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  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoThisIsLove View Post
    As someone who is against abortion, i find it quite interesting that ones that are pro choice are saying this is wrong.

    Why is this reason not ok as opposed to " i wasnt ready" ," it was a one night stand", " i want to party im too young to settle down ", " i cant afford it" " i want to establish my career" etc etc???

    You are either pro choice or ur not imo otherwise its hypocritical. All the babies in these scenarios have the right to life just like that poor little girl.

    I think this story is just disgusting. I have no words that ill repeat to describe people that would do this.

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    Supporting a women's right to choose does not mean you agree with all the reasons. There are many things in life that one supports but doesn't mean they would make that choice for themselves.

    I said before, do not lump all women into a category. Making their reasons sound petty and assume they took 'the easy way out' is quite cruel. They're reasons are very real to them and many feel that they have no choice. It is an incredibly scary decision.

    The only full proof way to stop an unwanted pregnancy is to abstain from sex, because birth control can fail. There was a stat that even if every person used birth control there would still be 6 million abortions every year.

    To terminate based on gender to me suggests that you are trying for a baby, getting pregnant intentionally with the full knowledge that it is a lucky dip, a 50/50 chance in getting a boy or girl. That is very different from getting pregnant unintentionally, for various reasons.

    I agree with Beebs, you cannot take away one's right to choose but not others. But that doesn't mean I don't find this particular reason abhorrent.

    Sonja's post: wow. Thank you for opening my eyes to what it may be like for somebody in a cultural position, that's truly sad and scary.

    I can't remember who posted about gender disappointment above, but I think cases like this, somebody going as far as terminating based on gender goes way beyond just gender disappointment, a different kettle of fish than somebody mourning the fact that they will never have a son or daughter.

    This has happened for a non-cultural reason before. A few years ago it was in the news that a couple became pregnant with twins boys via IVF and decided to terminate because they already had 3(?) boys and wanted a girl. They were going to court fighting for the right to gender select their next IVF baby.

    My experience with termination hasn't made me more or less pro-life or pro-choice, it's made me just want to prevent unwanted pregnancies, preventing unwanted pregnancies is the only real way to prevent terminations. I would love to see birth control made more and more easy to access and girls and boys to be fully educated about what happens in a female body (ie how long sperm can live in a girl, etc. you really don't learn a lot of this stuff until you're TTC!). Obviously abstinence is the best policy but also doesn't always work as young people make mistakes (ie they should be on BC for when those mistakes are made).

    I do think it is probably incredibly rare that a termination is preformed after 12 weeks for reasons other than medical.

    Maybe if you are terminating based on gender selection then therapy should be involved (for both parents) to really get to the core of this thinking and determine if any headway could be made in the belief that one gender isn't worthy.
    Last edited by Kirst33; 29-04-2013 at 08:30.

  2. #132
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    I haven't read through all of this thread, but here are my thoughts.
    I can never understand terminating a pregnancy due to the sex of the baby, yuck. I am sure when this does occur it arises from cultural, rather than personal reasons.

    But this is illegal, and in the article one doctor believed it happened once. It would surely be a very rare occurance as a proportion of all abortions. I'm just a bit worried about the timing of articles like this. A big push by the Right to Life lobby coming up to an election perhaps?

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  4. #133
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    I think this is a tough one. While I don't feel it is right to abort on the basis of the sex of the baby, I do wonder what the life of the baby girl would have been like had her parents been forced to keep her?

    My mother only wanted boys so I personally know what it is like to be nothing more than a massive dissapointment. I was treated very differently to my brothers and constantly reminded that I was unwanted, unloved and nothing more than an inconvenience. I wouldn't wish that sort of upbringing on anyone.
    As heartbreaking as it is to consider a baby can be aborted on the basis of their sex, maybe it's saving them from a lifetime of abuse, simply because they weren't wanted?

  5. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoThisIsLove View Post
    As someone who is against abortion, i find it quite interesting that ones that are pro choice are saying this is wrong.

    Why is this reason not ok as opposed to " i wasnt ready" ," it was a one night stand", " i want to party im too young to settle down ", " i cant afford it" " i want to establish my career" etc etc???

