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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by kw123 View Post
    VicPark - just letting you know I have now edited my post - I meant to say the first feed should happen within 8 hours not that it would last that long! Ouch!

    I am aware that it may well be difficult and in some cases is just not possible. This is why I went to the class as I don't assume it will all come naturally. I'm just going to do my best and certainly wont be killing myself. Happy mum = happy bub! I also want to express after 10-12 weeks so DH can do so feeds which I know the ABA would not approve of!!
    Actually a feed can take 8 hours. My DD fed around the clock for the first 3 months, I kid you not. The longest feed was 9 hours, a friend of mine once fed her baby for 19 hours straight. An average feed for me would take 4 hours.

    As for bottles, be aware that if you introduce a bottle bubs may refuse to latch onto your breast . This happened to another friend of mine. She gave her DD a bottle at about 3 or 4 months, went to bf again and bubs literally spat it out of her mouth and would only take a bottle thereafter.

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    My hospital encouraged you to feed straight away. The midwives were available to help with the first feed if I wanted help, would have felt pretty lost if they had not been there. I would have thought the ABA would be encouraging you to seek help from early on if you want it?

    No one was going to stop me from showering - spew, poo, blood everywhere. And it was nice to put on fresh pjs etc. But we didn't bath bub until about day 5 or so. There was this bit of gunk on her head - it was how I knew she was mine in case there was any mix up!!

    I lived in breastfeeding singlets and flannel pj tops. So you could be completely open/lots of skin, then cover up pretty quickly/easily. As for going topless all the time - Canberra winters not really an option!

    I think it is misleading to tell people it will be pain free. There must be so many people out there thinking they are doing it wrong, when I'm sure they're not. There are two types of pain I can think of - your uterus contracting as you feed, that was completely unexpected how bad that pain was for me and gets worse each baby. And then your nipples as baby latches. I curled my toes every time she latched for the first 8 or so weeks, for the first 15 sec of each feed and a few times during as she attached and reattached. I know I was doing it right, I got heaps of advice, didnt really have too many grazes etc. It was just my nipples getting used to it all.

    Good luck!

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    Quote Originally Posted by kw123 View Post
    VicPark - just letting you know I have now edited my post - I meant to say the first feed should happen within 8 hours not that it would last that long! Ouch!

    I am aware that it may well be difficult and in some cases is just not possible. This is why I went to the class as I don't assume it will all come naturally. I'm just going to do my best and certainly wont be killing myself. Happy mum = happy bub! I also want to express after 10-12 weeks so DH can do so feeds which I know the ABA would not approve of!!
    Good luck... After doing research I decided at 4 weeks to introduce 1 bottle of expressed milk each day at the dreamfeed. Daddy gives the bottle, there was no confusion of any sort (I think daddy giving the bottle helps). It helped with daddy bubba bonding and i can now go out on 'excursions' as bub is great at taking a bottle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mytwowilldo View Post
    My hospital encouraged you to feed straight away. The midwives were available to help with the first feed if I wanted help, would have felt pretty lost if they had not been there. I would have thought the ABA would be encouraging you to seek help from early on if you want it?

    No one was going to stop me from showering - spew, poo, blood everywhere. And it was nice to put on fresh pjs etc. But we didn't bath bub until about day 5 or so. There was this bit of gunk on her head - it was how I knew she was mine in case there was any mix up!!

    I lived in breastfeeding singlets and flannel pj tops. So you could be completely open/lots of skin, then cover up pretty quickly/easily. As for going topless all the time - Canberra winters not really an option!

    I think it is misleading to tell people it will be pain free. There must be so many people out there thinking they are doing it wrong, when I'm sure they're not. There are two types of pain I can think of - your uterus contracting as you feed, that was completely unexpected how bad that pain was for me and gets worse each baby. And then your nipples as baby latches. I curled my toes every time she latched for the first 8 or so weeks, for the first 15 sec of each feed and a few times during as she attached and reattached. I know I was doing it right, I got heaps of advice, didnt really have too many grazes etc. It was just my nipples getting used to it all.

    Good luck!
    They definitely encourage you to seek help/support but not actually getting involved I.e midwives trying to "push" bub onto the breast or them hand expressing you. Not at such early stages anyway.

    I don't think I worded my OP particularly well so apologies for that!

    I don't expect pain free - that was why I was surprised! They did mention the uterus contracting pain though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Bec~ View Post
    Actually a feed can take 8 hours. My DD fed around the clock for the first 3 months, I kid you not. The longest feed was 9 hours, a friend of mine once fed her baby for 19 hours straight. An average feed for me would take 4 hours.

