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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elijahs Mum View Post
    My dad was conscripted in 1968 and went to Vietnam 6 weeks after his 21st birthday - I can't even begin to tell you how mentally and emotionally scarred he is or the anguish my grandparents and mother went through the 12 months he was sent away at war for - so no - I admire and respect our military but no body should be forced into it against their will
    That was my first thought.
    Look at all of the families destroyed by being forced to go to Vietnam.

    I also think it's an insult to the people that join because they want to. The defense force is not something to waste some time because you can't get a job.

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  3. #12
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    Absolutely crazy.

    My Grandfather served in WWII and my Mum says that he was incredibly scarred by everything he witnessed and did.

    That in turn seeped across to his wife, and down to his 6 children.

    My cousin (Mums sisters daughter) is a psychologist, and is doing her phD on the effects of the war experience down through generations.

    Another thing which horrified me was that after my Grandfather died of throat cancer, my Mother said that she wanted 'the war' put on his death certificare, as she said he went off as a lovely young man, cigarettes were introduced into all the men's rations, he came back very disturbed, addicted to cigarettes and was quite an abusive father, never had any psychological treatment, and died of cancer.

    War is just so awful in so many ways. It acts like a virus, it contaminates many more people than the one who served.

    Just like the survivors of the concentration camps, their families feel the repercussions of that down the generations.

    That Tasmanian senator needs a massive education.

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  5. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilkingMaid View Post
    Absolutely crazy.

    My Grandfather served in WWII and my Mum says that he was incredibly scarred by everything he witnessed and did.

    That in turn seeped across to his wife, and down to his 6 children.

    My cousin (Mums sisters daughter) is a psychologist, and is doing her phD on the effects of the war experience down through generations.

    Another thing which horrified me was that after my Grandfather died of throat cancer, my Mother said that she wanted 'the war' put on his death certificare, as she said he went off as a lovely young man, cigarettes were introduced into all the men's rations, he came back very disturbed, addicted to cigarettes and was quite an abusive father, never had any psychological treatment, and died of cancer.

    War is just so awful in so many ways. It acts like a virus, it contaminates many more people than the one who served.

    Just like the survivors of the concentration camps, their families feel the repercussions of that down the generations.

    That Tasmanian senator needs a massive education.
    I know it's not your intent but your post was hurtful. Dh is currently overseas on deployment with his unit. Referring to families as being contaminated or comparing us to survivors of concentration camps is hurtful. Dh is 4th generation ADF. He would be absolutely devastated if he read this thread.

  6. #14
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    I am NOT comparing YOU to survivors of concentration camps. People who HAVE had that experience live with the fallout.

    I am relating the reality of my mothers life with a war scarred Father. I do not know you, and I do not know your husband. If he is having a good time in the army, as someone who chooses to be there, then all power to him. Just because war HAS destroyed peoples lives is not an insult to anyone whose it hasn't.

    Please think about your post. I have related truths that have deeply affected my family directly. Just because your family has not had the same experience does not make my families experience hurtful to you. In fact that is kinda like 'shutup because you are saying something nasty about something I like'??? Weird and totally lacking in any empathy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sockstealingpoltergeist View Post
    Abhorrent. Something I would never support.

    Conservatives (Australian liberals), make policies that support corporations, pay people less, give less job security and cause people to become desperate, so they are less resistant to beING paid peanuts or be conscripted into the army. Where they will most likely be used as a tool for a corrupt government. IMO.
    I'm pretty sure that is not the angle that this particular senator is coming from. Jacqui is a Palmer United Senator. She has previously run in elections for both labor and liberal. She also served in the army and so has particular views in that regard.

    I don't believe in conscription either, but totally support the need for defence force and all the people serving our country.

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  10. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilkingMaid View Post
    Absolutely crazy.

    My Grandfather served in WWII and my Mum says that he was incredibly scarred by everything he witnessed and did.

    That in turn seeped across to his wife, and down to his 6 children.

    My cousin (Mums sisters daughter) is a psychologist, and is doing her phD on the effects of the war experience down through generations.

    Another thing which horrified me was that after my Grandfather died of throat cancer, my Mother said that she wanted 'the war' put on his death certificare, as she said he went off as a lovely young man, cigarettes were introduced into all the men's rations, he came back very disturbed, addicted to cigarettes and was quite an abusive father, never had any psychological treatment, and died of cancer.

    War is just so awful in so many ways. It acts like a virus, it contaminates many more people than the one who served.

    Just like the survivors of the concentration camps, their families feel the repercussions of that down the generations.

    That Tasmanian senator needs a massive education.
    I have no doubt that your grandfather was seriously affected by the war. As were thousands of people both directly and indirectly. However our world would look significantly different (and not in a good way) without his and other sacrifices. This is way ANZAC day and Remembrance Day are so important. So we never forgot what so many have given up for us.

    We should also remember the current serving members of the ADF. They are doing an amazing job and are still sacrificing so we can all benefit.

    It would be nice to think we don't need a defence force, but that is not reality.

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  12. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Nette View Post
    I have no doubt that your grandfather was seriously affected by the war. As were thousands of people both directly and indirectly. However our world would look significantly different (and not in a good way) without his and other sacrifices. This is way ANZAC day and Remembrance Day are so important. So we never forgot what so many have given up for us.

    We should also remember the current serving members of the ADF. They are doing an amazing job and are still sacrificing so we can all benefit.

    It would be nice to think we don't need a defence force, but that is not reality.
    There are many differing opinions on the 'need' for a defence force, and the efficacy of war.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MilkingMaid View Post
    Absolutely crazy.

    My Grandfather served in WWII and my Mum says that he was incredibly scarred by everything he witnessed and did.

    That in turn seeped across to his wife, and down to his 6 children.

    My cousin (Mums sisters daughter) is a psychologist, and is doing her phD on the effects of the war experience down through generations.

    Another thing which horrified me was that after my Grandfather died of throat cancer, my Mother said that she wanted 'the war' put on his death certificare, as she said he went off as a lovely young man, cigarettes were introduced into all the men's rations, he came back very disturbed, addicted to cigarettes and was quite an abusive father, never had any psychological treatment, and died of cancer.

    War is just so awful in so many ways. It acts like a virus, it contaminates many more people than the one who served.

    Just like the survivors of the concentration camps, their families feel the repercussions of that down the generations.

    That Tasmanian senator needs a massive education.
    I also echo your sentiments.

    My grandfather went to world war 2 and was a POW for three years in CHangi. He was treated very badly and came back a shell of his former self. He was an abusive father and in turn my mother and her brothers and sisters have all had to suffer the devastating consequences of war and as a result myself, sister and cousins have all suffered the consequences . War does affect many people, not just the ones that have served their country and I for one do not support forced conscription. There are many that just couldn't cope.

    All power to those that are currently serving in the army and navy though.

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  15. #19
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    No, of course not, we just have different ideas about things - and that is ok!

    Quote Originally Posted by maternidade View Post
    I'm not a monster lol

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    I don't think anyone is saying there is no need for defence forces, of course there are - until governments can stop acting in aggressive ways, then there will always be a need.

    Conscription however, brings nothing but trouble. My grandfathers brother was in WWII - he was 18 years old and lasted 3 days. Of course we must respect what others gave up to keep the world "free" (to an extent) but it doesn't change the fact that the lasting psychological damage is insidious and doesn't just affect the person at war.

    A family friend was conscripted to Vietnam and he still suffers PTSD, and panic disorders- he most likely will never be the same again because of it.


    I agree with the general consensus on this thread, much kudos for all our troops. They do an amazing job!

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