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  1. #241
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    Society is always looking for something to "blame" our kids' behaviour on. 35 years ago when my brother was little, it was "sugar" which supposedly caused his bad behaviour. I suspect he was then, like now, just a naturally-occuring little *******!!

    We are all surely too intelligent to believe all this.

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  3. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by javic View Post
    We really don't understand it all though, do we? We don't even understand what out food does to us or the fluoride in water, or tiny particles in the air we breathe. We guess at some of the stuff, but we don't understand every little thing it does inside. There's aluminium in the vaccines, along with other stuff. Are you aware that kids' antibiotic suspension is full of aspartame? That stuff makes my kid mental. Do you think they understand why that is? What is going on inside that causes my child to go mental? There's a lot we don't understand.
    Perhaps lay people don't understand but scientists do. Everything is made of chemicals, almost everything can be toxic at high doses. I've researched natural products constituents and cancer for over 12 years. People think " natural" means safe, it does not. Fluoride at high doses yes is toxic, but not at levels even remotely close to that found in our drinking water.
    A lay person reads a study and sees product x is toxic, a scientists reads a study and sees product x is toxic at x dose, which is completely different. The preservatives in vaccines are absolutely minuscule and have been rigorously tested for safety and tolerability. There is enormous amount lay people don't understand, but that's ok, no one has to be an expert on everything.

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  5. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atropos View Post
    There aren't vaxxes at 2 years- not sure about 12 yrs ago- usually it's the MMR at 18 months that is blamed- often because that is the age ASD's become particularly noticeable, from what I've read. But correlation doesn't equal causation. If this were true, unvaccinated kids wouldn't have ASD's or behavioural problems, right? And we know that isn't true. The most current research on ASD points towards a genetic origin, though there may well be environmental factors that affect some people. The fact is, the "link" between autism and vaccines came about from a "study" that was extremely flawed, never able to be replicated and later proved fraudulent. The doctor involved has been struck off the medical register because of it. It has since been studied to death- and no one has ever been able to conclusively show a link between ASD and vaccines.
    Your right @Atropos. It was the 18 month one. I totally agree you will start to see behavioural problems around this time and parents I'm sure would be wanting someone to blame. Pretty easy target in the vaccines. Like I said I don't buy for a second that the vaccines are the cause!!

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  7. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by javic View Post
    We really don't understand it all though, do we? We don't even understand what out food does to us or the fluoride in water, or tiny particles in the air we breathe. We guess at some of the stuff, but we don't understand every little thing it does inside. There's aluminium in the vaccines, along with other stuff. Are you aware that kids' antibiotic suspension is full of aspartame? That stuff makes my kid mental. Do you think they understand why that is? What is going on inside that causes my child to go mental? There's a lot we don't understand.
    We know and understand an awful lot. Vaccines aren't some gamble. We know they are safe and effective for the vast majority of people. We know there is a very small risk with them. No one denies that.
    Yes, there is aluminium in vaccines. So? There is formaldehyde too. But there is more formaldehyde in a pear than there is in a vaccine. Same with aluminium. Aluminium, in tiny amounts, has been used in vaccines for 60 odd years and studies have shown its safety and efficacy as an adjuvant.

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  9. #245
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    SJG...absolutely agree. Benign or essential components can be toxic at "supra-normal" doses.
    Oxygen is toxic at higher concentrations. Just ask anyone who has had to have an infant in NICU for many days, a situation when higher oxygen concentration is often essential. Yet it can cause neonatal blindness. But death is preferable to vision impairment.
    My point?...common sense is a powerful tool. Let's all try to embrace it.

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  11. #246
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    It took 18 months for DS2 to be diagnoses, I asked 8 doctors about it, he saw a paed who said "no way, he doesn't draw circles" and then we went to aspect and they diagnosed on the spot. It wasn't easy or cheap for us at all and he is clearly on the spectrum. An actual official diagnoses (the kind where you get funding etc) requires either diagnosis from the Autism board of your state or a 3 doctor joint diagnosis between pysch, pead and OT. Not sure how it could possibly be over diagnosed to be honest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Atropos View Post
    I have heard of GPs "diagnosing" it after one meeting- I think a proper diagnoses should take a bit more than that.

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  13. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by loislane2010 View Post
    And showing videos of newborn babies suffering with whooping cough isnt a scare tactic??? Its the biggest scare tactic of the all. I have to agree with Emily173, my problem is we are old to avoid chemicals, cheese and pre-made salads (really) during pregnancy but as soon as the baby come out we have to pump them full of who knows what 'just in case' they come into contact with this disease. Please tell me what one day old baby is going to share needles or have unprotected s3x to contract hep b?? I am a firm believer in treating illness when needed. i mean i wouldnt take panadol everyday just in case i was to get a head ache or hurt myself. Or wear cases on my legs just in case i was to break a bone. Our medical system (hospitals) have come along way in 50 years and i really truely believe if my children where to contract one of these diseases our hospitals will have treatment.
    Videos of children suffering whooping cough are not scare tactics, they are reality. These diseases kill children.

    The ingredients of vaccines are published. They are not "who knows what".

    There are many other ways of contracting hep B. It's plausible to contract it from blood-saliva route (e.g. bitten at childcare).


    The last bit of your post is nothing short of extraordinary. The analogies you have given make no sense, because you are comparing treatments to prevention. Yes, our medical system has come a long way in 50 years. And (ironically) vaccines are the most effective public safety measure they have come up with in that time.

    It's like saying "I don't need to wear a seatbelt, because they can fix me up in hospital if I have an accident".

    The fact is that there is no effective treatment for many of the diseases we vaccinate against. That's why there are children who die from pertussis and meningococcal, despite receiving the best possible medical care available to them.

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  15. #248
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    I am sorry to hear that Beebs. But can I please say that there is alot of pressure on Paediatricians to make an ASD diagnosis these days. (And I say this with some professional authority. Cannot go into details on BH.). 15 years ago it was also true of ADD/ADHD.

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  16. #249
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    Subbing to read through.

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  18. #250
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    I understand what you are saying, but I hang out with so many kids on the spectrum - and they are all classic ASD, nothing dodgy about their diags, I just wonder where these over diagnosed kids are? Because they aren't here. But I do get what you are saying
    Quote Originally Posted by J37 View Post
    I am sorry to hear that Beebs. But can I please say that there is alot of pressure on Paediatricians to make an ASD diagnosis these days. (And I say this with some professional authority. Cannot go into details on BH.). 15 years ago it was also true of ADD/ADHD.

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