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  1. #661
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    At the end of the day this is a global problem, and it needs a global solution. It can't be an "us vs them" situation. It can't be a "I don't care what happens over there as long as we don't get asylum seekers here". That isn't going to fix anything. If we want it fixed, if we want asylum seekers to stop getting on boats, then everyone needs to join the convention. But we can't make other countries sign, as much as we want to. And until that happens, we have to do what we can - and that is - upholding the convention that we signed. There really is no other option.

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  3. #662
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirst33 View Post
    . I find your claim of refugees searching 'for a first world lifestyle' abhorrent.
    .
    I think that's an overly dramatic statement. I agree a large chunk of asylum seekers are fleeing persecution in their home countries. But the moment they fly into Indonesia and Malaysia they have a safe (albeit crappy) life. The moment they step on a boat to Australia I do believe its no longer about fleeing for their lives it's about their personal preference to go to Australia for a first world lifestyle. They have thousands of $$ to Pay for airfares and thousands of $$ to pay for people smugglers. I find it hard to believe they do not have enough $ to set themselves up in Indonesia/Malaysia until either the situation in their home country improves, or they are granted UNHCR resettlement or a Special Humanitarian visa.

    We are going to have to agree to disagree.

  4. #663
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    I think that's an overly dramatic statement. I agree a large chunk of asylum seekers are fleeing persecution in their home countries. But the moment they fly into Indonesia and Malaysia they have a safe (albeit crappy) life. The moment they step on a boat to Australia I do believe its no longer about fleeing for their lives it's about their personal preference to go to Australia for a first world lifestyle. They have thousands of $$ to Pay for airfares and thousands of $$ to pay for people smugglers. I find it hard to believe they do not have enough $ to set themselves up in Indonesia/Malaysia until either the situation in their home country improves, or they are granted UNHCR resettlement or a Special Humanitarian visa.

    We are going to have to agree to disagree.
    There are so many generalisations and assumptions in there VP backed up by nuttin!

    You provide no sources, except I think the Today show and cast these wildly inaccurate statements around. Where do you get this stuff from anyway?

    Even if a small part of any of that was true, searching for a better lifestyle, who cares. I would want for myself and my family to be a citizen and have access to work, education, health, a stable roof over my head - if that's a better lifestyle then sign me up, I want a "first class life style" too.

    The life of Riley!

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  6. #664
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    I think that's an overly dramatic statement. I agree a large chunk of asylum seekers are fleeing persecution in their home countries. But the moment they fly into Indonesia and Malaysia they have a safe (albeit crappy) life. The moment they step on a boat to Australia I do believe its no longer about fleeing for their lives it's about their personal preference to go to Australia for a first world lifestyle. They have thousands of $$ to Pay for airfares and thousands of $$ to pay for people smugglers. I find it hard to believe they do not have enough $ to set themselves up in Indonesia/Malaysia until either the situation in their home country improves, or they are granted UNHCR resettlement or a Special Humanitarian visa.

    We are going to have to agree to disagree.
    Say for arguments sake a massive war broke out in Australia and you and your family were in constant danger, your extended family have all been killed and you have to flee. Indonesia as our closest neighbour will allow you to fly and live in a refugee camp which has no access to your own private accommodation, education, has rampant disease and infection and poor health support. Add to that there is still a physical threat, particularly to those most vulnerable, like you and your children. And very little chance of ever working and making a life for yourself.
    Or you could escape illegally by catching a boat to New Zealand (pretend it is around 500km), where you will be processed, you will need to stay in a refugee centre for maybe a year or two, but you will have more private accommodation, sanitary conditions and access to education and health resources for your children. After you have been granted refugee status you can live in New Zealand, find work, a home and begin to make a life for yourself. What would YOU choose?

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  8. #665
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    I must say the irony is not lost, that people who are objecting are just trying to protect their 'first world lifestyle'

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  12. #667
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    I think that's an overly dramatic statement.
    That's fine. I still find it a disgusting comment and such an over generalization and simplification of thousands of people and their situations and intentions.

    I am also still very curious as to where your information is from, unlike you I am interested in reading it and seeing what helps you draw your conclusions and why you feel your info or impression is not biased but yet any who disagree with you are.

    Also, what is this 'first world lifestyle?' Why are you or I more deserving of it than an asylum seeker? Why am I more deserving to be welcomed into Australia and given permanent residency very easily over an asylum seeker? Because I am lucky enough to be from a country that isn't considered 'high risk' and fell in love with an Australian? Thank goodness the gods were smiling down on me when I was born a citizen of a specific country.

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  14. #668
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirst33 View Post

    Also, what is this 'first world lifestyle?' Why are you or I more deserving of it than an asylum seeker? Why am I more deserving to be welcomed into Australia and given permanent residency very easily over an asylum seeker? Because I am lucky enough to be from a country that isn't considered 'high risk' and fell in love with an Australian? Thank goodness the gods were smiling down on me when I was born a citizen of a specific country.
    The refugee convention only guarantees safe passage. It does not guarantee the upgrading to a first world lifestyle.

    And yes if you did fall in love with an Australian of course you have more reason to be here. It's a fact that we can't afford to take everyone who wants to come here and we can't afford to pay for the rest of the world to have a first class lifestyle. In your case it sounds like it was more about your hubby's (an Australian) right to have his love live with him rather than your rights.
    Last edited by VicPark; 28-07-2013 at 13:27.

  15. #669
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    The refugee convention only guarantees safe passage. It does not guarantee the upgrading to a first world lifestyle.

    And yes if you did fall in love with an Australian of course you have more reason to be here.
    Yes safe passage to a country which is a signatory, not a country where you have no rights.

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  17. #670
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyla View Post
    Yes safe passage to a country which is a signatory, not a country where you have no rights.
    The convention is out dated. Being a signatory doesn't guarantee diddly squat (Rudd v Abbot solutions) and being a non signatory doesn't necessarily mean asylum seekers will be treated abhorrently.


 

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