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  1. #1
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    Default Not sure what to do next with NPD mother...

    Hmmmm. So this is probably more of a little vent than anything, but I know some Hubbers have Mums with either NPD or BPD so I guess I am here looking for ideas or reassurance. This is going to be long, sorry, I can't write short posts, lol

    Without going into all the little details - my mother didn't bond with me as a baby and didn't call me by my name or pick me up and hold me for the first six months of life. I was fed, but not cared for. As far as I know she was OK for the first few years after that, but then started a long term affair and lived a double life for many years. She was so self-absorbed that she didn't notice when I went through severe bullying at school and almost suicided at 13 and she finally left when I was 15 and moved hours away from my sister and I, and had very little to do with us for the next 15 years.

    When her parents passed she decided she wanted to be near her daughters, so she moved near us, and without knowing any better I let her back into my life not realising the destruction she could bring. She campaigned so hard for me to leave my first husband, twisting everything and projecting her own stuff onto him, that in the end I believed he wasn't good for me and even though I didn't want to leave him, I did. One of the worst decisions of my life that I still regret to this day, even though I have rebuilt a really good life.

    When she went bankrupt a few years ago I employed her part time even though I couldn't afford it. She used this as an opportunity to "dump" on me every week, where she gets an issue in her head and she will get almost hysterical and will talk in a very emotional, aggressive way for at least 45 minutes without barely taking a breath, and at the end of her "dump" she will go happily on her way and I can hardly stand up from the stress of it. This was when I was going through repeated miscarriages and then IVF. Eventually (after three years) I had to sack her and another girl as my business went downhill. I also realised that I couldn't take any more of her hysterics and negativity, so I went deliberately low contact at that point.

    The funny thing is though, because I wasn't paying her any more, and because I don't have kids, she totally lost interest in me and I would not hear from her for six weeks at a time. I would normally break the drought and give her a call. That actually suited me, so I was fine.

    Just recently she's been b!tching to my sister that I don't contact her enough and she said last weekend that she's "written me off". Then she posted this meme on Facebook:

    "One of the hardest things you will ever have to do, my dear, is to grieve the loss of a person who is still alive".

    After what she said to my sister last weekend, my sister thinks it is definitely about me.

    So far this year I have had about three longish phone calls with Mum, invited her to dinner one night, and had a birthday dinner for a family member. I think that is actually quite a decent amount of contact and not even "low" to be honest. She doesn't call me any more, and instead of picking up the phone if she wants to speak to me, she would rather "write me off" if I don't contact her as much as she expects me to. Apparently she's said quite nasty things about how I must have "barred her" because I don't see her every week anymore.

    Now, I am desperately trying to revive my business, I'm going through a court case with my DH for increased custody of my DSS, I run a household and look after our finances for our joint business, we are building a house and I'm also working hard on my health so I can do another round of IVF or move to DE. I'm really busy and don't feel that I need to have my Mum in my life any more than necessary. I feel sorry for her, but she's refused to get help for her issues and I am happier with low contact.

    I know she's reacting because I'm not providing her "narcissistic supply" any more, but she's started escalating things and I don't want it to get worse. I thought I'd just call her and act like nothing's wrong (which usually defuses things), but I don't want to get re-engaged into a relationship where there is anything other than superficial contact every few weeks. The party birthday event was a week ago and the b!tching about me to my sister started a couple of days later, so I'd just had contact with her but even that's not good enough. Am I being too mean? Is it worth bringing anything up, or would I just be creating more drama for myself?
    Last edited by Summer; 20-02-2016 at 10:05.

