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  1. #1
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    Default Friendships - boundaries - respect and inappropriate behaviour in front of my...

    I wanted to ask the mums out there about friends inappropriate behaviour in the presence of their kids pls. And does anyone ever mistake any help they give u, as an invitation to do this to someone else's family and think it's ok.
    I apologise for the long vent and for this story being all over the place.

    I have had a friend over the last 4/5 years that lives an hour away and we have enjoyed engaging with each other n brought our spouses closer as well. Of course like any friendships we helped each other and were there for each other in those years. They are much older than us with no little kids. Both their children are adults living with them 27,24 or so. The husband has been out of work and busied himself with volunteer stuff recently I hear while she was working at first then at home, and has recently taken too care for kids a few times a week.

    When we met and she started calling me n came over the first few times or invited us, the conversations were always centred around my little baby girl at the time.

    My little ones first bday, they came over, us visiting them for Xmas, other special occasions etc n because both our husbands, as well as my friend drank together (I have never been a big drinker and further as a mum of a little person, have to remain responsible at all times seeing as nobody else remains sober)
    Both my friend and I have had times in the past were we stayed over and the relationship started leaning more towards adult enjoyment (not me) and compromising attention to my little one, bedtime routines etc again it was not every month so...

    She has always been a bit forceful in wanting to know what's happening in my life and getting involved. From if I mentioned a new friend or I'd we had international visitors n wanting to meet them to asking what we were doing and getting involved in our plans because as a younger couple what we were doing and where we were going always seemed exciting to her. Her hubby was not into doing those sort of things so she wud miss out on any events happening in or around the city and by latching on to us, atleast wud enjoy instead of just hearing about it. And by getting her husband close to mine, maybe took some pressure of her as he used to have a problem with her mingling too much and I don't know...

    I have never liked her husband as he is rude dominating and irritating even more so when drunk and bordering or aggressive but so long as he didn't mess with me I was able to ignore him as we didn't see them as often. There are also many families in our community who have known them for longer that have distanced themselves from him and them and in the meantime, I have been there for her and I have been kept so busy by her that I was put off as well as have had no opportunity to maintain a bond with people that don't associate with them anymore, which are a lot of ppl.

    There was something in particular I found distasteful during our times together and I did start of light heartedly mentioning that I didn't like it! Usually the men drink outside n they can be ignored if what they do doesn't come indoors and impact is.

    When we were over at their place and my hubby wud come in to use the restroom, my friends partner would shadow him but come in to engage with us or his wife. Say something like "ash.. Jus close ur eyes I'm jus gonna touch my wife!" N my friend wud say stop that.. But it wudnt stop till her husband wanted to stop. Ofcourse when mine came into the room.

    This cycle has persisted over time with different levels of conv between us or them n incl me saying I wud tell my husband but anyway it still has persisted. From their house to mine, in a restaurant. And with me not being able to say to her outright pls ask him to stop, it went on. Just in front of me.

    Last year I was gifted with a totally surprise pregnancy!
    N wen I announced my preg, my friend was excited n because we both live in Aus estranged from our families, she kept asking if she could do this and that and the other when baby was born.

    In my second trimester one day after I had exhausted myself I had a little panic attack n things just went downhill from there. It was as if something broke inside of me n I just wasn't me anymore. I felt alone. My hubby and the only person in my suburb I was close to were both going away on international trips and I fell into a dark state of fear and anxiety about being alone so far from anyone I knew.
    I thought of the promises she made and also how we have been there for each other in the past and I reached out to her to ask if she would stay with me for the week or 10 days hubby was going away. At that point when i asked and made these arrangements, I wasn't as "sick" as I later became.
    Despite my arrangements because I didn't have peace of mind, the fear still overcame me and I got to a state where I needed psychiatric help as it was bordering depression.
    Yes I did get onto a mental health plan and did see a psychiatrist and after having my Bub, I was alright. And yes my friend helped me through this time with her presence and support and I was so grateful. Really. Which is why this has been so difficult for me to do to her.

