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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    - adoption
    - help with raising the bub (moral, financial)
    - free contraception (yes, I know it's a foreign concept but part of the plan would involve women taking responsibility for not falling pregnant in the first place)
    - free sterilisation for repeat offenders
    Where would these services come from? Who would pay - the pro-lifers.

    Do you have any idea of the legalities of adopting out a baby. It would still need the mothers permission to happen. What happens if she doesn't give it... what happens to the baby then, foster care with maybe dozens of families over an 18yr period.

    Vic Park I am glad you are not making legislation in this country, about mine and other womens bodies.

    I understand that you don't like abortion at all, so the reality is you don't ever have to have one. No one will ever force you to terminate a pregnancy, the law protects you on this even.

    My body, my choice. Your body, your choice.

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  3. #162
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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Quote Originally Posted by Clementine Grace View Post
    How do you deal with the issue then of backyard abortions (where lots of women and very young girls could die) if you ban it?
    I assume for severe medical issues it would still be legal.

    For all other issues backyard abortions would be a terrible, but acceptable, alternative to the continuation of mass killings of babies. At some point women have to take responsibility for their actions.

  4. #163
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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    I think VicPark is addressing Sassy's logic and applying it to other things to point out the flaw.

    Sassy has said several times that she wouldn't make the choice herself but won't take it away from other women, however we wouldn't apply this logic to all things. You want to rob a bank? That's your choice! Burn down a school? That's your choice! Bring about the holocaust? You get the point.

    The line I'm attempting to address is when our choices are truly ours, because when they affect others it becomes clear we do not have free reign over our choices. And I put forward that when your choice is affecting a viable human being, your right to choice and bodily autonomy should only extend to discontinuing a pregnancy, not to taking their life.

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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Quote Originally Posted by BigRedV View Post
    The idea of forced pregnancy is more abhorrent. Most people would agree. .
    Im not so sure about that. It you asked someone to watch an ultrasound of an abortion... And a clip of a mothers unwanted pregnancy... Are you really sure the masses would vote the unwanted pregnancy as being the worst?

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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Quote Originally Posted by onionskin View Post
    Where would these services come from? Who would pay - the pro-lifers.

    Do you have any idea of the legalities of adopting out a baby. It would still need the mothers permission to happen. What happens if she doesn't give it... what happens to the baby then, foster care with maybe dozens of families over an 18yr period.

    Vic Park I am glad you are not making legislation in this country, about mine and other womens bodies.

    I understand that you don't like abortion at all, so the reality is you don't ever have to have one. No one will ever force you to terminate a pregnancy, the law protects you on this even.

    My body, my choice. Your body, your choice.
    The money can be worked out later.

    As for the legalities around adoption they can be changed. Don't want to raise your baby? Then you don't have a right to stop its adoption.

    As for it should be the choice of whoevers the incubator. I disagree with that. Abortion is such a blight on humanity I think bodily autonomy rights should be overridden. I don't expect all others to agree as I know this issue cuts deep into our personal fibre and we all feel these things differently.

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    Default Interesting true story on Abortion in VIC on ABC

    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    Im not so sure about that. It you asked someone to watch an ultrasound of an abortion... And a clip of a mothers unwanted pregnancy... Are you really sure the masses would vote the unwanted pregnancy as being the worst?
    I think a few millennia of female subjugation attests to the extreme results of unwanted pregnancy.

    Bearing in mind that a clip of an abortion would take a few minutes to watch but the effects of an unwanted pregnancy can go on for generations, I don't think most people would be capable of sitting and watching the latter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    At some point women have to take responsibility for their actions.
    And men? You still haven't addressed men's responsibilities regarding unwanted pregnancies....?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackEyedPea View Post
    And men? You still haven't addressed men's responsibilities regarding unwanted pregnancies....?
    Men have no rights during pregnancy. So why should they have responsibility there?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlissedOut View Post
    Men have no rights during pregnancy. So why should they have responsibility there?
    We're not talking about rights here - clearly Vic park is saying Women should also have no rights during pregnancy! Women should 'take responsibility for their actions'. But if that's the case, then so should men? It takes both to make a baby...?

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    Quote Originally Posted by VicPark View Post
    The money can be worked out later.

    As for the legalities around adoption they can be changed. Don't want to raise your baby? Then you don't have a right to stop its adoption.

    As for it should be the choice of whoevers the incubator. I disagree with that. Abortion is such a blight on humanity I think bodily autonomy rights should be overridden. I don't expect all others to agree as I know this issue cuts deep into our personal fibre and we all feel these things differently.

    Vic Park do you realise how many children there are in the world that are not being cared for or educated or scooped up and cuddled when they need it. They are everywhere, globally. It is a horrible reality of the world.

    How many more unwanted babies will your laws bring in. Uncared for, unloved, neglected etc.

    I will always fight for the rights of the woman, she has to trump the foetus/baby. Always. I don't have to like or agree with it, to know that it is absolutely her choice to make. Whatever that choice may be.

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