  2. #2
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    I cut my NPD mother completely out of my life two years ago. Best decision I ever made.
    She hated me as a baby. She has even admitted that she genuinely looked into how she could get me adopted out when I was around 6 months old. I was very much a "we got married, now what..?" baby. And I was never able to live up to the baby she he aborted when she was 16. That baby would have been a boy (the better gender!) and he probably would have been a judge by now and he would have so much money (I.e "success"). I was a female child, urgh, and a useless one at that. Did you know I was the only child that ever lied to their parents ever, in the whole wide world. Hahha.
    I was constantly told how her life would have been better if I wasn't born. She only managed to tell me once that I should go kill myself though. And then when I brought it up, she had my enabling father punish me for being a filthy liar. She was never particularly physical with me but the emotional manipulation is still affecting me. I didn't realise how childhoods were supposed to be until I met my husband and his wonderful mother.
    I had my first son, and suddenly my mother was my best friend. I provided her with the son she was supposed to have. I overheard several times, people would say to her "oh what a cute son" if she was carrying him in the shops. And she wouldn't correct them. I also witnessed my son consistently call her mum, way more than a slip of the tongue, so it's pretty obvious what she was saying behind my back.
    She was there for his birth (only the end of it when he actually came out) as hubby was away.
    When I fell pregnant with my second she actually said to me "I suppose he (husband) will be in the birth this time. And you're going to deny me seeing my grandchildren first breath. It's my right you know. I'll never bond with him". And she was right. She always hated him as a baby. Refused to pick him up and referred to him as "that child". He used to scream a lot as an infant and toddler. She told me flat out she doesn't like him and if I can't control him she doesn't want him in her house (he later went on to be diagnosed with autism).
    We were living in a house they owned and they had the real estate kick us out. We have supplied our own things like the letterbox and she took our bond because we "stole it" when we decided seeing as we borrowed it from a friend, it had to go back to that friend.

    Honestly there is a lot more but I think I have hijacked enough (sorry) I just get carried away. I am like a burst dam with her.
    The point I was going to try and make is that she will never, ever change. She will always think she is right even if you can prove without a doubt to her face that she is wrong. You will never win. My advice is to limit or even cut contact. Blood doesn't mean you are under any obligation to her. She had an obligation to you that she didn't fulfil. And you don't need that kind of toxic environment around you.

  3. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Ahalfdozen For This Useful Post:

    Chillies  (20-02-2016),Summer  (20-02-2016)

  4. #3
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    I've had a couple of narcissists in my life and from my experience, the only way to get any form of peace is to cut them. Different circumstances but my mother is also a total narcissist. I find the lowest level of contact works the best for me and I feel my anxiety and all the old wounds flare up when we do have contact. I was also close to someone who was just like your mum. She would come around, spew forth her drama every single day then go home and I was always so stressed bc it was like Groundhog Day. She wouldn't take anything on board, wouldn't take any responsibility. All she wanted was sympathy and someone to dump on.

    There is no fixing a narc. Trying to calmly discuss the issues with an attention seeking narc leading to lots of histrionics, screaming and claims of persecution, lack of support. With an aggressive narc is just leads to more aggression, threats etc. Nothing you say will give her that 'light bulb moment'. As the child of a narcissistic parent I know deep down that's what you are holding out for - that moment that she gets it. She's not going to hun, that's part of what forms a narcissist.

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    Thanks @Ahalfdozen & @delirium for your insights. So true about never fixing a narc, my Mum has had more than enough opportunities to do therapy or whatever and doesn't think there's anything wrong with her.

    I am actually really happy with the low contact, but feel guilty when she starts the drama about it. Part of me just wants to roll my eyes "grieving the loss of someone who is still alive" FFS I saw her last week - drama much? But the other part of me feels guilty because she really doesn't understand why and never will. She is definitely the victim narcissist and she trained me really well to feed that. I think I'll just stay low contact and call her every now and then and pretend nothings wrong and have a superficial conversation, let her talk away for ages like she does, and just make sure I exit if she starts getting her "dump" on.

    Thanks for sharing guys. The scars run deep.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Summer View Post
    The scars run deep.
    Yep, I hear you. And I think at least from my POV, the reason those scars can't heal is that she just doesn't get it. She won't and never will realise what a crappy mother she has been, how insanely wrapped up in herself she is. So I feel like there is no closure.

    That's why I say you have to let go of who you need her to be and the possibility she is going to realise what she does. I know that's a pretty glib, depressing view but unfortunately it's true

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    Yep, I think the reason it's so hard to get over is because there is no closure. It's not possible to get any kind of closure from it.

    One of the truest things I read on the subject was that the narcissist has the ability to skew everyone's view of them. Like even if you go to a psychologist, it's entirely possible the psych will indirectly turn it around on you. Because of the narc. They will say things like "I'm sure she really does care what you think, maybe you misunderstood" etc. They say it's absolutely one of the hardest things to diagnose purely because the biggest symptom of being a narcissist is making it look like everyone else are the crazy ones. If they weren't so good at that, then they wouldn't have NPD. So it's a catch 22 situation. Usually only the targeted person/people are even aware of it. I lost contact to my whole entire side of the family, every single one of them, because it's all my fault.