    The early morning my husband left, I was in a particularly bad state. My friend said she wud come over that night so my husband asked another friend n his wife who is a mental health consultant to check on me till she arrived.
    My friend came with her husband n despite me being in a fragile state, they wer trying to be helpful by staying and waiting for some medical attention i was awaiting but in the meantime they were extremely loud and socialising with the other friends at my place while I was just waiting for everyone but her to leave and I couldn't say anything in fear of losing the support person i now had in her.

    She ofcourse came to realise just how bad a state I was in. And while she had stayed with me before when she had some work nearby and it had been nothing but an enjoyable time with us taking her out etc, this ofcourse was totally different as I wasn't even able to leave my home let alone eat.

    She stayed with my and my little girl. And I was so grateful to her.
    in the meantime hubby shortened his trip and came back early.
    My friends husband came to fetch her and compensating for the help she had given me ofcourse we wanted to spoil them with food and drinks and wat not when she left home.

    Over the weeks that progressed she would come over and check on me, challenge me to get out of the house even down the road to the park n try something.
    I also met another lovely lady via some mental health support and she has also been a call away and come over and checked on me and helped me through my tough time.

    I then got some family support and ofcourse my friend didn't come too often till after I had my baby.
    But when they did come over, whether I was preg or just had a newborn or an infant, my hubby and I felt compelled to spoil them with attention and good food n ofcourse drinks. And my husband I must admit does not hold his liquor well!
    Things often got out of hand, even with my family present.
    Overstaying at EVERY visit because yes my hubby wud keep insisting they have another drink but they would only leave when someone was passing out or some other drama in my house.
    I didn't like what my friendship was being reduced to. Even before I fell preg I had tried to tell the 3 of them that I am glad they can come over and enjoy but it didn't have to be about alcohol all the time between us, it didn't need to be an alcohol dependent socialising every time we met.

    And now that they were coming so often, I wasn't happy with the way my home was being treated and the fact that I had two little ppl, a baby and a 5yr old I had to compromise to have them over but again not wanting to upset someone I was grateful to, I kept silent.

    At some point last year just after I had my baby, my friend blocked me on her mobile. Definitely before December.
    Probably cos my family support was leaving and she didn't want me to be able to call her again if I fell into my dark place.

    I was distracted by my new baby and I understood why so I gave her space and let her only contact me. If I wanted to spk to her I wud call her home and her husband would screen the calls and anyway I left it as is as I understood.
    I wanted to do a few things for her as I started to get mobile but I was torn between her wanting space, me having a new baby and a busy time of year for everyone.

    Xmas, New Years, special occasions past all with her calling me, maybe our chat comm or few times me getting her on her home phone, with them coming to see me and the baby & eating drinking overstaying at my place, or us taking them out to dinner, and them dropping by & me running around trying to be a good host amidst seeing to my little ones, still feeling the need to compensate for her help. And them not leaving till the lastest moment. Exhausting.

    Still I was blocked.

    In February I wanted to invite her for my little girls bday n called her mobile after ages, only to see I was still blocked.
    I just felt hurt. I had given her space, distanced myself as she wanted, I was now out of my dark place, I was not leaning on her. They wer coming over n laughing n sharing n enjoying with us yet I was still blocked.
    I sent her a heartfelt message on chat saying you know pls don't think I am angry at you, I care abt u and totally understand how I leaned on you in my time of need and I totally appreciate and am grateful to you, but I do know that u have blocked me. I understand why and I promise I will try hard never to be that negative person I was last year, so pls don't feel like u need to be anything but true and honest with needing ur space.

    This message was not met well.
    She called me totally denying having blocked me. Unblocked me then asked me to call her n see for myself.

    She came to the bday alone in feb. and we didn't talk about the phone issue, till another mutual friend arrived and she said to them that something was wrong with her phone nonsense. She did that because she thought I was going to tell that mutual friend what she did, having known helpful and caring role she portrays to them. I didn't mention it to anyone.

