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  1. #21
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    The Labor Government's plan is to extend the requests to not just parents (but yes, mums and dads) but also to carers of people with disabilities, of the elderly, the seriously ill etc which is a great thing.

    But unlike the common belief, this is not about "forcing" businesses to do anything they seriously cannot accomodate.

    It is about being able to ask for flexibilities, for the employer to 'seriously consider' them and then to no 'unreasonably' refuse a request.

    We know many great workplaces that show leadership by proving that flexibilities can be made to accomodate caring needs, BUT bad employers who simply refuse without good reason are a problem.

    Most requests are granted, from what is known, and about 10% are refused without real consideration. Its not about 'forcing' employers, just asking for what is reasonable.

    The biggest thing is though, right now the law doesn't let someone even 'appeal' the decision, its just ask and if the answer is no, then stiff!

    What is needed is an appeal to test whether an employer is being unreasonable in their refusals, and this is what the Government must provide all employees. Otherwise, asking won't change much.

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  3. #22
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    Having worked full time last week, as a one off, with two small children and being a lone parent, all I can say is that the thought of going back to full time work when they go to school now terrifies me. It was bloody awful.

    I study full time, a phd, work one day a week lecturing, and have three days childcare. Works for us. Washing up and cooking suffers, we spend too much time eating out. I don't think of myself as having it all, I certainly don't have a grown up social life of any kind, (well, there's a friend with benefits), but I feel fortunate to be able to juggle things. I had to sell my house to subsidize our lifestyle.

  4. #23
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    Default Labour's flexible work arrangements and Julie Bishop's 'Women can't have it all'

    Quote Originally Posted by Plan2bamummy View Post
    ( which is why people need to look for alternative jobs- factory night work, night fill, evening register shifts, servo work, bar tending)
    But these are all low paid, unskilled jobs....? What about when both parents have professional jobs?!

    The OP asked if legislation applied to dads too - it does.

    Men generally get paid more than women in Australia for the same jobs (this is fact). Therefore men are generally the primary breadwinners. Which means when one person has to take time off and/or work part-time, its generally the woman as she earns less. It's a vicious circle!!
    Last edited by kw123; 14-02-2013 at 10:14.

  5. #24
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    Default Labour's flexible work arrangements and Julie Bishop's 'Women can't have it all'

    Ask yourself this question:
    You ask for flexibility it's declined, you use this "flexible working" legislation and force your employer to give you flexibility.
    Do you really want to work in this environment? Seems like it will just create under current hostility in the workplace to me.

  6. #25
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    mummabec is offline I could hold you for a million years, to make you feel my love
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    Default Labour's flexible work arrangements and Julie Bishop's 'Women can't have it all'

    I tried to use this legislation to lower the amount of hours I do (currently 40 a fortnight, I wanted to do 30).
    My workplace a large company that would employ thousands said that it doesn't fit within business needs. Now I work in a call centre at night and there are others there that want more hours but not to jump to full time, so do 50 hrs a fortnight. I cannot fathom why this could not be granted but have no right of appeal, no option to question the decision, they don't even have to give more of a reason than "doesn't fit with business needs".

    Now that's pretty crappy! I was really flexible about and said they can pick the days the need me most etc. but just got a big fat no. And what's worse, they now have a work from home option but I live 10 mins outside the radius they allow so I can't even take that option.

    I say in circumstances like mine there should be a chance to appeal, or at least get a better explanation than I got!!

  7. #26
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    and all that the Lorax left here in this mess was a small pile of rocks with the one word...UNLESS
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    In the context that Julie Bishop was talking - I think she was referring to being the best at what you are doing and that the notion of being the best mother you want to be alongside with the best career woman possible - I believe she is correct.

    For me to have children, I wanted to be the primary caregiver, I wanted to be able to attend school excursions, to do canteen duty, to do parent help etc, even when the children got to school (let alone what I do with them during school holidays, or before they got to school).

    I was lucky (actually it wasn't luck - I left school with the plan to go to uni and get a professional position - so it was hard work), I had a career behind me before I had children. However, it was my choice (for financial reasons I could have taken a job elsewhere for finance) to return to my professional job after my children were born to keep up my professional registration etc. I do work part time, but I was able to negotiate my part time hours and not work 9 to 5. (Again - I'm sure others will say I'm lucky), but again, it's not luck, I've built a lot of resources over the last 20years. When I first had my son, I used to work Saturdays when my husband would look after my son - I missed my weekends with my son, and would be upset leaving them.

    I think Ana Gram's words regarding single parents are very relevant.

    You could make comments in this thread regarding the fact that it's all in how we choose who is the primary caregiver as to who is able to "have it all" (also read as a career and children). Because in this situation, it's irrelevant whether you want to be a full time SAHM or a full time career woman with children before and after work and on weekends. When you're a single parent - you don't have the choice. In a partnered household, you have the choice - and it's between you and your partner how you consider your choice, I don't believe it should be up to the government to do so.

    I'm sure I could've found a man out there who would've been willing to stay at home with the children whilst I returned to my career. I would be a lot further on with my career, and probably have done a post graduate career. However, if I'd done that, I wouldn't be the "best mother I want to be".

    In essence, sure you can have a career and children, but do you really "have it all" if you do have both?
    Last edited by Mod-pegasus; 14-02-2013 at 15:58.

  8. #27
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    Default Labour's flexible work arrangements and Julie Bishop's 'Women can't have it all'

    Honestly I don't think any SAHM would ever think that any working mum would "have it all" and vice versa.

    Because we always think that what we do is the "best" thing. Human nature though!

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    Default Re: Labour's flexible work arrangements and Julie Bishop's 'Women can't have it all'

    I really do believe that I have it all.

    I work in my chosen field,have been at the top of the sector and work part time so I get to do school rosters, excursions etc

    I agree the definition of have it all is subjective, but I do believe it is posdible

    Sent from my GT-I9100T using BubHub

  10. #29
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    Default Labour's flexible work arrangements and Julie Bishop's 'Women can't have it all'

    Quote Originally Posted by MsTruth View Post
    I really do believe that I have it all.

    I work in my chosen field,have been at the top of the sector and work part time so I get to do school rosters, excursions etc

    I agree the definition of have it all is subjective, but I do believe it is posdible

    Sent from my GT-I9100T using BubHub
    That is so great! And I mean that sincerely. It's great to hear some good news stories.

    Are you able to share what sector you're in?

  11. #30
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    Default Labour's flexible work arrangements and Julie Bishop's 'Women can't have it all'

    Quote Originally Posted by Plan2bamummy View Post
    Ask yourself this question:
    You ask for flexibility it's declined, you use this "flexible working" legislation and force your employer to give you flexibility.
    Do you really want to work in this environment? Seems like it will just create under current hostility in the workplace to me.
    Not if you make it work and show them how good it is for their business. The only way to change their mind is to show them.

    I have known a number of senior law firm partners who were dead-set against part time employees, were "forced" to allow it and were pleasantly surprised and openly admitted that they were wrong and that they could now see how well it could work.


 

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