a year and I'm already stressed about it!!

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  4. #163
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    @witherwings I wasn't really referring to this thread there was one a few months back that got quite heated about people's choices about private schools.

    As for how they select their students, I only know how ours works and it's based on waiting lists. You go on and you wait. They let my daughter in half way through prep because she has an extremely high IQ but also an extreme anxiety condition. Yes she may give them great academic results but we also ask a lot of them in terms of extra time settling her.

    They have many kids with additional needs. They have a girl with Down's syndrome in kindy this year.

    So no your impression doesn't match the reality of my girls school.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonja View Post
    @witherwings I wasn't really referring to this thread there was one a few months back that got quite heated about people's choices about private schools.

    As for how they select their students, I only know how ours works and it's based on waiting lists. You go on and you wait. They let my daughter in half way through prep because she has an extremely high IQ but also an extreme anxiety condition. Yes she may give them great academic results but we also ask a lot of them in terms of extra time settling her.

    They have many kids with additional needs. They have a girl with Down's syndrome in kindy this year.

    So no your impression doesn't match the reality of my girls school.
    Ours either - My old school and DS school have a life skills class in high school for mild to moderate intellectual disabilities and run a disabled sports programme as well

    I'm sure they can be picky and if you were an old student at DS school your son gets automatic entry ( DH wasn't so we were on the waiting list) but my SIL went private with her Aspergers daughter as the public school didn't give her enough support and my other niece who moved private in 4th class didn't have the best school reports and they still took her!

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    I also find the views on private schools on bub hub the same as sonja and elijahsmum. There seems to be a perception here (sometimes) that others cannot understand why you would choose private school etc. And that it's about results or status etc. I think some of those views are perpetuated by those with limited experience of private schools too.
    Having gone to public school. ..plus what would be called an 'elite' girls school and another high school that's private with an excellent reputation. ... plus working as a teacher in both private and public schools I have to say that this kind of view is warped.
    Most people choose private for religious preferences or smaller classes or extra curricular activities. There are many many private schools in my area all varying in sizes and some new public schools cropping up due to population explosion.
    Many private schools have enrolment numbers under 1000 or over 1400... as the number in between is a bit of a bad business model actually. There's a lot of debate over the idea of a 'small big school ' versus 'big small school'.... where you are considered small but can offer the activities and facilities that larger schools can etc.

    Private schooling is a huge part of our culture and it really is only a small number of people who perpetuate the views about status etc. Or uni placements. When lots of private schools I know also offer extra studies for TAFE etc.
    Plus there's a huge secondary school I know that is considered an Independent public school. They have impressive facilities and are very well known for sporting achievements too.

    Also lots of public schools are going for IB accreditation so that's not only part of private schooling culture.

    See it is all relative. Many opinions are clouded by their own local environment etc. As are mine no doubt.

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  8. #166
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    You know what? I'm undoubtedly in the minority, but I don't believe students should receive the same government funding regardless of sector. I think that if parents want to pay for a different kind of schooling then that's fine, but it needn't be subsidised by the state.

    Yes, private schooling means less of a 'burden' on the public system, but it also means that a significant proportion of the population are no longer invested in quality public education. If you feel that you can easily opt out and find something better, what motivation do you have to demand improvements in the public system? You know, the system which is the only option for many children, including the most disadvantaged.

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  10. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonja View Post
    @witherwings I wasn't really referring to this thread there was one a few months back that got quite heated about people's choices about private schools.

    As for how they select their students, I only know how ours works and it's based on waiting lists. You go on and you wait. They let my daughter in half way through prep because she has an extremely high IQ but also an extreme anxiety condition. Yes she may give them great academic results but we also ask a lot of them in terms of extra time settling her.

    They have many kids with additional needs. They have a girl with Down's syndrome in kindy this year.

    So no your impression doesn't match the reality of my girls school.
    Ah ok, I'm sorry you have had that experience, and also sorry that you've had to defend your choice. What a strange thing to do have to.. Obviously parents choices are based on what is best for their children and their family. What is there to defend?

    On the topic of how students are selected for private placement, I did a little investigating and it looks like the waiting list is only the first stage. I'm not sure how reliable this information is, but here is the usual process, according to this site: https://www.schoolplaces.com.au/arti...olment-process

    Applying for a school.


    The start of the enrolment process is often the most complicated step for parents. While some schools don’t have a waitlist for prospective students (meaning they accept students on a ‘first-come, first-served’ basis), other schools do.


