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  1. #251
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    What I don't get is that they are clearly doing some amazing thins in prison, surely it's in Indonesia's best interests to keep them alive and helping others. It just seems so clear that Indonesia will also lose out from their deaths.

  2. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPink View Post
    I don't know the ins and outs of this course bar the initial arrest and the current awful situation, but did they really appeal a life sentence? A previous poster wrote this. Why would they have done that???? Like a life sentence is daunting but surely they would have been advised that smuggling drugs could lead to the death penalty?

    I'm really shocked about that. But I still do not agree with the death penalty and believe they deserve a second chance at life. I read in an article recently that 9 prisoners offered to take their places in being executed- I think that is very telling of the positive influence they've had in the prison.

    So sad for their families.
    http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2015-02-12/bali-nine-timeline-andrew-chan-myuran-sukumaran/6085190

    After consulting the all seeing google i admit i was wrong, these two were handed death straight away according to this story. The other four appealed and had their sentences increased on Sept 6 2006.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beebs View Post
    What I don't get is that they are clearly doing some amazing thins in prison, surely it's in Indonesia's best interests to keep them alive and helping others. It just seems so clear that Indonesia will also lose out from their deaths.
    Out of curiosity have you been to Indonesia? I'm only wondering as i might have had a different experience there, but it doesn't surprise me that they have no concept of them losing out in this situation..the disregard for life there is pretty obvious, which i will admit isn't extensive by any means!

    But when you've got suspects trying to shove drugs down your dress so cops can blackmail you for your cash 5 metres up the street you kind of get a distain for the place. I will never set foot there again, and that was before this media attention to the Bali 9. IMO the whole country is disgusting.

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  5. #254
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    Quote Originally Posted by heplusme View Post
    http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2015-02-12/bali-nine-timeline-andrew-chan-myuran-sukumaran/6085190

    After consulting the all seeing google i admit i was wrong, these two were handed death straight away according to this story. The other four appealed and had their sentences increased on Sept 6 2006.
    Thanks for confirming that -
    It just seemed so risky to appeal in their circumstance.

  6. #255
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    Default Debate thread for discussing the death penalty and the Bali 9

    I was reading an article earlier that 2 Indonesian drug smugglers who are in an Australian jail will be allowed out in 2017 and free to go home to their families. They smuggled quite a large amount on a boat. I'll try and find the link.

  7. #256
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    http://m.smh.com.au/national/indones...uch.touch.html

    "In two years' time, a big-time Indonesian heroin smuggler will become eligible for parole in the Australian prison system. If it is granted, he'll be taken to the airport and flown back home to his family.

    Kristito Mandagi is one of three Indonesians who, like condemned Bali nine members Myuran Sukumaran and Andrew Chan, were caught trying to import heroin to Australia.

    Unlike the Australian pair, they were lucky to have been caught by the Australian police, not by those in Bali.

    They are particularly lucky because their heroin importation was 47 times bigger than Chan's and Sukumaran's."

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  9. #257
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    No, I was on a stop over there for 9 hours once as a child, my mother, my brother and I (we were 11 and 9 at the time) walked the wrong way in the airport and had about 9 machine guns pointed at us with men screaming at us in Indonesian -we were all so scared, I thought they'd kill us. I vowed I would never go back, they lost me then and there. But yeah, even that slight encounter made me realise that they were very different, and not in the good way. I tend to avoid South-East Asia if I possibly can, and if I can't, I fly through Singapore (which still has the death penalty) but they aren't as corrupt other countries in the region.

    Quote Originally Posted by heplusme View Post
    Out of curiosity have you been to Indonesia? I'm only wondering as i might have had a different experience there, but it doesn't surprise me that they have no concept of them losing out in this situation..the disregard for life there is pretty obvious, which i will admit isn't extensive by any means!

    But when you've got suspects trying to shove drugs down your dress so cops can blackmail you for your cash 5 metres up the street you kind of get a distain for the place. I will never set foot there again, and that was before this media attention to the Bali 9. IMO the whole country is disgusting.

  10. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    You really don't understand? Injustices become closer to someone the closer the connection they have to the victim. So Australians are taking more notice because Australians are involved. It doesn't necessarily mean that people are ok with the abuses happening beforehand.
    I'd appreciate it if you weren't condescending. I understand perfectly i just don't agree with your viewpoint. Is that ok?

  11. #259
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    Default Debate thread for discussing the death penalty and the Bali 9

    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    No . They share the blame with the people that choose to ingest that crap in the first place. That's one of the reasons why I am against the death penalty in this case - because the 'victims' share such a large degree of culpability.
    I'm still catching up on the thread but this caught my eye.

    There are SO many more victims in this 'war on drugs' than just users that may OD. Dealers, smugglers, gangs, drug lords, etc. literally ruin countries and endanger surrounding countries. They have no regard for human life, at all. Mexico has hundreds, if not thousands, of completely innocent people who have lost their lives because of the massive problem of drug cartels in their country.

    I don't believe these two men's punishment should be death but I do have an incredibly hard time mustering up any type of compassion for them. The consequences of them smugglings drugs is so much more far reaching than junkies.

  12. #260
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    Default Debate thread for discussing the death penalty and the Bali 9

    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    Sorry I don't buy it. Did the law say they HAD to work with international colleagues to arrest criminals? There are many ways a job can be done. Waiting until the offenders arrived in Australia to arrest them can hardly be seen as the police not doing their job.
    I'm sure there's something regarding diplomatic relations, international procedure, etc that explains why the AFP did what they did and why we do not understand. This probably has a lot to do with Indonesia's stance on drugs and the fact that the Bali 9 had the drugs IN Indonesia, whether they were smuggling out or not. I understand why people are questioning the AFP but at the end of the day we are all responsible for the choices we make and I do think it's a bit unfair to hold the AFP responsible for these men's lives.
    Last edited by HollyGolightly81; 06-03-2015 at 18:21.

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