    As for bottles, be aware that if you introduce a bottle bubs may refuse to latch onto your breast . This happened to another friend of mine. She gave her DD a bottle at about 3 or 4 months, went to bf again and bubs literally spat it out of her mouth and would only take a bottle thereafter.
    Wow that is really long! Did bubs sleep at all that time or suck the whole time? These are things that are good to know!

    I know there are risks about introducing a bottle and will definitely research the ones that are most likely to help avoid breast/bottle confusion. I will see how BF is going generally before doing this. If its already tricky I either won't or will delay further.....

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    I had DD about 4 months ago and still feeding really well which is great. A few things I wished I knew before her arrival re breastfeeding were:
    - we had latching down pat until my milk came in and their shape changed. Which meant she had to learn to latch differently. Asking the midwife to help attach every feed would have saved me 9 weeks of pain from being severely damaged from one feed.
    - trust your baby. My DD knew what to do to bring my milk in. She fed solidly on day 2/3 moving from breast to breast from 7:30pm until 2:30am then again from 8:30am until 2:30 pm. I think they're was another feed in between. That was exhausting, but milk came in strongly.
    - if your having trouble there is plenty of support out there but the combo I found best was the GP that was also a Lactation consultant.
    Good luck!

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    Quote Originally Posted by kw123 View Post
    Hi all

    I've just been to the ABA workshop (I'm due in 5 weeks) which I found very useful overall. I just wondered if some of you experienced BF'ers could give me your thoughts on a couple of things:

    1) they have said that bubs first bf can take up to 8 hours to take place and ideally no interference should occur in terms of "assistance" with latching, hand expressing, etc. I am comfortable with this but no I will get resistance from the hospital as they reckon the first feed should happen within one hour! Does anyone have experience with handling this?

    2) they mentioned not showering and only washing from waist down for 2-3 days which does not sound appealing after labour! Has anyone done this? Same for not bathing bubs in this period too, and I imagine they would be covered in vernix, etc.

    3) baby led attachment - they have said that the best way to do this is for you to have no top on at all and bub also to be naked so you have skin on skin, place the baby up by your heart and then let them find their own way to the breast. Again I am totally comfortable with this. My question is, I am obviously not going to be able to do this all the time as I will have visitors staying and don't want to be locked away in order to feed... I imagine I can pretty much do this exclusively for a week or so and then will have to alternate between that and mother led attachment. The ABA said this was of course fine as its important to get out and about but just keen to hear of others experience of this and alternating between the two.

    4) they said BF'ing should be pain free. How realistic is this??

    I think that was the main things... Thanks in advance!
    Hi kw123,
    I help run these classes in another state, but they are largely the same; I have made some suggestions below that may help you make the decisions that are right for you when your baby arrives

    1) We normally let mums know it may take up to an hour for a baby to do the full 'baby crawl' after birth (if they are planning on trying that), as after watching the DVD some have the impression it can happen instantly. Most hospitals are happy to allow you to do skin to skin and baby crawl for this amount of time if its what you want - many even longer. The first feed does not always occur in the first hour however and it can be several hours before the baby seeks out a feed – they have extra fluid and brown fat on board and have been fed via the cord right up to the birth, so unless there is a known medical issue, the first feed should be initiated by the baby. I can understand a hospital may be concerned with leaving a baby 8 hours before a first feed, and if there was a medical issue such as low blood sugar, the midwife may suggest something like hand expressing and feeding the baby the colostrum from a syringe so their blood sugar does not drop. In this case, I would encourage you to follow their suggestions. Baby led attachment may not always work first time, and your baby may need a little guidance from you, but in this case we also let mums know is that he or she may show more interest and be able to better follow instincts after a day or two so its fine to try again later. Some babies pick it up at many weeks or months old (it is especially helpful for attachment issues in the early days/weeks - many mums think it is something you just do immediately after the birth but it can be done anytime).

    2) The background to this idea is explained in Sue Cox's book 'baby magic', and is also covered in the book you would have received as an ABA member - 'breastfeeding naturally'. Basically the amniotic fluid the baby smears on the chest after birth is what he or she uses to find his or her way back to the breast for subsequent feeds. It helps them follow their instincts. However, if you don't want to wait 2-3 days to shower, what you could do instead is have a shower but just rinse your chest area with water (no soap) and avoid using perfumes or deodorants on your chest area as this may mask the smell of the amniotic fluid.

