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  1. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by NancyBlackett View Post
    What's that saying? The Conservatives eat other people's babies and the ALP eat their own.

    What a mess.
    I have never heard that! But how appropriate.

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    It's interesting Peg that we sit at opposite ends of politics yet have the same issue - we believe in the core beliefs of the party but are unhappy with the leader. Have you thought how you will get around this voting wise?

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    Quote Originally Posted by KatiesMum View Post
    Its certainly interesting for the Labor Party.

    Its clear if Julia Gillard takes them to the election they will get trounced. Rudd might be substantially more popular with the people, but is it enough to get them elected? probably not. And if it is ... labor are stuck with a PM they hate and cannot work with.

    Rudd was dumped not solely due to his poor ratings, but because of the way he run the government. A dictatorship doesnt really sit well with Labor's core values and he pi**ed off many of his colleagues to the point where they cannot work with him in government. (see Nicola Roxon for example)

    No one else with any long term leadership ambitions will even think about it when becoming leader now means annihilation in September and they will take the blame.

    I am a liberal supporter, and dont have tooo many issues with the shenanigans in the ALP except that I think its bad for Australia.

    a) its embarrassing internationally to see our PM treated this way

    b) its bad for the remaining term of the government - I dread to see this budget and the vote buying it will entail ... rather than actually putting money where it needs to go for the long term good of the country

    c) I hate Tony Abbott and desperately want the Libs to replace him with Turnball, but that aint gonna happen now with JG's ratings tanking - means TA's go up and that brings stability in his leadership. Means they wont dump him after the election either as he brought them power in a landslide victory.

    Sadly, Julia's crappy polls mean that we will be stuck with Abbott - and THAT I am not happy about.
    It is refreshing to hear a liberal supporter denouncing Abbott. I am a leftie through and through, but if we had to have a Liberal government I would absolutely prefer Turnbull at the helm as I feel that he is a better, more competent leader and his views are more progressive than Tony Abbott. But.....I still wouldn't want to see a conservative government reinstated.

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  5. #164
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    Delirium - if thats asking me - the answer is I cant see the way I will still vote Libs as I do believe their policies and management are better than that of Labor ... but I really HATE some of their policies and ideas - and it grates that in voting for them I am putting TA in as Prime Minister. I voted Greens in the senate last election as I did not at all like the Libs having power in both houses (and I actually thought Libs would win last time around) ... but I wont vote Greens again. Libs with power in both houses would do less damage than Greens having the balance of power I think. (that might be contraversial here, and many will disagree with me ... but thats ok. I like to listen to other peoples ideas - I even occasionally change my mind )
    Last edited by BH-KatiesMum; 22-03-2013 at 12:52.

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    lol whoops sorry KM yeah I was referring to you.

    I would much prefer Turnbull, although I'm not a fan of him either....

    I feel bad for Crean now he has been sacked. I fully believe he did the press conference with the understanding that Rudd would contest Gillard, as with the rest of his supporters. They have now been hung out to dry and will quit.

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    I do below the line too.

    It takes forever, and hte paper is massive... but who cares?

    Usually I don't know who half of them are, so I label my priorities, then put the ones I "don't want in," in the last numbers, and just kind of make up the middle...

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    Yeah I feel bad for Crean. He is a super smart guy and the ALP is far better off with him on the front bench, so that isnt so good. Chris Bowen never did anything for me really, so I dont see him as much of a loss for them.

    I honestly think the leadership stuff was part of a plan that Rudd orchistrated. Problem is she called the spill earlier than he planned and he didnt quite have the numbers, so backed out at the last minute.

    Julia Gillard is a pretty smart operator, and she would not have called the leadership spill unless she was reasonably sure she had the numbers.

    I honestly dont think much of it matters as they are going to lose the election no matter what they do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KatiesMum View Post
    I honestly think the leadership stuff was part of a plan that Rudd orchistrated. Problem is she called the spill earlier than he planned and he didnt quite have the numbers, so backed out at the last minute.
    Yep that's exactly what I think happened too. People are saying Rudd isn't an idiot, he doesn't want the spot but I don't know... as I say, I firmly do not believe Crean would have put his career on the line if he didn't think Rudd was going to contest.

    and yes... she called the vote within hours so he didn't have time to get numbers, very sneaky.