    In visits and meeting and calls from her thereafter she has just started to chip away at me. She wud call me find out wat we were doing then report to her husband so he could interrupt my husbands working day with a "valid" call offering help or something to get them closer. Like helping with dyi at home. (Her husband isn't employed)

    In April after a rude phone comm with me invited us to her husbands bday lunch at her house first time all yr. We went ate left befor 5 with all their guests even though her husband tried to detain us, no we were leaving cos we wer invited to lunch and my friend was clearly not happy with him, after 15minutes of his head in our car window, and her standing at the door waiting, he moved so we could leave.

    Another day we met at an event in the city I didn't enjoy the company of her chastising me telling me to be quiet her husband was talking when I interrupted to say something stupid.

    Being rude now and worst of all sitting by while her husband has taken the violation against me to another level.
    They popped by one day and he got involved with some dyi project of ours. They started to drink with my hubby again, considering the guy gave him a hand, and as usual he followed my husband in when he went to the toilet and then!!!!!!
    I was in the kitchen and my five year old was sitting on one couch and his wife was on the other and he proceeded to fondle his wife putting his hands down the back of her pants trying to unclip her bra.
    She said stop that the child is sitting right there and he argued with that and persisted. I said something to echo what she had and again saying I was going to tell my husband and he didn't care.
    My mistake was that I didn't kick him out right then n there. They still stayed on with no shame and left as per usual late in the night after things got uncomfortable, still with me being too afraid to have the uncomfortable conv with my friend knowing how defensive she is of her husband and not wanting go upset her just in case she planned on having a go at him as soon as they left. But they didn't leave right away anyway!! So much for that.

    But that was the turning point for me!

    She manipulated me again with her calls n wanting to know where we wer at with our dyi project and next thing wanted to be invited over again to try it out!
    Or why else keep calling me n asking abt it n telling other friend abt it.
    I told my husband that i did not want to have any alcohol fed to that beast husband if we were having them over cos if there was a repeat of what happened in front of my little girl, I would kill him. We invited them for lunch, I changed things to change the behaviour so things wud not exceed to the night and I told my friend I couldn't do a dinner as it became too hard for me and amidst the conv she said something abt "speaking to her husband about his behaviour" and I took that as her way of comforting me that what happened the last time wud not happen again so I didn't need to broach that subject. I even out of desperation as a back up asked her to bring her son along just so her husband wud behave but no

    And there we go, the lunch came and went and they were still in my house at dinner time with me scrambling to see to my kids. And disregarding what I had told my friend and knowing she discussed it with her husband, even if my hubby said there's no need to go yet, she should've known she had to go.
    And this time he came to fondle her in front of my 5 month old baby!!! Standing next to the portacot she was playing in!!!
    I was Livid! I had tears in my eyes! My husband left the restroom and walked into the room to see me like that and he didn't know what was happening being bloody drunk himself!
    I went and grabbed my baby and said let me protect you from this!
    Last edited by ash17; 28-10-2015 at 22:32.

  2. #2
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    Default Friendships - boundaries - respect and inappropriate behaviour in front of my...

    But still they stayed on!! Omg how thick and how disrespectful. And how dismissive of my friend.

    When I calmed down a bit she didn't acknowledge that i was upset and proceeded to carry on like normal. I needed to feed my baby, My husband came in and she caught his attention on the way to see what he wanted.
    He wanted me to go buy smokes. I cudnt just prolong this night any longer and put my foot down and an argument between us pursued. We don't argue often. Even my friend knows how gentle we are with each other. We are not aggressive or argumentative or hostile with each other. My friend is used to that kind of comm with her hubby and anyway they got involved and started interfering till the 3 of them were ganging up on me. Telling me what I should allow my husband to do. Her husband getting aggressive with me saying he will show me, n help my hubby get wat he wants. The night ended with my husband trying to drive off drunk n they only left when I was in tears. I didn't want them to leave on that note, not cos the night has turned sour but cos there were too many unspoken things starting to hurt my family.

    Over the last 3 months The next time she made contact was a fleeting call giving me no time to say wat I needed. A while later, I messaged asking her to meet and indicated clearly that it was just going to be us. Her second call she tried strong arming me into bringing a family member to visit her saying it was least I could do after her helping me. I was Cleary uncomfortable n then she abruptly ended the call. Ringing back a second later to crap on me for being disrespectful by not saying goodbye.

