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  1. #21
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    It's not satire if it's attacking marginalized groups, it's just a ****ty joke reinforcing harmful stereotypes that can lead to those marginalized groups being further ostracized. Calling it satire just makes people feel better about what they're laughing at.

    People can joke about whatever they want. As long as they don't get ****y when I give them the biggest sideye of their life.

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  3. #22
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    Busy-Bee is offline Offending people since before Del :D
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    Quote Originally Posted by hollypolly View Post
    I think there is a line when it comes to freedom of speech. For example, I think something that incites violence/ racial hatred crosses that line. Defamation crosses that line. In commercial transactions (which are clearly different to jokes/ cartoons) deceit and misrepresentation crosses that line.

    When George Brandis wanted to reform the racial vilification laws to allow for hate speech to be legalised, I personally was completely against those amendments. I believe in freedom of speech, but not totally unfetted freedom of speech, because I think that too can be dangerous.

    For example, I personally believe generally rape jokes are not acceptable because I consider they promote rape culture and this is dangerous to society.
    I agree, there has to be accountability and would not support freedom of speech to incite hatred, violence, racism, etc.

    Defamation laws are about holding people accountable to what they say and protecting innocent people from false accusations.

    As repulsive as I believe rape, domestic violence, misogynist 'jokes' to be, I am still very uncomfortable with the idea of censoring them. I would much prefer that there is an equal platform for feminists, social justice advocates etc to be able to express why such 'jokes' are immoral and perpetuate rape culture. This is now a lot more possible thanks to the internet and social media. People should be accountable for what they say - if you tell rape 'jokes' (and even if you listen to rape 'jokes' without interjecting) then you are contributing to a culture where violence against women is trivialized, normalised and accepted.

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  5. #23
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    SuperGranny is offline Worlds best grandma! Winner 2012 - Most Helpful Member
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    this is a good topic to debate. I think the line will be something that is constantly moving. depending on the audience, and the person delivering the joke, and the circumstances in society at that time. my son regularly does standup comedy in Brisbane, and he has often changed his routine and his focus. I think this is the same for anyone who just likes to make people think. Basically that is what the people from this French paper do, and they should be allowed to do that without any violence, and without breaking any laws. marie.

  6. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by hopeful1986 View Post
    It's not satire if it's attacking marginalized groups, it's just a ****ty joke reinforcing harmful stereotypes that can lead to those marginalized groups being further ostracized. Calling it satire just makes people feel better about what they're laughing at.

    People can joke about whatever they want. As long as they don't get ****y when I give them the biggest sideye of their life.
    Did you read this part of the interview by the Editor of Charlie Hebdo?

    You will agree that this is not the first time you publish cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed. Isn't it relentlessness?

    Those who say that do not read Charlie Hebdo. Out of 1058 issues, there are only three front pages on Islam. Every week we defend illgal migrants, many of whom are Muslims, we fight against racism and discrimination, we are fighting for the right to vote for immigrants... And personally, I was against the law against wearing the full-face veil. But the media never talk about Charlie Hebdo for these positions , which are rather in favor of Muslims.
    The fact is that there is a real issue with Islam and violence, whether it be violence directed at those who have publicly mocked Islam/blasphemed or violence as a strategy to progress the cause of Islam. To deny that we (as in we - the world) create an elephant in the room situation. The question is, why has this situation come about and what can we do about it?

    Now, in the interest of clarity I am NOT suggesting all Muslims are terrorists, advocate violence or any thing of the sort. I welcome any and all people to Australia who are seeking a peaceful life for themselves and their families and are willing to embrace established, generalized, cultural norms such as liberalism, gender & racial equality, respect/mateship for fellow people, freedom of speech and respect for the law. (Yes, I get that we are not perfect in Australia - I am talking in general.)

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    I agree with Busy Bee. You can tell a rape joke if you want- but be aware, there will be repercussions. You can make light of DV like the guy from bliss n eso did- but you will have to cop the response to it like backlash online, media cover, losing fans etc. Same goes for music. American rapper Rick Ross had awful lyrics in one of his songs- essentially about drugging and raping someone- it cost him a brand sponsorship deal. He's not the only one. So while we are free to say what we want, it doesn't come without a cost and nor should it. I support the implied free speech we have that does not tolerate hate speech and vilification.

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  10. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Busy-Bee View Post
    Did you read this part of the interview by the Editor of Charlie Hebdo?



    The fact is that there is a real issue with Islam and violence, whether it be violence directed at those who have publicly mocked Islam/blasphemed or violence as a strategy to progress the cause of Islam. To deny that we (as in we - the world) create an elephant in the room situation. The question is, why has this situation come about and what can we do about it?

    Now, in the interest of clarity I am NOT suggesting all Muslims are terrorists, advocate violence or any thing of the sort. I welcome any and all people to Australia who are seeking a peaceful life for themselves and their families and are willing to embrace established, generalized, cultural norms such as liberalism, gender & racial equality, respect/mateship for fellow people, freedom of speech and respect for the law. (Yes, I get that we are not perfect in Australia - I am talking in general.)
    Why don't people point out the fact that straight white ablebodied men are a huge threat in the West? It doesn't happen. If violence occurs at their hands...the colour of their skin or the religious affiliation isn't pointed out. Even if religion is pointed out, most of the time people just talk about the likelihood of him having a mental illness and whatnot. Guy shoots up a school full of children he's autistic and suffers from bipolar. A muslim man/men does the same thing it's an act of terrorism. There are plenty of elephants in the room people refuse to acknowledge. But if it's relating to Islam there is no excuse apparently.

    The muslim religion from how I understand it doesn't promote violence. We are talking about men who are hungry and desperate for power. Men who are brainwashed into thinking their God wants them to kill people and themselves to prove a point. It's not about progressing Islam, it's about progressing their own ideologies that they claim are Islam.

    And sorry, I'm finding it hard to wrap my head around the cartoon where a priest has a mole in his pants and compares to molesting kids. I'm struggling to see that as satire. Unless I'm missing something.

    It's also late Friday afternoon and my head isn't quite grounded, so sorry if I didn't get the point of your post (genuinely).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Busy-Bee View Post
    The fact is that there is a real issue with Islam and violence, whether it be violence directed at those who have publicly mocked Islam/blasphemed or violence as a strategy to progress the cause of Islam. To deny that we (as in we - the world) create an elephant in the room situation. The question is, why has this situation come about and what can we do about it?
    There's a real problem with white Christian men being violent ********* too. It's just that they do it under the "I have a penis so I am superior" flag instead of the "I am Muslim I am superior" one.

    As for the Muslim terrorists it's all about engaging hormonal youth before they become too disenfranchised. As for the white Christian men it's about slowly changing how society views men and women. Get rid of boys and girls toys from catalogues, shame domestic violence perpetrators etc...

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    Penis didn't get blanked out! Penis penis penis!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by hopeful1986 View Post
    And sorry, I'm finding it hard to wrap my head around the cartoon where a priest has a mole in his pants and compares to molesting kids. I'm struggling to see that as satire. Unless I'm missing something.
    It's not a priest. It's the pope.

    The cartoon was published after the news that the Vatican had a mole broke out.
    It was also a way to denounce the issue of child molesting with the Catholic Church.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExcuseMyFrench View Post
    It's not a priest. It's the pope.

    The cartoon was published after the news that the Vatican had a mole broke out.
    It was also a way to denounce the issue of child molesting with the Catholic Church.
    Now you've explained it I think the cartoon is very clever..

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