steel magnolia (04-08-2013)
I have already began gathering some great tips and advice off here in readiness
This is my last bub, so my last chance to try it
And this could be applied to lots of examples. Does the fact there has been deaths in HB's make HB unsafe? Or that a tiny proportion of vaxxed kids have a severe reaction.... does that then make vaccination unsafe?
The karicare issue in NZ is very concerning. But it's the first one I've seen near our shores. China is a 3rd world country. I'm not saying we ignore any safety issues of formula, but I think we have to be fair here. formula is safe in 99.99% of cases, and really, nothing in life is 100% free of risk...
Last edited by delirium; 04-08-2013 at 22:34.
I think Bubmum is the victim of some over zealous forum posse doing a virtual stacks on.
Her point, apart from the 'losing sleep' bit is factual. Kids in developing countries are dying, here is a black market and parents do go to extreme lengths to access formula.
She was in no way creating a negative view on us lucky, first word women who are damned fortunate to have options should we have a physical, social, lifestyle or other barrier to full time breast feeding . She was merely adding a different perspective which I feel is a rather good thing when having an adult discussion.
I agree, and often also lose sleep over the condition in which some children are living. We live in a world and really should be looking after each other. I love my job, but sometimes sit back and think that while people are paying sometimes a lot of money, myself included, to do fun things, others are starving and unable to provide for their children who are then dying. That's not about formula or breastfeeding, although formula feeding in these conditions is dangerous. I don't know what the answer is there.
I still fully intend to try again and again with any future children, but realistically I know deep down I again, may need formula got my child....as my only other option would be starvation, and I guess that would be more than frowned upon lol.
At the end of the day, no matter how a bub is fed, for whatever reason, I think so long as they are happy and thriving, who cares!?
Yes, some methods are preferred by individuals, or encouraged by society, but I think as mums we get enough judgement on everything else, we should stick together and support eachother....so long as what we are doing is the best we can for our own children, I'm happy to have anyones back. Breastfeeding, ebm, mixed, donor milk or formula!
Sent from my GT-S5830T using The Bub Hub mobile app
Interestingly, even the healthiest mum will have stuff in her bm that's surprising. I remember reading about a mum who had hers tested for curiosities sake and found all kinds of stuff including jet fuel! (http://www.npr.org/2012/05/16/152818...able-to-toxins)
I think the main difference is the live bacteria and antibodies in bm that they've not replicated in formula. Obviously it's impossible to replicate those exactly, but I wonder why they don't seem to be trying to get closer to at least the digestion friendly bacteria? Or something! I don't know. It just seems absurd that with all we have today, the best they can come up with is adding omega 3s? I could be way off, there may be far more research going on that I don't know about. All I'm saying is that I don't honk a one would object to better/safer/healthier formulas. And more natural ones- the popularity of bellamys organic speaks volumes there.and that's not to say current ones are terrible-far from it- all I'm suggesting is improving an already pretty good product iykwim.
Eta-CDC warning about cronobacter found in formula : http://www.cdc.gov/features/cronobacter/ the main risk of formula contamination seems to be from less than perfect hygiene when preparing. I wonder how prevalent it is- I know I've heard of mums on here using tap water to make up formula.
Last edited by Atropos; 05-08-2013 at 08:14.
Believe me, I do worry about the disrespect to cows, many dairy herds have pretty crap lives actually, I have learned more than I ever wanted to know about it in my last year or so living in rural NZ, surrounded by dairy farming.
The world over they are totally exploited for the mighty dollar, some living in conditions not much better than battery hens! Fonterra has housed/battery dairy farms in China where animal welfare laws are almost non-existent. Animals who are not given the chance to move and forage as the instinctual migratory animals they are, invariably get circulation issues, gangrene is becoming a problem.
Not to mention that within 3 days of calving, the calves are taken away, the male calves killed then and there, or shipped to the slaughter houses, or sold on for future beef slaughter. The female calves are mostly kept as replacements in the dairy herd as they got older.
I imagine PND rates within dairy herds are phenomenal. Not silly either, I've seen cows with PND on my neighbours farm (stud farm, so calves stay with mum ) when calves have died. Cows are highly intelligent, and treated like crap a lot of the time.
Fonterra is a company I choose to boycott.
Cows aren't respected overly much, the notable exception being India
Last edited by MilkingMaid; 05-08-2013 at 09:06.
But I guess my point still stands, the same could be said for donor milk, which goes back to the topic. If it's your sister or best mate that is donating then you know their lifestyle, diet, habits etc. But if you are sourcing donor milk from strangers, then you really don't know what you are getting. She may drink heavily, have a serious illness, be on heavy meds. Some women believe in bfing at all costs, and would consider milk tainted heavily with alcohol (so not just a glass which I think is fine) better than formula and may well not even bother to mention it, or even deny it.
My point is that donor milk is not without safety risks either. But no one assumes that bc 1% of donor milk is no good that means breast milk is no good altogether.
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