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    As far as voting goes - remember that it is the lower house or House of Representatives that determines the government.

    that is the one where you label all the boxes.

    In most seats while there may be quite a multitude of candidates, the real race is between the Liberal / National and the Labor Member.

    Peferential Voting
    the way preferential voting happens is that all the "number 1" votes are counted ... then whoever has the least votes, he/she is out, and his/her votes are re-distributed and given to whoever those people put as "2"

    So - if you have 5 candidates

    1st round (primary votes)
    Mary - ALP - 1,000
    Alice - Lib - 1,000
    Karen - Green - 500
    Joanne - Ind - 400
    Kylie - Ind - 250

    then after the first round, Kylie's 250 votes are redistributed. Whoever voted for Kylie, they look at who they put as number 2 and give that person the votes.

    2nd round
    Mary - ALP - 1,100
    Alice - Lib - 1,100
    Karen - Green - 550
    Joanne - Ind - 400

    Now they cut the last person again - so Joanne's votes are redistributed. They take her pile of votes, and allocate the vote to whoever is next on the ballot that is still in ... so any votes for Joanne or Kylie are discounted, and the vote goes to whoever they put highest out of Mary, Alice and Karen.

    3rd round
    Mary - ALP - 1,300
    Alice - Lib - 1,300
    Karen - Green - 550

    This is the last round .... they cut the person who is 3rd - and allocated her 550 votes to whoever all of those people favoured - Labor or Liberal.

    whoever ends up with the most, wins.

    Effectively what I am saying is - in Most cases - it doesnt really matter whether you vote for the Australian Sex Party before or after the local independant ... your vote is still going to go to whoever you put higher, Liberal or Labour. Even if you put them last and second last.

    Notes -
    1) I have discounted the greens as they do not get many federal lower house seats. I think Adam Bandt is the first
    2) occasionally an independant will get in - but currently we have 3 independants and 1 green (as at the last election, have a few more now that were ousted from the party) ... so not a huge number get anywhere close. Most of the races are between the major parties.

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  13. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by KatiesMum View Post
    As far as voting goes - remember that it is the lower house or House of Representatives that determines the government.

    that is the one where you label all the boxes.

    In most seats while there may be quite a multitude of candidates, the real race is between the Liberal / National and the Labor Member.

    Peferential Voting
    the way preferential voting happens is that all the "number 1" votes are counted ... then whoever has the least votes, he/she is out, and his/her votes are re-distributed and given to whoever those people put as "2"

    So - if you have 5 candidates

    1st round (primary votes)
    Mary - ALP - 1,000
    Alice - Lib - 1,000
    Karen - Green - 500
    Joanne - Ind - 400
    Kylie - Ind - 250

    then after the first round, Kylie's 250 votes are redistributed. Whoever voted for Kylie, they look at who they put as number 2 and give that person the votes.

    2nd round
    Mary - ALP - 1,100
    Alice - Lib - 1,100
    Karen - Green - 550
    Joanne - Ind - 400

    Now they cut the last person again - so Joanne's votes are redistributed. They take her pile of votes, and allocate the vote to whoever is next on the ballot that is still in ... so any votes for Joanne or Kylie are discounted, and the vote goes to whoever they put highest out of Mary, Alice and Karen.

    3rd round
    Mary - ALP - 1,300
    Alice - Lib - 1,300
    Karen - Green - 550

    This is the last round .... they cut the person who is 3rd - and allocated her 550 votes to whoever all of those people favoured - Labor or Liberal.

    whoever ends up with the most, wins.

    Effectively what I am saying is - in Most cases - it doesnt really matter whether you vote for the Australian Sex Party before or after the local independant ... your vote is still going to go to whoever you put higher, Liberal or Labour. Even if you put them last and second last.

    Notes -
    1) I have discounted the greens as they do not get many federal lower house seats. I think Adam Bandt is the first
    2) occasionally an independant will get in - but currently we have 3 independants and 1 green (as at the last election, have a few more now that were ousted from the party) ... so not a huge number get anywhere close. Most of the races are between the major parties.
    Good explanation. I'd only add one thing, preferences are only counted until one candidate receives an absolute majority which is 50%+1 of the votes.


 

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