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  1. #1
    harvs's Avatar
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    Default My toddler and his sleeping

    I'm after advice on where to from here. Most of you know I'm not going to do CC/CIO but I am certainly welcoming knowledge/strategies etc from everyone no matter which 'camp' you're in :-)

    So, DS was a terrible sleeper until about 18 months when he was able to be put down, one of us could walk out and he would self settle and go off to sleep with no crying at all. He would still wake in the night sometimes but was usually easy to resettle.

    Then his CC got overwhelmed with babies and so, with my permission, they moved him to a little cot for day naps. This is when his sleeping habits changed at home at night. When I asked them, they said they were sitting with him because otherwise he would get up and run off the little cot thing. So, since this he can no longer self settle.

    He is now 2.5. I have weaned him off of his dummy for all except night time sleeps but 9/10 times he will reject it. He won't sleep unless someone is in the room with him, and if it's me I usually have to hold his hand. The good news is once he sleeps he almost always sleeps through unless he is sick.

    This year he has been sleeping later and later in the evenings. Last night it was 10. The night before was midnight :-/ it's generally between 8.30 and 10.30 but occasionally later. It's very difficult because I am losing practically my whole evenings.

    I also think he is overtired all the time as he has been getting about 9 hours sleep and I have been limiting his naps to an hour at CC. On the weekends he will nap for three hours if I let him (and FOB always just lets him sleep).

    A couple of times I have experimented with no day nap, with the result that he goes down easily at 7 but wakes for a party between 1-4, which tells me he isn't ready to drop his day naps yet. Is this correct?

    Should I just wear the late sleeps knowing that he will sleep through? Should I be doing something about his day sleeps? I'd love to get back to the self settling thing. Am I right he should still be getting about 12 hours sleep total every 24 hour period?

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    Subbing..... Hugs, Sounds like my 3yr old.

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    My girl was a really, really difficult child when it came to sleep until she was about three so I feel your pain.

    My thoughts are that yes he is overtired and still needs a day sleep but it's obviously the time and length of the sleep that will need tweaking. I would aim for 1.5 hours, 2 at a maximum. What time does he go to sleep during the day?

    With his nights? What is his wind down like?

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    Quote Originally Posted by harvs View Post
    I'm after advice on where to from here. Most of you know I'm not going to do CC/CIO but I am certainly welcoming knowledge/strategies etc from everyone no matter which 'camp' you're in :-)

    So, DS was a terrible sleeper until about 18 months when he was able to be put down, one of us could walk out and he would self settle and go off to sleep with no crying at all. He would still wake in the night sometimes but was usually easy to resettle.

    Then his CC got overwhelmed with babies and so, with my permission, they moved him to a little cot for day naps. This is when his sleeping habits changed at home at night. When I asked them, they said they were sitting with him because otherwise he would get up and run off the little cot thing. So, since this he can no longer self settle.

    He is now 2.5. I have weaned him off of his dummy for all except night time sleeps but 9/10 times he will reject it. He won't sleep unless someone is in the room with him, and if it's me I usually have to hold his hand. The good news is once he sleeps he almost always sleeps through unless he is sick.

    This year he has been sleeping later and later in the evenings. Last night it was 10. The night before was midnight :-/ it's generally between 8.30 and 10.30 but occasionally later. It's very difficult because I am losing practically my whole evenings.

    I also think he is overtired all the time as he has been getting about 9 hours sleep and I have been limiting his naps to an hour at CC. On the weekends he will nap for three hours if I let him (and FOB always just lets him sleep).

    A couple of times I have experimented with no day nap, with the result that he goes down easily at 7 but wakes for a party between 1-4, which tells me he isn't ready to drop his day naps yet. Is this correct?

    Should I just wear the late sleeps knowing that he will sleep through? Should I be doing something about his day sleeps? I'd love to get back to the self settling thing. Am I right he should still be getting about 12 hours sleep total every 24 hour period?
    I still sit with my kids as they sleep, they are now 2.5&4.5yo. Usually takes 5-20min but on odd occasions I have sat with them for an hour. What I do is put them to bed and say mummy needs to do some work ( usually cleaning kitchen and packing lunches for next day) and then after I do my jobs I come and sit down in their room. Most often in the time I've been busy the kids will wind down and chat to each other or just play quietly with their toys in bed. Any noise gets the toy or book confiscated. Once my jobs are done (make the jobs quick in the beginning) I sit down with them and my iPad and headphones. I either read a book, play on bh or watch something on you tube whilst sitting With the kiddos. Or you could try the camping out method? I think @rainbowroad had success with it.

    I agree he is too young to drop his naps. Kids his age need 12-13hrs sleep in 24. IMO his current bedtime is too late. I don't know how his sleep cycles work but if I miss the 6.30pm cycle for my two the next time they fall asleep is 8-8.15pm ish. Then is 10-10.30pm and then midnight. I know this as we frequently go out at night and those are the times my kids get tired. In between they are energiser bunnies.

    You might need to focus on 3-4 days of getting him bathed and in bed by 7-7.30pm (or whatever time best suits you). From memory it takes 3 days of bedtime at the same time to set your body Clock. So you might need to be really consistent for those days. Are you still on school holidays? Will you be able to do that?

