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  1. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by lambjam View Post
    I think she meant to quote Lily.
    Thanks, I wasn't about to trawl through this many pages, so thanks for that

  2. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roopee View Post
    That's because quite often, and rightfully so, the birth has a significant and direct impact on HOW that child is raised.
    Can you please explain your comment further because ATM this makes no sense to me at all.

  3. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by beebs View Post
    She has a different opinion to you so therefore doesn't know what she is talking about??

    I can see why some people are getting upset about the article, but I still see she isn't meaning it the way most are taking it, she means about the hoity toity up themselves mums who look down their nose at intervention births like you haven't really had a real birth experience if you had intervention, drugs, c/sections. Those mums do exist.
    No she doesn't. She didn't know why someone would have a plan about birthing their placenta, there are reasons for it.

    My personal view of birth plans is that they're most useful when you set them onfire and use them to toast marshmallows. But there are some women who live forthem: I call them Birthzillas because just like a Bridezilla focuses on thewedding, not the marriage, the Birthzilla appears more interested in having abirth experience than a baby.
    Untrue that's not why women have birth plans and the birth experience is important, there's something called birth trauma that affects women well after they've had the baby, its real and it matters. Having a birth plan and focusing on your birth experience doesn't mean you want the experience more than a baby.


    Birthzillasusually speak about "empowerment" and "control" and use alot of personal pronouns. Their own experience is invariably at the centre oftheir narrative even though they will always claim (and probably believe) thatthey're acting selflessly for the good of their baby.
    Again, untrue, women aren't selfish for wanting a good birth experience and wanting to avoid birth trauma, feeling empowered and in control isn't selfish and those very words have meaning in birth and labour.


    However,among privileged women with access to safe and affordable care, I've noticed agrowing fixation on the birth process. For many, it's about control.
    No its not.


    One ofthe most confronting things about pregnancy and birth is the unpredictabilityof it and women often believe they can regain control by planning.

    Yes you can regain control by planning, you can plan for the unpredictability of it aswell. I planned incase of another emergency c/s amongst many things and what I would want that I never got the first time. By planning I was more likely to not have regrets.


    Men? Theycouldn't care less. Never in your life will you hear a man urge a woman,"Please! Tell me more about the way you gave birth!" Not even ifshe's his wife.

    Why would they care about another womens birth? This point is irrelevant.

    So yes I don't think she knows what she's talking about, doesn't understand why women plan, doesn't understand choices, doesn't understand empowerment and she doesn't understand birth trauma, if she did she'd understand all the above.
    Last edited by Lily of the Nile; 18-06-2012 at 16:38.

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  5. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by louellyn View Post
    Can you please explain your comment further because ATM this makes no sense to me at all.
    I'm not quite sure what she meant but my traumatic birth meant that I couldn't sit for long periods of time - I was back and forth from GPs. Rather than being happy that I had a beautiful new baby, I'd cry myself to sleep because of the pain.

    Lots of women end up with PND due to a traumatic birth. Thankfully, I didn't - but the doctor at the hospital told my family they had to keep an eye on me because of the way my birth unfolded.

  6. #195
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    double post
    Last edited by erinn; 18-06-2012 at 17:19.

  7. #196
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    Originally Posted by Roopee
    That's because quite often, and rightfully so, the birth has a significant and direct impact on HOW that child is raised.


    Can you please explain your comment further because ATM this makes no sense to me at all.


    Haven't read this entire thread but in regards to this particular comment, I have to agree with Benji - Particularly in the case of someone who has had a traumatic birth that birthing experience that people like to say is just a small one off event in the scheme of parenting CAN and DOES have an impact on the way the children are raised. As someone who has been traumatised by the events surrounding my daughter's birth and what happened directly after, who has been diagnosed with PND, Post traumatic stress and anxiety the birth did have an effect on the way my daughter has been parented - particularly in the first year, simply because we struggled with bonding, because I have a lot of unhappy flashbacks of the whole time, because it affected my marriage and therefore the dynamics of our household and because its completely changed me as a person than who I was before, so in our case it definately has impacted on how our child is raised.

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  9. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by share a book View Post
    Um, I didn't recall saying what you quoted so went back to find it and in fact did not say it
    That was lilyofthenile I was quoting!

  10. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benji View Post
    I'm not quite sure what she meant but my traumatic birth meant that I couldn't sit for long periods of time - I was back and forth from GPs. Rather than being happy that I had a beautiful new baby, I'd cry myself to sleep because of the pain.

    Lots of women end up with PND due to a traumatic birth. Thankfully, I didn't - but the doctor at the hospital told my family they had to keep an eye on me because of the way my birth unfolded.
    I was the same, breast feeding was highly painful as I could not sit to do it, I had (and still have) bladder control issues, sex was a nightmare and hurt for a good 12 months after ds's birth, standing was something I could not do without feeling like my insides were falling out.

    Add that to the fact that I had no time to prepare myself for a pair of scissors slicing open my vagina just the feeling of them cutting (and after ds's birth I could not focus on him at all, all I could thnk was what the F*** is down there,I could physically feel my vagina HANGING open ...) yes I would say that my birth experiance did indeed matter and did indeed result in affecting the way I bonded with my newborn in the days that followed,

    add that to everyone like this woman rabbiting on about how I needed to suck it up and be glad I had a live son.

    yes I will have a rough plan next time, I do NOT think it is selfish to have a peice of paper that states I WANT TO DO EVERYTHING POSSIBLE TO ENSURE YOURE SCISSORS DO NOT CUT MY PERINIUM pls k thanks at all, I think it is taking control of a situation and being responsable for myself.

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  12. #199
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    I still don't think she is talking about women who have experienced birth trauma...if she was then I would be way offended, but reading that article didn't offend me. We are all getting different meanings from it.

    Lily - there are absolutely times when it is *not* ok to homebirth, when even homebirth advocates say you shouldn't homebirth and yet sometimes, people are so determined they are doing the right thing they do it anyway.

    This goes both ways - a lot of the time obs try and push c/sections on women who don't need them, who aren't candidates for them etc.

    At the end of the day, all women should be able to birth the way the feel most comfortable with....and we should all leave the smuggness at home!

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  14. #200
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    erinn and Nemmi and those who have suffered as a result of birth. Birth DOES matter. We DO matter.

    And there are people out there willing to listen. For every person who shouts "shut your pie hole, I don't care" there's always someone who is willing to lend an ear without judgement.

    I do care and women's birth plans are important to me.

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