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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    As mentioned in a previous post they were plucked

    You're a pretty easy going go-with-the flow person (I don't mean that in a negative way). I sort of admire the way that you have a big day nap with your kids and do family stuff late in the evening. Is it possible that you have gravitated towards friends with similar parenting philosophies and lifestyles and that there is a possible connection between that and the kids sleep habits?
    The same can be said for you though and why you are so gung ho about the sleep-training. You're obviously the type of person that likes situations to maintain some control I would harbor to guess that leads you to parent a certain way which leads your children to respond a certain way which is probably one of the many reasons sleep training has worked for you. Don't get me wrong, I'm not meaning that in a negative way at all, just more that we don't live in a bubble, so that's why our experiences vary so differently.

    All that said, there are actually studies that say development effects sleep. That's not me spouting some sort of parenting theory, The Wonder Weeks is a whole book on sleep regressions written by a couple of doctors based on their studies of babies.

    Going back to your post before, I have a soft spot for you as well . And I started thinking after I wrote the post you last quoted, that I of course did play a part in all of that anxiety, I could have avoided forums, books, articles, but not so much the real life people making cheap comments . I also feel that of course some info is helpful and great to have help guide your way, but I think a majority of the time our instincts are better to follow. It's also about figuring out what type of parent you are/want to be and what book/expert suits you. There is SO much info out there and it's hard sometimes to weed your way through all of it and find the one that you click with ya know? I only just recently found one that I wish I had paid attention to in the earlier days. I'm also a completely different type of parent than I thought I would be. I've also definitely had people (in real life, not so much on this forum) make me feel bad for not 'properly' sleep training so the judgement definitely goes both ways.

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  3. #92
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    Wow 10 pages. I haven't read them all. But had to post.
    Amen to you OP.
    Some kids just don't sleep. Some babies don't sleep.
    My dd will be 3 in November. And it's fair to say she's a shocker. A full night sleep is rare as! And yes. ... she does have medical issues.

    We have to give her meds to sleep or its just like she's a possesed banshee. ..which frankly turns me into possesed banshee.

    That said...her sleep is related to her syndrome which is a metabolic disorder. I'm honestly convinced it's in our genes. ..the way we sleep. It's certainly in hers. Some babies are just not hardwired to sleep.
    I wish more people understood that.

  4. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by HollyGolightly81 View Post
    All that said, there are actually studies that say development effects sleep. .
    Totally agree with those studies

  5. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    As mentioned in a previous post they were plucked

    You're a pretty easy going go-with-the flow person (I don't mean that in a negative way). I sort of admire the way that you have a big day nap with your kids and do family stuff late in the evening. Is it possible that you have gravitated towards friends with similar parenting philosophies and lifestyles and that there is a possible connection between that and the kids sleep habits?
    Well maybe if you found and used the right % then people would get less shirty with you.

    I have a big day nap because I wake at 5am every bloody day of the week and use my naps 2-3 days a week to recover. I do family stuff late on sat night every week as I think it's important my kids go to church with their extended family and learn that family events supersede individual needs.

    My friends are varied and come from various backgrounds. But you are right, I don't have any "SOS" friends. But anecdotal stories from my work colleagues (not my friends) also talk about kids that wake overnight.

    It's obvious you don't understand or wish to understand why people get grumpy with your statements. Rather than saying that SOS worked for you and your boys, you keep going on about how 9.5/10 kids WILL sleep thru the night if they are tweaked. My childrens behaviour is not meant to be tweaked! Their behaviour/personality is theirs, for better or worse. Yes some changes might help, but that's only a chance it will work . You refuse to admit that not everyone is up to your standard of "normal" and that are variances of normal.

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  7. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonja View Post
    Ok I have no interest in derailing another thread but this comment keeps appearing in various sleep related threads:


    "Unless there are medical issues sleep throughout from kids are feasible with some tweaks to routine."

    I have 4 children who ALL still wake at various times overnight for various different reasons.

    My nearly 10 yo has nightmares. At least twice a week. She wakes and is extremely upset and can take awhile to go back to sleep.

    My 6 year old has an anxiety condition and is very wakeful. She often doesn't go to sleep until nearly 9pm and frequently wakes between 2 and 4am and again can be awake for up to an hour. There is no reason for this waking. She just wakes.

    My 4 year old son wakes about 3 x a week because he's cold, had a bad dream or just wakes and wants a cuddle and someone to stay with him until he goes back to sleep.

    My nearly 2 year old has never slept through. She is a terrible sleeper and doesn't need much sleep because she wakes at 530 am and is charming sweet and happy. She doesn't sleep during the day and goes down at 7.