    3) I have attached a video below of a mother doing baby led feeding while clothed, so you can see how it can be done in more day to day circumstances.

    http://www.biologicalnurturing.com/video/bn3clip.html

    There is also a short DVD you can buy from the ABA website (under mothers direct-sales area) called "Babies know". It is really fantastic, and shows many mums feeding baby where baby initiates and leads the attachment and all these mums are clothed too. You can see in that video they sort of start the baby with its cheek just on top of the breast, and baby just turns, root, opens, latches rather than making its way across from a more central position between the breasts as in full baby led attachment. This is often what baby led attachment morphs into as baby gets older.

    The reason mums are encouraged to do this naked from the waist up and in skin to skin contact with their babies in the first few days is that it allows baby to best follow instincts in getting to the breast because a big part of doing this is the sense of smell and touch. While they are learning, this really helps them, and also being in close skin to skin contact with mum helps regulate body temperature, blood sugar, and milk production hormones. If you have visitors, you can tuck baby inside your shirt between feeds, or maybe use a shawl over your shoulders during feeds if you are unable to do it completely stripped off. Baby led attachment is a teaching technique, and once your baby gets the idea, you won’t need to strip for feeds .

    4) Yes, this is realistic. Pain is your bodies way to guiding you back to comfort, so listen to your body if you are in pain and ask for help. If the feed is hurting, break the suction by inserting a clean finger in the corner of your baby's mouth, and start again. It is better to re attach several times than to persist through an uncomfortable feed and end with damaged nipples. Nipples can get damaged easily - just a minute of sucking with a bad latch is enough for some mums. Some mums are also reluctant to detach and re latch if there are visitors in the room, or if it is 3am and they are tired, so just be aware of this if you are expecting lots of visitors. It is your learning time with your baby, so most people understand if you ask them to come back later or wait until you are home. In the first couple of weeks you can expect some nipple sensitivity which is partly hormonal and partly due to them becoming accustomed to the strong suck of a newborn. Anything more than sensitivity and slight discomfort is a sign that something is not right with attachment and needs to be checked. There can be up to 10 seconds of pain as baby first attaches and the nipple stretches, and there can be pain as your uterus contracts. If the pain persists beyond the first 10 seconds, it is not normal and needs to be checked.

    How does all that sound?

    There is a lot to absorb at those classes, and sometimes comments can be taken quite literally; it may help to remember that the class offers guidelines and suggestions but not strict instructions. It is up to each mother to decide which parts may work for her, and to keep in mind that things don't always go exactly to plan. That's ok. That's how life goes sometimes. If breastfeeding does not work out it is important to remember that how you feed your baby is just one part of being a loving mother, and you did your best by going to a class, being prepared and giving it a 'red hot go'. You also know where to go for support if you need it.

    Good luck with your baby
    Last edited by purplecat; 28-05-2012 at 20:26.

  8. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to purplecat For This Useful Post:

    Alphabetsoup  (28-05-2012),AppleIsleSMum  (28-05-2012),Bubbles10  (28-05-2012),kw123  (29-05-2012),mel6280  (28-05-2012)

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    Quote Originally Posted by purplecat View Post
    Hi kw123,
    I help run these classes in another state, but they are largely the same; I have made some suggestions below that may help you make the decisions that are right for you when your baby arrives
    Quote Originally Posted by purplecat View Post
    There is a lot to absorb at those classes, and sometimes comments can be taken quite literally; it may help to remember that the class offers guidelines and suggestions but not strict instructions. It is up to each mother to decide which parts may work for her, and to keep in mind that things don't always go exactly to plan. That's ok. That's how life goes sometimes. If breastfeeding does not work out it is important to remember that how you feed your baby is just one part of being a loving mother, and you did your best by going to a class, being prepared and giving it a 'red hot go'. You also know where to go for support if you need it.

    Good luck with your baby
    I wish you were helping run the class I went to!

    And I wish that someone would have said that last paragraph to me.

    Great advice

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    Purplecat THANK YOU!! You have totally addressed all of my questions and I will check out the video and the book which I got from the ABA which I have not read entirely yet!

    So so helpful! I definitely know where to go to get support if I need it, and also have the details of an LC near
    me if I need one so should be all set.

    Thanks again!

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    The 'naturally breastfeeding' book from the ABA was my bible. It was also handy for my first birth to take it to hospital and i had it sitting on my bed. For midwives that i wasn't comfortable with, i would just point to the book and say i was right and didn't need their assistance. I didn't want any physical assistance with breastfeeding, and reading up and doing the ABA course beforehand helped me achieve this.

    best wishes!

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Bubbles10 For This Useful Post:

    kw123  (29-05-2012)


 

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