    That's when I said I didn't appreciate the hostility towards me. And how we have been distant and something happened in my home that causes tension between us that didn't get resolved and now she is attacking me.
    She didn't acknowledge anything wrong that happened in my home.
    She said my husband apologised to her husband! (I asked him, he said he didn't)
    I asked her what for, she said it doesn't matter an apology is an apology. I said where is the apology to me. She said oh it was in the eye of the beholder: I said that is why I want to meet with u and discuss that with u.
    She ended the call suddenly urgently needing to rush of and see to her adult children. I said pls go and see to ur family.

    That was a month ago.
    And we haven't made contact yet and today is her bday.

    I feel sad I don't feel like wishing her cos I dont want to open up comm with her again for her to start talking to me like normal again, and disregard what I have to say:
    I don't want any arguing or debating abt how I feel. I am not accepting this behaviour in my home from anyone ever again and her husband has lost his privelege of being in my home around my loves ones.

    In the meantime this is not the end of my battle as my husband is being manipulated and all this time the other guys has been calling him to see if things are ok with them. Meanwhile when he was away and left me my friend said her husband would never do that and when their kids were babies he didn't entertain anyone compromising them. he is mocking my husband and challenging him to step up and be a man and defend his family or he will continue to create chaos for us but my husband cannot see it. He only knows my friend helped me in my time of need, the guy gets involved in our home (but doesn't want ppl to interfere and take credit in his projects so it's one sided).
    My husband doesn't see protecting my girls and myself and him from being violated and disrespected and our home from being invaded. As if it is a pub.

    I have observed them and asked the one out of 2 other friends.
    And they do not behave the same. There is no fondling when drinking in the one home,nor fondling in front of that wife or kids ever. And there's no drinking in the other house with another under 7yr old so no disrespectful behaviour in front of that family.
    My husband and I both have also helped out and continue to help and support other families. But have not disrespected and never will, force ourselves onto anyone. My husband drinks and I have seen in the years how he can get really get stupid in clubs etc when we were younger but despite that he has never, behaved in that manner in anyone else's home. We don't behave inappropriately in my friends', their kids, abuse anyone's home, nor intefere in anyone else's marital affairs. If anything, we would leave and apologise and be embarrassed feeling partially to blame for any discomfort to our host if things went wrong while we visited anyone.

    I feel violated and manipulated and just want to protect my little ones myself and my marriage. They are compromising the very values they tried to make it seem they had at the beginning when they got close to me, or I would never have.

    But my husband is not on board with me. I refuse to budge on this. Am I wrong.
    Last edited by ash17; 28-10-2015 at 22:34.

  3. #3
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    No, it's disgusting and entirely an uncomfortable situation for you to be placed in. I might be off but it seems to me like maybe they were trying to initiate something sexual with you?

    I wouldn't even bother with them as friends anymore OP!

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    Hi, it's hard to get my head around the whole story as there is so much to it, but they don't sound like friends you need in your life. Are they trying to form an intimate relationship with you? I'm not sure why you would put up with it for so long. Why isn't your husband on board?

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    ash17  (28-10-2015)

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    I get the impression from that story that the key issue is that they get s.exual in front of the kids and you and don't stop even when asked. And that the husband has also made s.exual comments towards you that are very unwelcome and intimidating. Along with the excessive drunken behaviour and all that entails.

    They have no boundaries and sound like very uncomfortable people to be around. I would get them out of my life immediately and wouldn't let them anywhere near my kids to be honest.

    I know you need people for support, but the kind of 'support' you're getting from this couple is not helpful or healthy.

    I would talk to my GP about getting a solid mental health plan, and ask about support groups you could join and look for other ways to meet people. And don't let this couple back in your house.

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    It sounds like the husband is trying to start something sexual with you. I'd probably drop the friendship to be honest. But if you didn't want to lose your friend then there's a few things that might help.

    Next time he fondles her in front of you say 'I'm really glad that you both are still so in love and attracted to one another, but I don't really want my children exposed to such public affection. It might make them uncomfortable.' There is nothing wrong with correcting someone's behaviour. You have a right to feel comfortable and maybe the husband just needs to know that you're actually disgusted by his behaviour, not even remotely attracted.

