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  1. #271
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    Dr Karl is so cool.

  2. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by beebs View Post
    Dr Karl is so cool.
    Is that Dr. Karl?! Nice to put a face to a name!

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  4. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirst33 View Post
    VP, you of all people choosing to call us 'bleeding hearts' in a condescending and insulting tone after your many posts telling others off for insults in past threads? Really?

    People are debating you not just because you have a different view but you are continually spouting fallacies or broad generalizations. How many times can one explain to you why Indonesia and Malaysia are not safe or viable options? Why? Because they are not signatories of the convention, refugees are not safe there, offered no protection or opportunity because they are considered illegal immigrants--this is not opinion, it is FACT. Facts that have been backed up in past threads and comments by links to refugee organizations and the UNHCR but apparently to you that is propaganda or lies?

    I have been to both countries by the way, one town I visited in Malaysian Borneo recently had people taken hostage by Filipino militants with some killed (http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/04/wo...ia04.html?_r=0).

    Believing the media through all this? Great for you but I choose to get my information from outlets that are not picking and choosing or sensationalizing their stories. The main****** media in Australia rarely explains the situation as a whole, hence why so many Australians continue to spout that asylum seekers arriving by boat are illegal, why Australians think they should stay in Indonesia, and many other ill-informed comments.

    And am I hopping on some 'bleeding heart bandwagon?' Give me a break! Heaven forbid I just find this a topic worth caring and being informed about from various outlets besides right-wing commentators or main****** media.
    Yeah you're right re the bleeding heart comments. I 100% agree everyone should be able to have their 2 cents on here. I suppose I have lost my patience with the majority BH's who time after time sit in their "I am right" throne and are guilty of exactly what they are accusing others of (not willing to understand others views, looking at something with blinkers on, using biased information, not listening wah wah wah ..)

    And this post is a perfect example. Assuming your knowledge and interpretation of what's going on is the only correct view. And assuming that because I don't agree with you 100%, I haven't listened or whatever it is you were getting at.

    To clarify: I don't think the PNG solution is an awesome one. I just happen to be tossing up whether the short term costs are worth the long term benefits. And I don't think having detainees wait for years in detention centres is very humane at all. I just have a differing opinion on some of the peripheral issues.

    Nice link on Sabah by the way. Newsflash. Anyone who travels to Malaysia would have to be a di@k to go to that region, the dangers are nothing new. The Asylum seekers and people smugglers aren't dumb, when they enter Malaysia (with their passports) they fly in via KL not Sabah.
    Last edited by VicPark; 22-07-2013 at 17:59.

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    mrsoptomistic  (22-07-2013)

  6. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by Father View Post
    Much easier to jump on the bandwagon and follow the crowd on BH. It saves having to think for yourself or and developing arguments.

    It would be much better if BH just banned those who did not follow the crowd. We can't have diversity of opinion in this country.
    If you are unhappy with holding a minority view on the hub, there is a solution. You don't need someone else to ban you.
    I resent the implication that people are simply jumping on a bandwagon. I've done a lot of reading to formulate my views. I am also a compassionate, empathetic person. Who are you to assume you are the only person capable of forming an opinion? You've been provided with facts, evidence and sources regarding this topic in several threads now, but still come out with the same tired arguments. I'm not sure what you expect to happen? If you don't want boat people here, that's fine. Doesn't change the facts though.

    It's not illegal to seek asylum here, regardless of t shirt choice.

    9 out of 10 boat people are found to be genuine refugees.

    The real illegal immigrant problem is visa overstayers, something that you and many others wilfully ignore.

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  8. #275
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    I just worry for the future of this country when there is already so much poverty, violence and 3rd world conditions in our own backyard, not to mention the stress of additional unwanted population on the healthcare and other systems and the environment. Charity begins at home, before opening our arms to support others, we should ensure our current residents are cared for and news flash - They are not, and it's only going to get worse.

  9. #276
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    A bleeding heart is someone who has sympathy that is unwarranted.
    I would argue that refugees do indeed qualify for sympathy when fleeing war, poverty and persecution.
    So I reject the term bleeding heart- it does not apply here. Sympathy, empathy and compassion are all entirely reasonable feelings towards refugees. Anyone that does not feel these thing when considering refugees is pretty hard-hearted, IMO.

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  11. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atropos View Post
    If you are unhappy with holding a minority view on the hub, there is a solution. You don't need someone else to ban you.
    I resent the implication that people are simply jumping on a bandwagon. I've done a lot of reading to formulate my views. I am also a compassionate, empathetic person. Who are you to assume you are the only person capable of forming an opinion? You've been provided with facts, evidence and sources regarding this topic in several threads now, but still come out with the same tired arguments.
    I have no doubt you have done your research, are an empathetic person and aren't jumping on the bandwagon.

    ... However.. there is that belief amongst the majority (that is evident in this post) that if the majority post links and stats and someone disagrees with them... Then they have no idea what they are on about and aren't willing to learn. One could say the minority come out with the same tired arguments... Or one could say that both sides are putting social commentary on the facts and come up with different views because of their different values and beliefs. Or one could also say the majority come out with the same tired facts and arguments and present them in the same tired holier-than-though manner meaning the minority continue to do blah blah blah.. See it's a never ending cycle. Chicken or egg?
    Last edited by VicPark; 22-07-2013 at 18:10.

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  13. #278
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrsoptomistic View Post
    I just worry for the future of this country when there is already so much poverty, violence and 3rd world conditions in our own backyard, not to mention the stress of additional unwanted population on the healthcare and other systems and the environment. Charity begins at home, before opening our arms to support others, we should ensure our current residents are cared for and news flash - They are not, and it's only going to get worse.
    The boat arrivals are not the ones putting a massive drain on resources. Look towards overpaid pollies, visa overstayers and the long term wilfully unemployed, welfare cheats, companies employing illegal workers and those sending profits offshore- asylum seekers often come here and become contributing members of society as they are willing to work for a new and better life, and will often do jobs that we Aussies turn our noses up at. Our workforce depends on immigration.

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  15. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirst33 View Post
    I'm confused by Australia's number? The UNHCR has Australia's 2012 numbers at 15,800? Or is 29,610 how many sought but 15,800 is how many have actually be resettled?
    This is the number of applications, the 15,800 is the resettled number.

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    Kirst33  (22-07-2013)

  17. #280
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    [QUOTE=VicPark;7354440][QUOTE=Atropos;7354425] If you are unhappy with holding a minority view on the hub, there is a solution. You don't need someone else to ban you.
    I resent the implication that people are simply jumping on a bandwagon. I've done a lot of reading to formulate my views. I am also a compassionate, empathetic person. Who are you to assume you are the only person capable of forming an opinion? You've been provided with facts, evidence and sources regarding this topic in several threads now, but still come out with the same tired arguments.

    I have no doubt you have done your research, are an empathetic person and aren't jumping on the bandwagon.

    ... However.. there is that belief amongst the majority (that is evident in this post) that if the majority post links and stats and someone disagrees with them... Then they have no idea what they are on about and aren't willing to learn. One could say the minority come out with the same tired arguments... Or one could say that both sides are putting social commentary on the facts and come up with different views because of their different values and beliefs. Or one could also say the majority come out with the same tired facts and arguments and present them in the same tired holier-than-though manner meaning the minority continue to do blah blah blah.. See it's a never ending cycle. Chicken or egg?
    My post was not directed at you VP, I've actually seen your views change over time, and seen you take on new info. The poster I was referring to ignores facts and asked the same questions over and over. He is given the facts and ignores them because they don't suit his argument. Numbers are numbers, you know? Whether or not you or I like them.

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