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  1. #371
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  2. #372
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    That's bloody scary. I wonder if the outcome would have been different had all of those people only voted once?

    Sent from my GT-I9505 using The Bub Hub mobile app

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    I really don't understand how in this day and age it's all still a manual process. Surely there's benefit in developing an electronic system of voting that eliminates this issue?

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  5. #374
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    Quote Originally Posted by Busy-Bee View Post
    I really don't understand how in this day and age it's all still a manual process. Surely there's benefit in developing an electronic system of voting that eliminates this issue?
    An electronic system of voting does not address this issue, which has to do with booth staff determining whether a person is eligble to vote when they present. The only way of making that "electronic" is to introduce a univeral ID card for all citizens which references a single national database; a proposal I would oppose.

    I don't believe the scale of the problem is large enough to warrant such a massive privacy invasion, and these couple of thousand votes will not have had any material effect on the election outcome.

    There are plenty of other reforms (such as optional preferential) which take a much higher priority.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
    An electronic system of voting does not address this issue, which has to do with booth staff determining whether a person is eligble to vote when they present. The only way of making that "electronic" is to introduce a univeral ID card for all citizens which references a single national database; a proposal I would oppose.

    I don't believe the scale of the problem is large enough to warrant such a massive privacy invasion, and these couple of thousand votes will not have had any material effect on the election outcome.

    There are plenty of other reforms (such as optional preferential) which take a much higher priority.
    The specific requirements and functioning of such a system is beyond my knowledge but it would have the functionality that a person could only vote once (obviously the data would be stored in a centralised repository that is linked to the electoral role and updated in real time or regular batches). The process would be as it currently stands now, person presents to vote at voting booth and is electronically registered to vote (instead of name crossed off in book), vote is then cast electronically. The benefit of such a system would not just be to reduce the risk of multiple voting but also count votes.

  7. #376
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    Quote Originally Posted by Busy-Bee View Post
    I really don't understand how in this day and age it's all still a manual process. Surely there's benefit in developing an electronic system of voting that eliminates this issue?
    The fact that the rerun of the senate in WA is going to cost $20m and k rudds bielection cost $1m should tell you the answer to that.

    I will be working on the rerun of the senate and while some bigger booths used electronic voting for house of reps, the cost is astronomical, the training, the machines, the updates etc...They are working on it, but its still a while away, and it will still be fallible

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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    The fact that the rerun of the senate in WA is going to cost $20m and k rudds bielection cost $1m should tell you the answer to that.

    I will be working on the rerun of the senate and while some bigger booths used electronic voting for house of reps, the cost is astronomical, the training, the machines, the updates etc...They are working on it, but its still a while away, and it will still be fallible
    I don't doubt the costs would be big, I'm an IT Project Manager

    There would be other benefits such as instant data on those that did not vote, instant counting etc. The actual functionality of it wouldn't need to be terribly complex, not like high end insurance/billing/finance systems but the requirements documenting and testing would need to be super duper thorough and not pressured by a looming election/political pressure to ensure that it functions as required. (eg Qld Health payroll anyone?!)

  9. #378
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    Quote Originally Posted by Busy-Bee View Post
    The specific requirements and functioning of such a system is beyond my knowledge but it would have the functionality that a person could only vote once (obviously the data would be stored in a centralised repository that is linked to the electoral role and updated in real time or regular batches). The process would be as it currently stands now, person presents to vote at voting booth and is electronically registered to vote (instead of name crossed off in book), vote is then cast electronically. The benefit of such a system would not just be to reduce the risk of multiple voting but also count votes.
    The sheer number of booths, voters, computer networking required and more brings me back to the financials again. Also, unless we have a universal id card as john suggested, we'll have issues of people trying to mark off more than once in multiple places still. If your name is marked before you get there how do you prove it wasn't you who voted before?

    I know we'll cop a lot of abuse from people at the rerun senate who'll complain at being asked if they've previously voted, complain at waiting in line, complain at stating there full name....

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  11. #379
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    Quote Originally Posted by Busy-Bee View Post
    I don't doubt the costs would be big, I'm an IT Project Manager

    There would be other benefits such as instant data on those that did not vote, instant counting etc. The actual functionality of it wouldn't need to be terribly complex, not like high end insurance/billing/finance systems but the requirements documenting and testing would need to be super duper thorough and not pressured by a looming election/political pressure to ensure that it functions as required. (eg Qld Health payroll anyone?!)
    Believe me, the costs would be big, not because of complexities, but because of intricacies of security which holds information of the entire voting public of Australia, also the fact that these computers would be used perhaps 2 times every 3 years, the training involved in such a sporadic event and more.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    Believe me, the costs would be big, not because of complexities, but because of intricacies of security which holds information of the entire voting public of Australia, also the fact that these computers would be used perhaps 2 times every 3 years, the training involved in such a sporadic event and more.
    I don't doubt the numbers have been crunched somewhere and they shows it would not be a beneficial project at this point - it just seems a shame and somewhat strange that we have manual systems in place for such an operation.

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