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  1. #51
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    The 'too much on my plate' was a newborn who didn't sleep well and the rest of family down with the flu my self included..
    But yes I do and will always blame myself. So there is no need for you to point it out and rub salt into a open wound.
    Last edited by LoveLivesHere; 09-06-2015 at 20:41.

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  3. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by harvs View Post
    But how is it about having too much on your plate? How is it about not concentrating on your parenting? I honestly don't get how it's possible to be so black and white about it when there is so much exploration into the science behind it.

    People do stuff like this every day - go to the kitchen to turn the oven on, sit back down having hung the washing out instead. Two hours later go and get the roast out of the cold oven. This is the extreme and devastating end of that same phenomenon.

    I think blindly being sure this will never happen to you means not putting any measures into place to avoid it, which is, ok *just as* risky. No one has come out and said "yeah on some level I always felt this would happen to me".

    I'm terrified of it. It's put me off driving for a long time. So I will be doing something, anything, when the time comes, to hope that it doesn't happen.

    I'm sure the poor parents feel the 'partly on them ness' keenly for the rest of their days. But to put it solely down to shoddy parenting or being busy does little to raise awareness in others.

    And yes, I confess I do feel prickly about it because I constantly have 'too much on my plate' and not much choice about it. Still doesn't mean I'm a more risky parent than someone who is convinced they don't need to implement any measures at all.

    ETA @VicPark I do understand the horror behind it and I do get why people feel this way to some degree. Have you read the article? Just wondering how you felt about it.
    Not concentrating is the cause. How else would you forget a child?

    Sorry if I have come across harsh but this topic has come up alot on facebook lately in which friends agree with my view. Many of us just can't comprehend how someone could forget a child. Dh and I were just discussing this topic last night too. If anyone has alot on their plate atm it is me, but that's not an excuse, I would never ever forget my child, no matter how busy I am I concentrate and I would never be careless enough to not know what I was doing. Simple as that!

  4. #53
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    I haven't read all the replies but Oprah had this topic on years ago...it was about a mum who left her child in the car who sadly died.
    The dad always did the daycare drop off and for some reason the mum did it this time. The baby fell asleep straight away so there was no noise. The mum was on autopilot and had to get to work and just completely forgot about her child. It was completely tragic and the mother was absolutely devastated. She now does safety speeches to schools and families. One suggestion was to leave your handbag in the back seat.
    I've never forgotten it.
    I think as mothers, it's so unfair to label and judge these parents who legitimately forget their children. I cannot imagine the pain that they must go through. I think everyone could be in the same position. Do you think they ever imagined this would happen to them?? I often head to the shops but end up driving halfway to work, make a wrong turn etc. I know it's very different but I can understand that it can happen. You have no idea what is going on for them at home, what's on their mind, what they are battling.
    It's sad, but we need more understanding and to realise that we have too much on our plates.

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  6. #54
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    Yes though, you could. Anyone could. I absolutely think that those who have "too much on their plate" but acknowledging that things like this can happen to anyone and take measures to make sure they don't, are far less risk than someone who just thinks they aren't "careless" so it would never happen to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blessedwith3boys View Post
    Not concentrating is the cause. How else would you forget a child?

    Sorry if I have come across harsh but this topic has come up alot on facebook lately in which friends agree with my view. Many of us just can't comprehend how someone could forget a child. Dh and I were just discussing this topic last night too. If anyone has alot on their plate atm it is me, but that's not an excuse, I would never ever forget my child, no matter how busy I am I concentrate and I would never be careless enough to not know what I was doing. Simple as that!

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  8. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoveLivesHere View Post
    The 'too much on my plate' was a newborn who didn't sleep well and the rest of family down with the flu my self included..
    But yes I do and will always blame myself. So there is no need for you to point it out and rub salt into a open wound.
    That absolutely wasn't my intention to rub salt into an open wound. If you feel upset over the incident that's because mistakes that can lead to a child's death are upsetting.

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  10. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blessedwith3boys View Post
    Not concentrating is the cause. How else would you forget a child?

