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  1. #221
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    POAS report DPO10:-

    Well, I did a test late last night and the line was definitely fainter than in the morning. Did a test this morning and the line is definitely fainter than the one last night. So still bottoming out. Really hope to see that line get stronger from now on. Will be going slightly cray cray today I suspect.

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  3. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bongley View Post
    POAS report DPO10:-

    Well, I did a test late last night and the line was definitely fainter than in the morning. Did a test this morning and the line is definitely fainter than the one last night. So still bottoming out. Really hope to see that line get stronger from now on. Will be going slightly cray cray today I suspect.
    Still early days yet Luv though I can imagine the anxiety you're feeling The line being so faint now will make it easier to see your BFFP when it arrives!!

    and prayers being sent for a squinter sometime in the next 48 hours!!!

    GO INCY GO!!!!!!

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  5. #223
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    f...

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  7. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlondeinBrisvegas View Post
    I can't read the study Luv as you need an Id/p/word to access it

    Sounds interesting though Yes, I believe that PGS/PGD tested embryo's aside, the way they choose which embryo's to transfer or freeze (and test) is on appearance...cell numbers, size of blastomeres when assessing at the cleavage stage (are they similar in size with no mulitinucleation present??),degree of fragmentation etc or if at the blastocyst stage: blastocyst formation (which day??), blastocyst maturity, inner cell mass development, trophectoderm organization in addition to the blastocoel volume and expansion.

    I believe the presence of degenerative cells or dark grainy regions within the blastocyst are considered negative traits. Blastocysts having low TE cell number and degenerative cells in either TE or ICM are classed as “poor quality” and not considered suitable for transfer or freezing. They then Grade them accordingly for testing/transfer/freezing though as we all know, embryo grades don't tell us what's going on inside the embryo genetically.

    I think the long and the short of it is that they really don't know yet how to tell or how to improve anything. I think embryoscope will change how they grade embryos, but even now there's no tracking for how well embryoscope growth matches with takehome-baby rate!

    All IVF really does is increase the number of tickets in the lottery.

    I think this is really disappointing (and a reflection of how poorly women's health issues are researched in general) especially considering how easy it would be to collate huge databases on age/supplements/blood tests on IVF patients who are motivated and rarely lost to follow up!

    I don't understand why QFG, for example, doesn't PGS the arrested embryos or submit them for follicular fluid testing. I know it's expensive, but I just don't feel that they're that interested in actual scientific breakthroughs because money (it costs money and eventually less IVF cycles = less profit).

    $0.02

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  9. #225
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    [QUOTE

    oh yes, it is age related (via telegraph article). dammit. now I'm wondering how many good, slower ones are discarded for frosties for being too slow when they might have been ok? (best not to think this way)]
    @winsor - yes this is what I think about

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  11. #226
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    yeah it's hard to say. from the different studies it seems there's lots of factors. we don't really know which is a higher weight of them all comparitively, if there is one. appearance rating must be the most effective means without testing since that's what's used now, and many are not suitable for testing or don't make it so don't need to be tested. it is good to see new developments in the science. I hope there'll one day be more known. it's still a relatively young field, so new discoveries are yet to be made

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  13. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green lady View Post
    [QUOTE

    oh yes, it is age related (via telegraph article). dammit. now I'm wondering how many good, slower ones are discarded for frosties for being too slow when they might have been ok? (best not to think this way)]
    @winsor - yes this is what I think about
    Yeah me too. I had so many blastocysts not make it to freeze, almost every stim cycle I would have (I was always really consistent) 1 to transfer and 1 blast would go in the bin. Yet my slow very early 5 day blastocyst gave me a BFP.

    It always niggles me
    1: Would that blastocyst have been good enough to freeze at day 6?
    2: Were any binned that would have made it?

    My clinic told me that they have to be expanded by day 6 to freeze.

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  15. #228
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    I had a few slower ones but they always seemed to stop by day 5-6 as they told me they couldn't freeze. sometimes I thought, pop the trailer in and freeze the leading one and see if there's a difference. but I guess they can only go on current tech known at the time for best guess.
    the glucose article was watching them use the glucose in the lab solution. which was outside of me anyway. I'll see if I can attach it temporarily once on the computer.

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  17. #229
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    Gardner, David K., Petra L Wale, Rebecca Collins, and Michelle Lane. 2011. "Glucose Consumption of Single Post-Compaction Human Embryos is Predictive of Embryo Sex and Live Birth Outcome." Human Reproduction. 26 (8):1981–1986.

    background: The aim of this study was to determine the relationship between nutrient utilization by the human embryo and its subsequent
    viability after transfer.

    conclusions: The rapid screening of glucose metabolism by the human embryo on Day 4 and 5 may prove to be a useful metric in the
    development of algorithms for the selection of embryos for transfer in human IVF. Also, the observed sex-related metabolic difference provides
    preliminary data to support the hypothesis that male and female human embryos differ in their physiology due to the presence of two
    active X chromosomes and an altered proteome for a finite time during the preimplantation period.

    & this one, which was referred to in another article (though it's on animal tests as well so not sure if it's the same/relevant):

    Leese, Henry J. 2002. "Quiet Please, Do Not Disturb: A Hypothesis of Embryo Metabolism and Viability." BioEssays. 24:845–849.

    Summary
    This review uses nutritional markers of normal and
    impaired development to address the question; what
    makes a viable mammalian preimplantation embryo?
    Resolution of this question is important to ensure the
    long-term safety of embryo-based biotechnologies in
    man and domestic animals, the optimisation of embryo
    production and culture conditions and the development
    of methods to select viable embryos for replacement.
    After considering the nutrition of embryos and somatic
    cells, and the phenomenon of caloric restriction, it is
    concluded that preimplantation embryo survival is best
    served by a relatively low level of metabolism; a situation
    achieved by reducing the concentrations of nutrients in
    culture media and encouraging the use endogenous
    resources.
    Last edited by winsor; 20-12-2015 at 23:05.

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  19. #230
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    POAS report DPO10 (the afternoon edition):-

    Well despite me saying that the FRERs are consistent they are fluctuating slightly, presumably on concentration of wee. So now it is slightly darker but I held onto my wee for like 6 hours and it was very orange, sorry TMI


    Hope everyone is staying cool.

    Thanks for listening to my craziness.

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