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  11. #7
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    Both so correct again!

    I think I gave up wanting her to be what I would consider a decent mother a long time ago, but what is niggling at me at the moment is the way she's trying to rewrite history to make herself out to be the wronged party all throughout my life. Most of the time I'm really good at ignoring her stuff and I haven't blocked her on FB as I like seeing pics of my family that she takes, but she keeps putting up posts like this:

    "You will find no better best friend in this world than your mother in this world. Believe me. She knows you more than anyone does. You are the flesh of her flesh. Respect her, cherish her, and love her with all your heart. She could be gone oneday and you'd find no one else like her"

    Which do my head in as she was a very absent mother and emotionally abusive. So I'm pretty fine with it most of the time and emotionally I've done a heap of work on it and I don't "react" much anymore. I think it was the statement to my sister that she was "writing me off" that did push my buttons a bit. What sort of mother "writes their child off" because they aren't as involved in her life as she wants them to be. She's not as bad as many NPD mothers that I've heard about, so I don't feel the need to cut her off completely, just keep it low contact and superficial. I might just have to reinforce those boundaries again if she's starting a campaign up at the moment.

    All she is looking for is for me to fall over myself being sorry for not contacting her much and tell her she's the most wonderful mother in the world and that I'm such a cow etc... Not. Going. To. Happen.

  12. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahalfdozen View Post
    One of the truest things I read on the subject was that the narcissist has the ability to skew everyone's view of them. Like even if you go to a psychologist, it's entirely possible the psych will indirectly turn it around on you. Because of the narc. They will say things like "I'm sure she really does care what you think, maybe you misunderstood" etc. They say it's absolutely one of the hardest things to diagnose purely because the biggest symptom of being a narcissist is making it look like everyone else are the crazy ones. If they weren't so good at that, then they wouldn't have NPD. So it's a catch 22 situation. Usually only the targeted person/people are even aware of it. I lost contact to my whole entire side of the family, every single one of them, because it's all my fault.
    This is so right on. I 100% believe my friend had BPD, she was text book and ticked 8 of the 9 markers. But even when she saw counsellors and a Psychiatrist he still didn't see it. She got a generalised depressive label but no Personality Disorder diagnosis. Bc she was just so damn convincing.

    I think aggressive narcs tend to have more insight into their behaviour, they just don't care. They are getting too much pay off to change. But attention seeking narcissists actually believe the rubbish they go on with. So the dr phil saying goes, you can't change what you don't acknowledge. How can they change their behaviour when they really do believe they are the victim?

    ETA - I just read your last post Summer. So much of the above with your mum too ^^
    Last edited by delirium; 20-02-2016 at 12:18.

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    @delirium that is so very true and @Ahalfdozen is spot on about the crazy making and making everyone else out to be the crazy ones.

    Unfortunately because both my parents are NPD - Mum could be BPD but has never had a diagnosis - I got involved with a master NPD man and this is exactly what he did. He had me questioning everything that I did as he was so clever in twisting things around, they are very clever.

    I'm sorry you lost an entire side of your family @Ahalfdozen, that is absolutely appalling, but you are right, they will never see it for what it is as the narcissist is very clever at manipulating people and making what seems to be perfect sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Summer View Post
    I'm sorry you lost an entire side of your family @Ahalfdozen, that is absolutely appalling, but you are right, they will never see it for what it is as the narcissist is very clever at manipulating people and making what seems to be perfect sense.
    Im fine with it really. It's easier just being without them all than worrying about who is conveying what back to her. When my son was diagnosed with autism and all those other wonderful things that go along with it, we were already not really talking to her but still had other family members on my Facebook and stuff. I mentioned one little thing and next thing I know, she is pulling the "poor me, I have a disabled grandson" card to anyone and everyone who would listen. That is what made me go off my banana at her, because how dare she exploit my son and his struggles for her own victim games. It actually makes me sick thinking about it. But because she was the supportive grandparent and I was being unreasonable, everyone stopped talking to me. Oh well.
    I am lucky my MIL is a lovely lady. Her mother and my mother are one in the same so we can relate to each other.

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