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  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by hopeful1986 View Post
    Ok I guess I'm finding this difficult to grasp because no one was talking about these human rights abuses when it was happening to non-Australians. All of a sudden it matters and everyone is outraged. When Schapelle Corby (who I think was innocent) was let out on parole I found most people had very little sympathy for what she's been through (I know she's alive and they won't be, but I'm more just referring to compassion in general).
    And yes, drug users are responsible for their own lives, but I'm not going to feel much pity for the people who put those addictive drugs on the street to pray on (let's face it) very vulnerable people. Hurting yourself is one thing. Hurting others is entirely different.

    I'm completely against the death penalty. I don't think they deserve what's happening. I'm more skeptical about why people all of a sudden feel outraged. This has been going on for a long time.
    You really don't understand? Injustices become closer to someone the closer the connection they have to the victim. So Australians are taking more notice because Australians are involved. It doesn't necessarily mean that people are ok with the abuses happening beforehand.

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  3. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by heplusme View Post
    .

    We cannot control backwards developing countries.
    True. But we can refrain from handing them our citizens on a silver platter.

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  5. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    True. But we can refrain from handing them our citizens on a silver platter.
    Its unfortunate they made the choice to smuggle internationally.

  6. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by heplusme View Post
    Maybe that is exactly why i seem like i am lacking in empathy. This particular topic has made you realise that, but some realised it much earlier then this particular issue. Its not that i don't care, its that I'm not surprised.
    No, it isn't that at all. I've always known the world is a scary place, I think it is more that i am shocked about the general every day persons reactions to this particular case. I didn't realise that so many people would be so gleefully jumping up and down baying for blood. I'm not talking about you by the way, but even people on the ABC facebook page. It has really shocked me, I think I thought that we as a nation were forgiving, but I was wrong.

  7. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by heplusme View Post
    Beebs it is very, very clear from this thread how you feel. You have stated it many time. And i believe we have already discussed my opinion on other countries in the first few pages of this thread so i will not repeat myself.

    I have not once said i think they deserve to die. I have not once said the death penalty isn't an abuse of human rights. I have not once said it is ok so live in the 1800's when it comes to such a disregard of human life.

    The law cannot please everyone. The AFP were doing their jobs.

    We cannot control backwards developing countries. If we could thousands of women wouldn't get raped and kidnapped in Africa, families wouldn't be escaping extremists in the middle east in droves. Its easy to think the world is a lovely place from our safe little cul-de-sacs in Aus, fact is its not.
    The highlighted part is not so clear cut. The Mutual Assistance Treaty processes upon the arrest of the Bali 9 were not so clear cut back then and there were grey areas in terms of procedures which when dealing with foreign police forces which could expose an Australian citizen to the death penalty. If this happened today then Australia would not have 3 Australian citizens on death row at the hands of decisions made by unclear and shady processes/procedures by the AFP. There role is certainly not to babysit - it is also not to assist foreign police in cases where the death penalty may be imposed - this is according to the AFP's own Death Penalty Charge Guide.

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  9. #246
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    If people are saying the drug smugglers knew the risks... There were signs everywhere etc... Then surely our highly trained police also knew the risks if sharing information with the Indonesians... That it would likely lead to the death penalty for some? They couldn't be that daft to not realise this. They just chose to proceed anyway which is what people find abhorrent.

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  11. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by heplusme View Post
    Its unfortunate they made the choice to smuggle internationally.
    Yep true....it's also unfortunate the Australian police chose to share information with a country that had the death penalty. There are varying levels of blame here, you are right in saying the offenders share part.

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  13. #248
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    I find it strange that people say Australia shouldn't get all up in Indonesia's business but it's quite alright for the AFP to do it.

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  15. #249
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    I'm not convinced of Schapelle's guilt either. I remember a public outcry though. I think Indonesia's history is enough to question all convictions, particularly those from other countries, they seem to be very lenient when it comes to their own. At least here we and foreigners are all treated equally.

    Quote Originally Posted by hopeful1986 View Post
    Ok I guess I'm finding this difficult to grasp because no one was talking about these human rights abuses when it was happening to non-Australians. All of a sudden it matters and everyone is outraged. When Schapelle Corby (who I think was innocent) was let out on parole I found most people had very little sympathy for what she's been through (I know she's alive and they won't be, but I'm more just referring to compassion in general).
    And yes, drug users are responsible for their own lives, but I'm not going to feel much pity for the people who put those addictive drugs on the street to pray on (let's face it) very vulnerable people. Hurting yourself is one thing. Hurting others is entirely different.

    I'm completely against the death penalty. I don't think they deserve what's happening. I'm more skeptical about why people all of a sudden feel outraged. This has been going on for a long time.

  16. #250
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    I don't know the ins and outs of this course bar the initial arrest and the current awful situation, but did they really appeal a life sentence? A previous poster wrote this. Why would they have done that???? Like a life sentence is daunting but surely they would have been advised that smuggling drugs could lead to the death penalty?

    I'm really shocked about that. But I still do not agree with the death penalty and believe they deserve a second chance at life. I read in an article recently that 9 prisoners offered to take their places in being executed- I think that is very telling of the positive influence they've had in the prison.

    So sad for their families.


 

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