    It’s important to note, that a waitlist is often a reflection of parents’ demand for a particular year level at a school and doesn’t necessarily mean its quality of teaching is superior to schools without one. Waitlists are mainly used for key intake years such as pre-grade 1 (Prep/Kinder/Reception) or Year 7. For those year levels, getting your child’s name down early on a waitlist can be an advantage. Expect to pay a waitlist fee and to wait until around two years out from the enrolment year before receiving an admission offer. As there’s no guarantee a child on a waitlist will receive an admission offer, many parents opt to play it safe and put their child’s name down at multiple schools.


    If you didn’t manage to register your child on a waitlist upon leaving hospital after their birth, don’t panic! There are other options to consider. Sometimes enrolling your child in an earlier or later year level, where there may be less demand, is a way to secure a spot at the same school. Doing a quick search on School Places will also reveal which schools in your area may have last minute, unexpected vacancies that they’re looking to fill for the year level that you’re after.


    The next step is to prepare for the enrolment form completion. For this, parents need to collect and submit copies of their child’s key documents, such as a birth certificate, immunisation records and sometimes baptism certificates, if the private school is affiliated with a religion. This will kick start the next round of the enrolment process - interviewing and testing.


    Interviewing and Testing.


    In order to process a student’s application, a school will invite the student to attend a personal interview and, depending on the school and the intake year, sit a series of tests.


    For students entering primary school, it may simply be a basic Q&A session with your child. For children of this age, schools are generally looking for language abilities to help them identify whether the child may require education assistance.


    For students entering secondary school, this step is a more rigorous process. Aside from reviewing the student’s past academic records and evaluating their interests, the school may expect all applicants to complete written tests, aptitude tests, language tests and numeric reasoning tests.


    Students entering secondary school years will be interviewed, too. During this step, schools examine the general presentation of a student - if they are well-spoken, can converse and if they fit in well with the school’s culture.

  11. #168
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    I haven't read the whole thread..

    The my children have been to 4 different private schools.
    The selection process for 3 have been the same.
    I ring and ask if they have spots available and than we had a interview with the principal. The interviews have been to see if their school suit us.
    The other ds1 had to a trade test to see if he had the right skill set for his choose trade as there was only 11 spots available and the school services 1/2 of qld. They have a live in option for out of town kids.
    I have 4 kids with special needs. It never been a problem.

  12. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamtam View Post
    I also find the views on private schools on bub hub the same as sonja and elijahsmum. There seems to be a perception here (sometimes) that others cannot understand why you would choose private school etc. And that it's about results or status etc. I think some of those views are perpetuated by those with limited experience of private schools too.
    Having gone to public school. ..plus what would be called an 'elite' girls school and another high school that's private with an excellent reputation. ... plus working as a teacher in both private and public schools I have to say that this kind of view is warped.
    Most people choose private for religious preferences or smaller classes or extra curricular activities. There are many many private schools in my area all varying in sizes and some new public schools cropping up due to population explosion.
    Many private schools have enrolment numbers under 1000 or over 1400... as the number in between is a bit of a bad business model actually. There's a lot of debate over the idea of a 'small big school ' versus 'big small school'.... where you are considered small but can offer the activities and facilities that larger schools can etc.

    Private schooling is a huge part of our culture and it really is only a small number of people who perpetuate the views about status etc. Or uni placements. When lots of private schools I know also offer extra studies for TAFE etc.
    Plus there's a huge secondary school I know that is considered an Independent public school. They have impressive facilities and are very well known for sporting achievements too.

    Also lots of public schools are going for IB accreditation so that's not only part of private schooling culture.

    See it is all relative. Many opinions are clouded by their own local environment etc. As are mine no doubt.
    When people say "I cannot understand why.." I feel like they might be baiting or deliberately acting obtuse.. Not saying everyone who asks this question has the same motivation, but I just can't imagine that its so hard to comprehend why people would send their children to non-government schools, or choose to move to another catchment area (we are currently in this boat) - and honestly, who cares what the reason is?

    However - you mentioned "results or status etc" being reasons that are "perpetuated by those with limited experience of private schools". Are you saying that results and status are not reasons for sending children to certain schools? I wholeheartedly disagree with this. I'm not saying anyone needs to justify their reason, but results and status, among many other things (culture, religion, values, discipline, resources, reputation, proximity, community, opportunities, extra-curricular etc..) are definitely part of the reason that many would choose one school over another.

    I personally couldn't send my children to a religious school, and unfortunately for us, all of the private schools in our area are religious. My brother and I went to a religious school as children (I only attended for 2 years and that was enough for me). Thankfully for us though, the local public schools here are all amazing.

  13. #170
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    @witherwings I am simply saying that status or results are a small factor generally.

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