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  1. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackEyedPea View Post
    We're not talking about rights here - clearly Vic park is saying Women should also have no rights during pregnancy! Women should 'take responsibility for their actions'. But if that's the case, then so should men? It takes both to make a baby...?
    Absolutely, but how does a man take responsibility for their actions in terms of pregnancy?

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    lambjam is offline Nitwit! Blubber! Oddment! Tweak!
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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Quote Originally Posted by BlissedOut View Post
    Absolutely, but how does a man take responsibility for their actions in terms of pregnancy?
    The truth is they can't, not in the same way a woman must. This is why contraception and termination of pregnancy are vital components of gender equality.

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  4. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    - free sterilisation for repeat offenders
    are you talking about forced sterilisation? bc we are getting into really dangerous territory here. In some ways we share the same opinions about abortion, I don't like it either and never will. But you are wanting to force your stance of other woman's bodies, that's where we differ. The bottom line is that no matter what you or I say, there will always be abortions, be it medical or backyard. Would you prefer those women were forced into that situation and died?

    Quote Originally Posted by BigRedV View Post
    Your definition of abhorrent is a abortion. The idea of forced pregnancy is more abhorrent. Most people would agree. Most people want women to have the right to safe terminations, instead of being forced into dodgy backyard jobs that don't even reduce the number of above thins anyway.
    No matter how much abortion makes me sad, the right of every woman to safe abortions is important. Imagine the deaths of the mother AND child without it

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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    The money can be worked out later.

    As for the legalities around adoption they can be changed. Don't want to raise your baby? Then you don't have a right to stop its adoption.

    As for it should be the choice of whoevers the incubator. I disagree with that. Abortion is such a blight on humanity I think bodily autonomy rights should be overridden. I don't expect all others to agree as I know this issue cuts deep into our personal fibre and we all feel these things differently.
    I think the societal implications of stopping terminations are horrendous. Do you think all adoptions have a happy ending? Or that with a bit of support, all unwilling single mums become fabulous parents with well-adjusted children? Delusional if you do.

    You seem to think the only right that matters to a child is the right to be born. What about the right to be wanted and loved, to know its biological background and to know that it was not brought into existence because of a mistake that its parent(s) wished they could erase but the legislators wouldn't let them.

    I had a termination when I was younger and I can tell you 100% that the world and the potential child in question are much better off.
    Last edited by shelle65; 11-11-2012 at 09:01.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shelle65 View Post
    I think the societal implications of stopping terminations are horrendous. Do you think all adoptions have a happy ending? Or that with a bit of support, all unwilling single mums become fabulous parents with well-adjusted children? Delusional if you do.

    You seem to think the only right that matters to a child is the right to be born. What about the right to be wanted and loved, to know its biological background and to know that it was not brought into existence because of a mistake that its parent(s) wished they could erase but the legislators wouldn't let them.

    I had a termination when I was younger and I can tell you 100% that the world and the potential child in question are much better off.
    Brilliant post Shell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlissedOut View Post
    Absolutely, but how does a man take responsibility for their actions in terms of pregnancy?
    Obviously they can't. I guess my point was that it's absurd to expect women to 'take responsibility' for unwanted/unplanned pregnancies by proceeding with it. It also implies women aren't taking responsibility by chosing to have an abortion. how insulting and warped is that thinking? I think women DO and are capable of making informed decisions based on what is right and best for their own situation! If men got pregnant instead of women, they would demand the right to choose as well, because we all have the right to choose what is best for ourselves and our lives.

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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Quote Originally Posted by shelle65 View Post
    I think the societal implications of stopping terminations are horrendous. Do you think all adoptions have a happy ending? Or that with a bit of support, all unwilling single mums become fabulous parents with well-adjusted children? Delusional if you do.

    You seem to think the only right that matters to a child is the right to be born. What about the right to be wanted and loved, to know its biological background and to know that it was not brought into existence because of a mistake that its parent(s) wished they could erase but the legislators wouldn't let them.

    I had a termination when I was younger and I can tell you 100% that the world and the potential child in question are much better off.
    All good points but I can not bring
    Myself to think that killing a baby is an acceptable outcome. A mother suffering and having it tough is better than a baby being killed in my opinion. I don't expect you to agree.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    All good points but I can not bring
    Myself to think that killing a baby is an acceptable outcome. A mother suffering and having it tough is better than a baby being killed in my opinion. I don't expect you to agree.
    An unwanted and unloved child is better than a termination at say 6 weeks duration? I think there are too many unwanted, unloved, abused, beaten, dirt poor children in this world as it is. I would like to see less, not more.

    Until we live in a world where rape and DV don't exist, single mums arent among the world's poorest, women aren't disadvantaged career-wise for taking time off to raise children, contraception is free of charge and free of side effects I just think your ideals would be a nightmare. Sounds romantic in theory, but in reality it would have disasterous and deadly consequences.
    Last edited by Benji; 11-11-2012 at 09:35.

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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Vicpark you seem to think that mothers deciding to terminate do it because it is what is best for them (the mother) and do not consider the child. I can tell you from experience that it is often just as much a decision about what they think is best for the child. Some decisions to terminate are entirely selfless.

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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Quote Originally Posted by shelle65 View Post
    Vicpark you seem to think that mothers deciding to terminate do it because it is what is best for them (the mother) and do not consider the child. I can tell you from experience that it is often just as much a decision about what they think is best for the child. Some decisions to terminate are entirely selfless.
    Sorry but I'm calling the BS flag on that. You can not tell me that having a baby killed is in the best interests of the baby. That's just absurd and it's something mothers who have had abortions say to make themselves cope with what they've done.


 

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