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  1. #71
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    I work in the health industry very often in the private sector. I can confidently say that there are many older patients getting arduous treatments for diseases they will not survive.

    So their remaining months are spent tubed up in a hospital vs palliative care at home.

    Often this is done at the adult kids request - "save my mom/dad". I've seen doctors fear mongering some people into treatment they cannot afford or survive.

    Then I've seen other doctors try and talk people's family out of treatment as its extremely debilitating.

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  3. #72
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    As much as anyone thinks they can judge these parents, I'm sure they are judging themselves even harder.

    I probably wouldn't withhold treatment but he's not my child. I can't even imagine that unfathomable choice, it makes me sick to think about it. The only parents who would truly understand are those who have faced it.

    Death is an awful, awful outcome but surely quality of life has to factor in somewhere. It's an impossibly sad situation.

    Slamming the parents for using dr Google and other alternative therapies, after watching one sensationalised interview is a bit unfair. Unless you've sat in a room with them and talked to them, how do you really know how they feel of what they've tried.

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  5. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    The mum is a naturopath who used google and wanted to give her child a special juice from Asia instead of medical treatment. This lead me to believe she was driven by her own alternative ideology as opposed to fact/reason or even her child.

    Perhaps the ideological bleeter, said in the heat of the moment, was insensitive. Maybe 'a parent with ill informed extreme alternative views' would be better?
    I think there should be a spin off thread re views on naturopathy.

    I know a lady who had a brain tumour and declined medical treatment, instead she went down the track of alternate natural treatment. Now she is terminal.

  6. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny Dancer View Post
    This is a horribly heartbreaking situation. Neither choice they've been given is a good option. Both options suck. I honestly can't say what I would choose in the same situation.

    ETA: I have nothing but compassion for every member in the family. They don't deserve the vitriol that has been directed at them. They had to make a decision that had no win, and after making that heartbreaking decision taking all of the factors into consideration (some that doctors surely wouldn't know), doctors decided to fight it, and they were overruled. Doctors often are focused on "fixing" things. This situation can't be fixed.
    Except a 50% chance of survival is actually a pretty good survival chance? I have no comprehension how, a parent could not choose that chance for their child?

    My niece was diagnosed with a liver cancer with a tumour the size of an orange at 4 mths old, and with chemo and surgery to remove 70% of her liver was given a 60% chance of survival (and that means still alive in 5yrs). The first 2 yrs of her life were hell, and on several occasions she almost didn't make it, as the treatment was so aggressive.
    Today, she is a delightful, rambunctious 7yo little girl. She has some issues as a result of her treatment (some developmental delays and hearing loss etc from the chemo). She is terrified of medical professionals...but she is alive and thriving. I'm pretty sure my niece would say she is glad he parents took that chance with her, despite how traumatic and how poor her quality of life was for a while..

    Dr's choose palliation for child patients all the time, in this case they believe the child has a reasonable chance....Surely he deserves that chance?

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  8. #75
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    Default 60 minutes: court order treatment for child

    I would imagine it's a risk of brain damage that is worrying the parents.

    DH and I discussed this last night using this analogy.

    You're standing on a burning platform. If you don't jump you will die. If you do jump there's a 50% chance you'll live but of that 50% there's a 75% chance you'll be a tetraplegic. What would you choose?

  9. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaybaby View Post
    Except a 50% chance of survival is actually a pretty good survival chance? I have no comprehension how, a parent could not choose that chance for their child?

    My niece was diagnosed with a liver cancer with a tumour the size of an orange at 4 mths old, and with chemo and surgery to remove 70% of her liver was given a 60% chance of survival (and that means still alive in 5yrs). The first 2 yrs of her life were hell, and on several occasions she almost didn't make it, as the treatment was so aggressive.
    Today, she is a delightful, rambunctious 7yo little girl. She has some issues as a result of her treatment (some developmental delays and hearing loss etc from the chemo). She is terrified of medical professionals...but she is alive and thriving. I'm pretty sure my niece would say she is glad he parents took that chance with her, despite how traumatic and how poor her quality of life was for a while..

    Dr's choose palliation for child patients all the time, in this case they believe the child has a reasonable chance....Surely he deserves that chance?
    I totally agree. This isn't an 85 year old patient, prolonging the inevitable by a few years. It's a 6 year old child, and the chances are 50/50. Yes 50% that the child will not survive. But 50% that they WILL survive. He has his entire life before him. He could live to be 60,70,80 years old. He could recover and go on to live a happy and healthy life. I just don't see how you can give up when there is a 50% chance. I also think we as a society are so terrified by any form of disability. I find that really sad.

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  11. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonja View Post

    You're standing on a burning platform. If you don't jump you will die. If you do jump there's a 50% chance you'll live but of that 50% there's a 75% chance you'll be a tetraplegic. What would you choose?
    I'd still jump and hope for the best. I'd make my children jump and hope for the best.
    But I wouldn't tell anyone else they had to jump, and I wouldn't judge them for choosing differently.

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  13. #78
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    Default 60 minutes: court order treatment for child

    Quote Originally Posted by Frankenmum View Post
    I'd still jump and hope for the best. I'd make my children jump and hope for the best.
    But I wouldn't tell anyone else they had to jump, and I wouldn't judge them for choosing differently.
    It was based on an actual scenario that happened on an oil rig in the North Sea. I'd jump too but mainly because the thought of standing there being burnt to death would be unbearable. Same reason people jumped out of the twin towers in New York I suppose.

    I don't know about this anymore to be honest. I had thought they'd already done some treatment for their son more than the removal of the tumour. It seems they haven't.

    I would take the chemo and radiation even knowing the risks. Whether I'd force another parent to or not I don't know.
    Last edited by Sonja; 11-04-2016 at 10:21.

  14. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonja View Post
    I would imagine it's a risk of brain damage that is worrying the parents.

    DH and I discussed this last night using this analogy.

    You're standing on a burning platform. If you don't jump you will die. If you do jump there's a 50% chance you'll live but of that 50% there's a 75% chance you'll be a tetraplegic. What would you choose?
    I would jump...surviving is often instinctive...

  15. #80
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    I just read the whole transcript and I have to agree that the right decision has been made.

    This is about giving a little boy a fighting chance at beating this illness. Saving his life IS in fact, a possibility.

    The medical professionals have fought for what they think is right for Oshin - surely if they thought it was better to let nature take it's course they wouldn't be fighting for him to the extent of taking it to the courts?

    Even though I do not agree with the decisions the parents have made concerning treatment, I still feel incredibly sorry for them. They genuinely believe they are putting their son's best interests first, and to be forced to go against that choice is a feeling I can't imagine.

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