    Secondly, I would talk to hubby. He is an accomplice in all of this. Surely he doesn't need to drink with them all the time. Surely he can say 'yes actually, we do have some things to do so we'll see you next time'. Your friends hubby is obviously greatly encouraged by your husband. They both need to stop.

    Good luck OP.

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    I also thought maybe your friends husband might be testing the waters. If he is acting in a provocative way in front of you and only whilst your husband isn't present it might be his way of making a sexual advance at you. His wife might not be aware of his intentions either as it is directed to her and not you but the fact that it is being done in front of you almost suggests he is doing it in a flirtatious way. The only other thing that I could think of was that for some reason he might think you and your friend have too much of a bond and he is marking his territory to show you that she is his kinda deal. Alpha male stamping his mark?

    Either way I say you need friends that aren't going to cause you this much stress. I understand your gratitude towards her helping you but that doesn't excuse their behaviour and the way they have made you since then.

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    Default Friendships - boundaries - respect and inappropriate behaviour in front of my...

    Thank u guys for ur responses to reaffirm what I feel. I basically am feeling guilty for having taken the stance I have and therefore on days like today when I know my friend must be hurting and thinking I used her in my time of need now suddenly have a problem.

    The guy is tactful. He even proclaimed it at my house that day.
    Asking ... You ok?
    When actually he is asking:
    Are u ok with me drinking with ur husband
    Are u ok with me touching my wife in front of u
    Are u ok with us overstaying

    How do u say no without making things uncomfortable. When ur husband is being a "man" first.

    I'm unable to digest the sexual implication towards me but yes perhaps he thinks he was wat ? Turning me on seeing a bald drunken ******* with his paws over his wife wen she is not reciprocating. And yes there have been many of his comments about how she was denying him sex etc etc that kinda garbage I just ignored!
    For them to drive one hour to my place and then him fondle her in front of me and my babies, when both of them were at home 247 to have quality time together for much of their relationship in all the time this has gone on.

    He provokes and I believe that is what he was doing on his last visit. He is testing boundaries yes so one would question his motives of where to now.

    I refuse to find out. And NO as long as I breathe I don't plan on fixing things with him to allow him close to my kids and I.

    As for hubby, with or without his support, I can and will protect my family.
    I brought these ppl close to us and I will push them away. I'm just hesitant to go against him as he is obstinate.

    We are passive gentle ppl who try and avoid uncomfortable situations and confrontations.

    But I am learning! I've only been a parent now for 5+ years and I guess no mother can be called passive or accommodating when it comes to protecting their child.
    Last edited by ash17; 28-10-2015 at 13:03.

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    Default Friendships - boundaries - respect and inappropriate behaviour in front of my...

    And yes 🐢 I also think it is definitely alpha male behaviour because there has been plenty of that from him. From not wanting her to communicate with me, her blocking me because she was spending too much of time and effort and sad to say most probably petrol money?? Irunno? too by driving to see me and I didn't get a chance to remunerate her as I should have and they maybe feel violated by me for that.
    Last edited by ash17; 28-10-2015 at 07:35.

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    Default Friendships - boundaries - respect and inappropriate behaviour in front of my...

    And therefor he is making us pay by creating havoc in my home. My opinion...

    I had a lifetime of genuine friendship I could've rewarded her with.
    And in all this time during all this abuse, I have never uttered a bad word to her or anger.
    Till the day she called me back for not saying bye to her calling that disrespectful. Yet didn't acknowledge the disgusting behaviour in front of my babies as wrong and disrespectful. All thru this friendship my friend has only talked up her husband and I hav turned a deaf ear as I believe greatness is something u experience for yourself and I see nothing amazing. She outshines him and befriends the entire community and he has undermined and ruined so many of her friendships with his behaviour and she always gets defensive and protects him.

    That is why I didn't want to have the conv with her from the start. Because I didn't want to have to validate my feelings. The fact that I feel I need to protect my family from someone speaks for itself.
    Last edited by ash17; 28-10-2015 at 13:05.


 

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