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  1. #171
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    I also wanted to address your point about the large ranges that scientists are predicting. Obviously rates of temp change are dependent on how much or how little green house gases are emitted. China, as we all know, have become by far the biggest producer. If they were to reduce their emissions on a large scale in the next 2 decades them alone would change the estimates by quite a degree. if they don't and in fact continue to increase their emissions as they have in the last decade that would also effect the stats to the higher end.

    Again, I'm far from an expert, I'm just looking at this logically. It's impossible to give an exact figure when the aspects of what is causing the temp rises are so open to change in the next few decades. The pendulum could really swing either way. If we take this seriously and make changes then we could be on the lower end. if we don't take heed then we are going to be in the high range.

  2. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRedV View Post
    I think there is too much focus in this thread on "global warming" when it should be climate change.

    On ABC radio the other day, they were saying that extremes are the new norm.
    Ha. Love it. Does that mean that there is no tipping point then?

    Which extremes are we referring now? Hot days. Cold days. Wet days. Dry days. Droughts, cyclones, earthquakes. That should just about cover all the bases.
    Look at each of these in isolation - the BOM has some pretty good graphs on them, and you will see there is nothing out of the ordinary at all..... with the short records that we have.

  3. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Father View Post
    I would very much appreciate it if you can find some evidence that supports this assumed feedback value.
    There we go again, a whole link of info provided from SCIENTISTS concluding that this is all happening and explaining it in depth and you cherry-pick. Did you read the whole link? You wanted a range, I gave you one (which is what I had highlighted). I'm not really sure why you feel it should all be so predictable? Not knowing exactly how much it will increase seems reasonable as humans are constantly changing the state of the Earth. All they can do is predict, of course calculations would vary. Do they know exactly how much forest we will cut down in the coming years? Exactly how much we (the whole world) will emit? No. All they can do is predict. But I trust their theory of predictions, that we are doing irreparable damage to the Earth and we need to do what we can to slow the damage. Again, it's common sense. It's common sense that with all that humans partake in that it is causing damage to the Earth. Do you honestly believe we are not? Do you honestly believe we can just keep chugging along, believing nothing is wrong and that in 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 years the Earth is going to be a place we want it to be? Good on you if you're that naive. Or maybe you just don't care, because why should it bother you if the damage may happen when you're no longer living?

    Thanks for the distraction today but I'm done finding you all your evidence. Do with the knowledge what you will. I'm fairly certain that most hubbers reading this thread have common sense combined with a bit of heart.

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  5. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirium View Post
    I also wanted to address your point about the large ranges that scientists are predicting. Obviously rates of temp change are dependent on how much or how little green house gases are emitted.
    I may be wrong on this one. Happy to be corrected. But I think the models are all based on an increase of about 2ppm of CO2 a year.

    You are right though, China's emissions have skyrocketed.
    chinese_and_us_co2_emissions.jpg

    Meanwhile, this one shows what Australia does.
    Figure 3.1_fmt.jpg

  6. #175
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    So, no answer then Father? You have an answer for everyone else! What are your qualifications? What do you do for a living? Why do you think you know better than all these scientists? I am genuinely curious about what gives you such confidence!

  7. #176
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    and all that the Lorax left here in this mess was a small pile of rocks with the one word...UNLESS
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRedV View Post
    I don't either, but the first 2 paragraphs are:

    CARBON emissions from the electricity sector have dived in the first six months under the carbon tax, with much greater use of renewable energy and cutbacks in consumption.
    While the government believes the 8.6 per cent fall in carbon emissions shows its policies are working, it also means it will collect less from the tax than the $4 billion it anticipated this year.
    I had read that - but as I said - how do we know it's attributable to the carbon tax? For all I know, carbon emissions may have already been falling (in fact I believe that there was already an increase in use of renewable energy.)

    What I've been searching for is statistics regarding changes before, and after the introduction of the tax to see how much is possibly attributable to the tax.

    However, until we can find another way to power the plants that help store wind and solar power, we won't be able to increase use of these renewable energies above a certain point. We'll still have to use coal power.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Father View Post
    What happened in Japan was testimony to how far we have come since Chernobyl. It got hit by a massive tsunami with a huge amount of damage. How many people died?
    I actually regularly follow an animal rescue organization in Japan that is still trying to rescue animals from the "no go zone." Yes, two years later and they still have a whole area where people are not allowed to return to, that have had to abandon their pets and homes permanently. Wow! That sounds like some nice clean energy I want!! Contaminated fish are being caught in California. Yeah!

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  10. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirst33 View Post
    Not knowing exactly how much it will increase seems reasonable as humans are constantly changing the state of the Earth. All they can do is predict, of course calculations would vary. Do they know exactly how much forest we will cut down in the coming years? Exactly how much we (the whole world) will emit? No. All they can do is predict.
    I'm sorry Kirst, but that is not what feedbacks they are referring to. It is all about the clouds. They cannot simulate what goes on with clouds and humidity with increasing CO2. They are just guessing by plucking out a number...literally.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Father View Post
    Ha. Love it. Does that mean that there is no tipping point then?

    Which extremes are we referring now? Hot days. Cold days. Wet days. Dry days. Droughts, cyclones, earthquakes. That should just about cover all the bases.
    Look at each of these in isolation - the BOM has some pretty good graphs on them, and you will see there is nothing out of the ordinary at all..... with the short records that we have.
    You missed floods

    It doesn't matter what Tony Abbott will do, his party has agreed to reduce emissions.

    Do you happen to belong here?

  12. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Father View Post
    I wouldn't call it a conspiracy. I would call it a religion. The science is no longer driving it. It is now driven by ideology and politics.
    There is a money-go-round element to it. Climate science is a new field. Would you study something at university that you thought was a crock? Who pays climate scientists? Just as Tony Abbott is going to kill off the Department of Climate Change, those people currently with jobs associated with climate change may well end up losing them. Is it not in their best interest to keep the theory alive? If there was no problem, there would be no requirement their position.

    Back to ideology. Can you explain why the environmental movement is so anti nuclear power? This could drastically reduce global emissions, but they still don't want it. They are anti-hydro too, despite it being our biggest source of renewable energy. It doesn't make sense if it is just about emissions. Wind turbines kill a heap of birds every year. But again, the environmentalists are silent. Don't they care about birds? The natural landscape? I do.
    Now I've heard it all. Shame on those silly, uneducated "environmentalists" who don't advocate for the use of nuclear power.

    The study of climate science a religion? What is your field of study by the way?

    Hate to disappoint, but people don't study any environmental field to make money, there is very little work in it. Studying IT or accounting will make you money, people don't study climate science to make money. I'd hazard a guess that you don't actually know anyone in the real work working in that field.


 

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