    Additionally - try carb loading him before naps and bedtime. Carbs followed by a warm milk drink increase serotonin production and promote sleepy times. Macaroni and cheese or any pasta bakes or dal/rice are great for sending my two off into a carb induced sleep coma.

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  8. #5
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    Default My toddler and his sleeping

    So he gets an hour at the moment at cc then I let him sleep on weekends because I figure he's running at a deficit so I can be flexible.

    His wake time is between 6 and 8 hours. So if he wakes at 7am he won't nap until at least 1. Say he only gets an hour and sleeps until 2, then he will not sleep until at least 9.

    But then on Friday when we drove to Adelaide he had a second nap on the car from 4.30 until 6, then was asleep again at 10. And yesterday he slept again in the car at 12.30 and he only woke up for the day at 9. He slept til 2 then he was awake until 10!

    I can't figure out how the timing of his day nap can work well with such a long awake time.

    I think I need better wind down strategies. We usually have a book together and lie down in the dark and do some quiet songs and cuddles before I put him down. I insist on him sleeping in his own bed, but it's the only battle I'm winning atm...

    ETA I should add I always have him in bed between 7 and 7.30 (except for tonight because I am sick and in slow motion). I give him 15, 10 and 5 minute reminders before bed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by harvs View Post
    So he gets an hour at the moment at cc then I let him sleep on weekends because I figure he's running at a deficit so I can be flexible.

    His wake time is between 6 and 8 hours. So if he wakes at 7am he won't nap until at least 1. Say he only gets an hour and sleeps until 2, then he will not sleep until at least 9.

    But then on Friday when we drove to Adelaide he had a second nap on the car from 4.30 until 6, then was asleep again at 10. And yesterday he slept again in the car at 12.30 and he only woke up for the day at 9. He slept til 2 then he was awake until 10!

    I can't figure out how the timing of his day nap can work well with such a long awake time.

    I think I need better wind down strategies. We usually have a book together and lie down in the dark and do some quiet songs and cuddles before I put him down. I insist on him sleeping in his own bed, but it's the only battle I'm winning atm...

    ETA I should add I always have him in bed between 7 and 7.30 (except for tonight because I am sick and in slow motion). I give him 15, 10 and 5 minute reminders before bed.
    I think you are too inconsistent with his sleep times. Make a consistent wake up time of 6.30am, nap at 12-1.30pm (and if he sleeps less oh well) then bedtime 7-7.30pm. Because he is currently all over the shop he doesn't have an internal body clock. My dd2 is 34mths old so a bit more than your son. Today she woke at 5.45am (bedtime was 8pm yesterday as we were out) napped 12.15-2.45pm then bedtime 7.45pm.

    You might have to stick to a schedule for 3-5days to get him in a routine. Then tweak it later as needed.

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    Ok, thanks I'll try that. I mean the consistent morning wake up is what I did when he was younger, so I feel a bit stupid now :-)

    So if I start this on the weekend and also tell CC this, what would you ask them to do if he's not asleep by 1.30, which is highly possible?

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    I think you need to be consistent.

    Yes he needs a nap but I would be maxing it for 1 hour. My daughter goes to bed at 6:30 every night. Our routine is dinner, bath, book but she won't let me read so kind of just messes around then bed. I have to hold her hand now. Previous we did CIO. She was a great sleeper but since we moved she's changed and I'm ok with that

    She sleeps through still. At sleep school they said if you need them to GOTO bed earlier wake them earlier?! Lol strange but true! Takes a while to adapt too.

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    I wouldn't let him sleep longer on the weekends because I think consistency is the key when it comes to sleep. As much as possible I would give it a week of consistent wake up, day sleep and bedtime and see how you go. So eg wake him at 6.30/7, day sleep at 12.30 and bed at 7/7.30pm. I'm a happy bed sharer but if you want to keep him in his own bed then definitely keep doing that and either lay with him or do as R&A suggested and do the I'm just going to do a job and then I will be back, which will give him a bit of alone time. I'd also limit screen time and anything too excitable right before bed.

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    I personally would drop the day nap. I tend to reduce day sleeps first in order to have a 7pm ish bedtime. Other families prefer a day sleep & later bed time, so I think that depends on your family. Do you feel like daycare could be being dishonest with you about how long he is sleeping there? My 2.5yo DD goes to bed between 6.30-7, & is up between 6.30-7 in the morning. She has a day nap about 1-2 days a week, & I usually wake her after an hour. So i would drop day nap & hope he was tired at about 6.30 after daycare & nice early bed time if it were me personally.

    As for the night settling & wake ups, are you happy to hold his hand to go to sleep, or would prefer not to? Maybe a comforter, or as a PP said, tell him 'mummy is just going to wash the dishes & then I'll be back' &then make sure you come back within a reasonable time (say 5-10 mins), so he has the chance to fall asleep, but you dont take too long, so he trusts youre coming back. Does he have a cuddle toy that plays music or something to provide soothing background noise as he goes to sleep? There are toys you can get that play 10 mins of lullabies, etc, I think they work well. Good luck...

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