    Sorry if I have come across harsh but this topic has come up alot on facebook lately in which friends agree with my view. Many of us just can't comprehend how someone could forget a child. Dh and I were just discussing this topic last night too. If anyone has alot on their plate atm it is me, but that's not an excuse, I would never ever forget my child, no matter how busy I am I concentrate and I would never be careless enough to not know what I was doing. Simple as that!
    I hope you're right and it does never happen to you. I also hope you can have a little compassion for the people it does happen to. Research has shown us the human brain has an amazing ability to operate on autopilot, with sometimes dire consequences. For the people who have lost a child because of it, I imagine they will always blame themselves and certainly don't need the rest of us to pile on too. Spreading the word about fatal distraction and ways to minimise the risk is far more productive than arguing about why it'll never happen to you.

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  12. #57
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    Well when I did it I was on maternity leave. It was my second child. The only thing on my plate was the kids. Yet it happened.

    Hell in those early days sometimes I heard a noise and thought what was that? Then I remembered I had a second child.

    Even having an empty plate won't make you perfect. But say in the case of Love Lives Here, what's she going to do, make her family not have the flu? Just not be tired?

    It's as stupid as Joe Hockey's statement today that people should just have more money. Oh ok.

    Now I know since the critics here have explained it that its not believable I could forget a child I guess I won't do it again.

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  14. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blessedwith3boys View Post
    Not concentrating is the cause. How else would you forget a child?

    Sorry if I have come across harsh but this topic has come up alot on facebook lately in which friends agree with my view. Many of us just can't comprehend how someone could forget a child. Dh and I were just discussing this topic last night too. If anyone has alot on their plate atm it is me, but that's not an excuse, I would never ever forget my child, no matter how busy I am I concentrate and I would never be careless enough to not know what I was doing. Simple as that!
    But have you read the article?!

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    Default 60 minutes tonight - fatal distraction story

    Quote Originally Posted by harvs View Post

    ETA @VicPark I do understand the horror behind it and I do get why people feel this way to some degree. Have you read the article? Just wondering how you felt about it.
    I read the Washington Post article. It was very long. And those poor kids - yes I did shed a tear

    The article didn't really change my views on culpability though - and it didn't convince me about the science behind fatal attraction syndrome - there was more commentary and opinion in the article than science. I think 60 minutes was more convincing in that regard.

    One thing in the article that struck me was the line that describing the tragedies as an accident suggests they aren't preventable. And I'm of the view that in a lot if cases they are preventable.

    The article mentions that a combination of stress, emotion, lack of sleep and change in routine is a recipe for disaster. If someone is so stressed and emotional that they are at risk of leaving their child in a car then they need to put their hand up and ask for help and if that's not available (because yes I know support services aren't always up to par) they need to step back and take a breather. If they don't and their child comes to harm then yes I think they are culpable.

    If someone is severely sleep deprived, drives a car and kills someone then they are culpable - to me it doesn't matter that they are a loving parent they did something a reasonable person should have known not to do. The only possible mitigating factor to this is (in my mind) mental illness where someone does not have the ability to analyse risk like a person who is mentally healthy can.

    As for the father Harrison in the article. Don't get me wrong I feel for him and his family. The article mentioned he was preoccupied with work problems and on his cell phone talking. He was distracted and stressed, his child wasn't his top priority for a chunk of time the child was in his care, he didn't check himself and set boundaries around his work, so yes I think he was negligent and yes I agree with the prosecutors decision to charge him.
    Last edited by VicPark; 09-06-2015 at 21:25.

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  17. #60
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    For me the science part (while not empirically proven afaik) opened my mind up to look beyond a purely emotional response iykwim? I agree, it was a very distressing article.

    I do personally find the brain/memory information quite convincing. I also think it is a symptom of the broader societal issues of working 24/7, lack of support services, lack of work/life balance etc. It's like the 'Swiss cheese' theory in the article - it's the culmination of a specific and tragic combination of events, and particularly the change in routine part being a huge factor.

    For me, it is something now that I think I will always try to be extra mindful of it when/if my routine changes, and I'm grateful to the article for that.

    I do agree that, as with all accidents and mistakes, there are elements of culpability or 'bad choices'. I just don't think it's possible to dismiss all the other factors absolutely.

    You know me - little miss shades of grey :-)

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