    You are either pro choice or ur not imo otherwise its hypocritical. All the babies in these scenarios have the right to life just like that poor little girl.

    I think this story is just disgusting. I have no words that ill repeat to describe people that would do this.

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    Again I will say you can support choice but disagree with that choice. truth is, I don't agree with abortion except for medical reasons at all. But I still accept it's not my body to choose. It's a bit frustrating to be told you are not pro choice bc people don't understand your stance. Pro is quite simply, supporting choice. Nothing more. I remember having an interesting discussion with a member that no longer comes here and I said the above but identified as pro life. She said no, you are pro choice - you don't have to agree with abortion to be that. And that is how I am now

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  7. #135
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    Pro- choice doesn't mean you have to agree with someones reasons for a choice, it means you believe in the right to choice. The reasons in an ideal world would be irrelevant but in cases like this it changes the landscape of the discussion.

    I am pro-choice but I am also really struggling with non medical termination at 19 weeks. Really struggling.

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  9. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by peanutmonkey View Post
    I just want to say, that terminating or wanting to terminate a healthy baby isnt the norm among people who suffer from gender disappointment. I hate that they tend to all get lumped together, gender disappointment isnt about not wanting the baby your carrying, its about mourning the son or daughter you might never have - thats how it was for me anyhow. Not once have I ever been anything but glad that my belly babe was healthy regardless of his gender. I have mourned the fact that I will never have a daughter and dealt with my sadness over that but it is in no way connected to my precious 3rd son whom im carrying. I have also stuggled with long term TTC and have suffered a m/c. My GD doesn't make me a bad person.

    I feel this is a much more extreme issue than just regular gender disappointment. This isnt the way most people who suffer from it feel in my experience.

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    Thank you for explaining gender disappointment so well. Just because we don't end up having a gender we really wanted doesn't mean we don't love and adore the children we do have.

  10. #137
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    Wow no need to flame me for my opinion. Im not being high and mighty i simply cannot get my head around it and was trying to explain myself.

    I never said being pro choice meant u "agree" with all the reasons for a woman terminating but its still saying that u agree that a woman should be able to terminate on the grounds of gender otherwise you are not pro choice.

    Hence i thought its hypocritical if someone says " im pro choice but gender abortions should be banned" iykwim.

    And i understand this situation is not the norm among people who suffer gender disapointment but its still happening as this article shows


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    Last edited by SoThisIsLove; 29-04-2013 at 09:06.

  11. #138
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    Reading this today has made me so sad, I had no idea that this was happening. I want a baby so badly and have no preference at all just healthy please. Gosh I would do anything to be in these ladies places finding out what sex I was having...actually being pregnant

  12. #139
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    I guess you need to ask yourself where will it end, as I said before, terminating based on gender makes me actually feel sick.

    But if they stop terminations based on gender, then what? Terminations based on one night stands not a good enough reason, based on someone feeling they are too young? Abortions only ok in severe medical situations? And then what is considered severe enough?

    All I need to do, is look at what happened to that woman in Galway recently. Where she was miscarrying, and they would not perform a D&C because termination is illegal in Ireland and the woman died of sepsis. Ireland for christs sake, they put the "rights" of a fetus that was being miscarried, over the rights of a healthy woman. And now she is dead. I never, ever want to see that crap ever happening ever again.

    Having said all that, I honestly thought that late term abortions had to be for significant reasons, medical, mental health??? I didn't realise that they could be done just because someone felt like it at that stage? And if so, then I do see a problem with that. There has to be some balance.

    And like Redlips said, sexism is never ok. Placing value in one sex above another is never ok.

    So for me personally, I don't think it is ok to abort because of gender. But if we start putting disclaimers on abortion, where will it end?

    Quote Originally Posted by thepouts View Post
    I had considered myself pro choice until now. If being pro choice means I have to defend the right of the woman in this kind of scenario then I can't do that at all.

    This is something new ive learnt about myself

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  14. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by beebs View Post

    And lets face it, everyone on here who believes termination is wrong for any reason, is saying that basically a fetus trumps the mother and that they are more important. Lets stop being all high and mighty about it please.
    No, what they are saying is a life is more important than the mother's right to kill her baby (in cases where there is a non-medical reason for the termination).

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