    None of them fall asleep easily.

    Dh is a wonderful sleeper and can sleep anywhere and anytime. He spends most of his night moving from bedroom to bedroom settling our children.

    I am a terrible sleeper. Have been my entire life. As a child I never went to bed without a fight. I woke very early. But my parents never lost their temper with me and just accepted me for the terrible sleeper I was. I was the youngest of 4 and we were all different.

    I have done EVERYTHING humanly possible or imaginable to get my kids to sleep through reliably. The planets align once or twice a month and they all sleep well on the same night.

    My kids have no underlying medical issues that are behind this. No sore ears, nothing. They are just not great at sleeping. But neither am I. Luckily we are great at other things.

    Anyway I am so tired of reading on here that with tweaks in routine, or adjusting this or that, my kids could sleep through. Or maybe if I just tried this or that.

    Ok rant over. This isn't a debate thread. I merely started this so those of us with kids who don't sleep well know they are not alone.

    Oh and I don't want advice about how to make my kids sleep through either. 😀
    My bold but I'm I've just caught up on this thread and I'm kinda bummed at how it's gone off on a tangent. It would've been nice to have a place for people to feel less alone.

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  9. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rose&Aurelia View Post
    Well maybe if you found and used the right % then people would get less shirty with you.

    I have a big day nap because I wake at 5am every bloody day of the week and use my naps 2-3 days a week to recover. I do family stuff late on sat night every week as I think it's important my kids go to church with their extended family and learn that family events supersede individual needs.

    My friends are varied and come from various backgrounds. But you are right, I don't have any "SOS" friends. But anecdotal stories from my work colleagues (not my friends) also talk about kids that wake overnight.

    It's obvious you don't understand or wish to understand why people get grumpy with your statements. Rather than saying that SOS worked for you and your boys, you keep going on about how 9.5/10 kids WILL sleep thru the night if they are tweaked. My childrens behaviour is not meant to be tweaked! Their behaviour/personality is theirs, for better or worse. Yes some changes might help, but that's only a chance it will work . You refuse to admit that not everyone is up to your standard of "normal" and that are variances of normal.
    I don't want to pick on you, but I will pick on the sentiment, if VP isn't allowed to quote a stat she believes to be the ballpark of reality (in her opinion), then sorry but no one on the other end of the opinions are allowed to quote that it's less than that.

    The reality is VP doesn't know, nor do any of us!!! We are quoting anecdotal evidence, not specific studies of sleep.

    TH isn't the only sleep expert who says there are ways to get children sleeping better / there are plenty. I've mentioned Sarah Blunden for example - check out her website. She's a paediatric sleep psychologist. I'd hazard a guess that 90 out of every 100 children she sees will sleep better after using all of her advice (which by the way doesn't involve controlled crying or the TH method) http://www.sleepeducation.net.au/Dr%...%20Blunden.php.

    In fact I'd be interested to get her take in how many kids in her opinion can sleep better with her gentle methods! I really do think they would be quite close to the figure VP is quoting.

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  11. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rose&Aurelia View Post
    Well maybe if you found and used the right % then people would get less shirty with you.

    I have a big day nap because I wake at 5am every bloody day of the week and use my naps 2-3 days a week to recover. I do family stuff late on sat night every week as I think it's important my kids go to church with their extended family and learn that family events supersede individual needs.

    My friends are varied and come from various backgrounds. But you are right, I don't have any "SOS" friends. But anecdotal stories from my work colleagues (not my friends) also talk about kids that wake overnight.

    It's obvious you don't understand or wish to understand why people get grumpy with your statements. Rather than saying that SOS worked for you and your boys, you keep going on about how 9.5/10 kids WILL sleep thru the night if they are tweaked. My childrens behaviour is not meant to be tweaked! Their behaviour/personality is theirs, for better or worse. Yes some changes might help, but that's only a chance it will work . You refuse to admit that not everyone is up to your standard of "normal" and that are variances of normal.
    Hey perhaps there's a misunderstanding - I wasn't cranky or upset with you... Wasn't having a dig at your lifestyle at all - infact I Have a developing fondness for your flexible routine. I think everyone is allowed to have a view on this and it's ok if those views are different. Agree to disagree without getting narky

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  13. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Squared View Post
    I really do think they would be quite close to the figure VP is quoting.
    You're saying I am a good plucker?

  14. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    You're saying I am a good plucker?
    You're a great mother plucker 😜

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  16. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-Squared View Post
    You're a great mother plucker 😜
    Pluck you

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