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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benji View Post
    Perhaps she's in favour of his ideals to help farmers produce GM crops (which will be more drought resistant) to help reduce poverty and hunger. I don't see why this would mean she hasn't researched.
    Oh god, aligning vaxxing and monsanto/gm crops together is not going to help the cause!! Monsanto is like the devil, so many things that are bad on this earth they make or play a hand in making. I suppose they are a bit like the vax industry where all this 'progress' translates into dollars for them.
    In a perfect world monsanto would be working towards the greater good by reducing poverty and hunger but in the end they are a corporation with shareholders who are trying to monopolise the market, they make these 'improved' crops that are resistant to their herbicides so all of the farmers (rich or poor) have to buy their products, they then ban the practice of seed saving (common practice in poor countries) so they can then sell more of their seeds. And so the cycle continues. There will come a day when they release seeds which are sterile and will not grow new plants, they already have the technology. I hate to think of the implications of that on a large scale. Aaaaarrrgh

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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Smile View Post
    Without trying to sound harsh or cold, isn't that up to Mother Nature to sort out, as she always has done?
    Creating Frankenstein foods to sustain a planet already at full capacity, without really knowing the effect of these foods on humans, is a recipe for disaster in my mind.
    It's human interference with the natural order of things that has us in this mess.
    That’s a contradiction. On one hand you're saying human health shouldn't be 'interfered' with through consumption of GM foods, and on the other advocating the wholesale abolition of millions of humans via natural selection - in this case, starvation. So do we care about human health, or not? We can't have it both ways.

    If Mother Nature will sort it out as she always has done, maybe we should go back to the good old days of smallpox. If people back then had had the right to choose not to be vaccinated, smallpox would still be with us. Would ANYONE choose that?

    The GM debate, like the vaxxing "debate", is fuelled by mass hysteria and zero science. Yes, there are good and bad applications of the science, like any science (ie nuclear medicine vs the atomic bomb) but it has huge capacity to address our global food security issues. Monsanto is not the only organisation with access to this technology!

    I remember when the Frankenfoods debate erupted in the 1990s, The Times in the UK did a simple poll which illustrates this perfectly. The question was something like this:

    True or false: GM tomatoes have genes, organic tomatoes do not have genes.

    Something like 50% of readers said that statement was true. It's breathtaking to think these were the same people marching around with banners when they didn't have even the most basic understanding of what's involved. It's my belief that the general understanding hasn't progressed very far since then.

    And the thing is that genetic modification IS NOT NEW. Every time a human farmer breeds two strains of a crop for a favourable quality, that is genetic modification. Just look at domestic animals - they look/behave/taste the way they do because human farmers have performed genetic modification on them over many many generations, selecting for qualities favourable to humans. As scientific knowledge progresses our capacity to finesse and speed up this process increases. That doesn't make it intrinsically bad.

    Science has brought us EVERY luxury we enjoy in the developed world. Yet the scientific community is demonised by a small but hysterically vocal minority with far more sway over policy than is justified by their small numbers. The rest of us enable this by saying nothing.

    Back to the OT - my opinion is that vaccinations should be mandatory for every man, woman and child - maybe then we'd be able to wipe out a few more diseases like we did smallpox.

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  5. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiggerfields View Post

    Back to the OT - my opinion is that vaccinations should be mandatory for every man, woman and child - maybe then we'd be able to wipe out a few more diseases like we did smallpox.
    Thankfully these decisions are not made based upon your opinion

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  7. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by luvmyboys View Post
    I suppose they are a bit like the vax industry where all this 'progress' translates into dollars for them.
    This argument kills me. Why would pharmaceutical companies work for free?! EVERYTHING costs money, unless you live in a tribe in PNG or the Amazon. I'm very happy for my first-world dollars to fund an industry that has doubled the human lifespan, exponentially improved our quality of life, and made many common diseases history.

  8. #35
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    headoverfeet is offline The truth will set you free, but first it will **** you off. -Gloria Steinem
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    Quote Originally Posted by luvmyboys View Post
    Thankfully these decisions are not made based upon your opinion
    totally agree!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by luvmyboys View Post
    Oh god, aligning vaxxing and monsanto/gm crops together is not going to help the cause!! Monsanto is like the devil, so many things that are bad on this earth they make or play a hand in making. I suppose they are a bit like the vax industry where all this 'progress' translates into dollars for them.
    In a perfect world monsanto would be working towards the greater good by reducing poverty and hunger but in the end they are a corporation with shareholders who are trying to monopolise the market, they make these 'improved' crops that are resistant to their herbicides so all of the farmers (rich or poor) have to buy their products, they then ban the practice of seed saving (common practice in poor countries) so they can then sell more of their seeds. And so the cycle continues. There will come a day when they release seeds which are sterile and will not grow new plants, they already have the technology. I hate to think of the implications of that on a large scale. Aaaaarrrgh
    It wasn't me who brought it up and, as I have said, I don't know nor claim to know what is right when it comes to GM. I think to say that Bill Gates has done the world no good because he supports GM crops in an attempt to help solve hunger issues is a bit biased to say the least and I believe my response was actually to a member whom the article is referring "Bill Gates is full of it and has no idea what he's on about, here, check out nature foods dot com". This is exactly the sttitude of which the article refers.

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  11. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiggerfields View Post
    That’s a contradiction. On one hand you're saying human health shouldn't be 'interfered' with through consumption of GM foods, and on the other advocating the wholesale abolition of millions of humans via natural selection - in this case, starvation. So do we care about human health, or not? We can't have it both ways.
    Quite simply, all I'm saying, if the world is out of balance it will,
    as it always has done, find it's equilibrium.
    Regardless of the loss of life.
    The Earth doesn't need humans as much as our over inflated egos seem to think it does.
    I never once advocated starvation???

    Why is the answer to these problems given to the select few corporations, who's main aim is to control the world's food supply, do you not see how dangerous that is?

    Scientists, paid by colossal corporations for their "research" are not always going to give the absolute truth either, whether under threat or under the influence of money.
    You gotta look at the people who have something to say with nothing to gain before you listen to the big boys who are money driven, just my gut feeling on it.


    Quote Originally Posted by tiggerfields View Post
    I'm very happy for my first-world dollars to fund an industry that has doubled the human lifespan, exponentially improved our quality of life, and made many common diseases history.
    I'm not demonising scientists, I do believe there are some genuine ones out there, however,those are usually the ones we don't hear about, the ones who go against the grain. I think it's a bit naive to think all of them are working for the better good.
    Just this week the WHO reported on how, in the future, antibiotics may not work anymore. Mostly because of the OVERUSE and WRONGFUL use of antibiotics. (In our food supply would be one example of wrongful use that springs to mind)



    Quote Originally Posted by tiggerfields View Post
    Back to the OT - my opinion is that vaccinations should be mandatory for every man, woman and child - maybe then we'd be able to wipe out a few more diseases like we did smallpox.
    Unfortunatley, should Monsanto and the likes get what their aiming for, you might get your wish. I hope I never , and more importantly,my G randkids never see that day.

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  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Smile View Post
    Unfortunatley, should Monsanto and the likes get what their aiming for, you might get your wish. I hope I never , and more importantly,my G randkids never see that day.
    But that day has already been! That's how we eradicated smallpox! Why does nobody remember this?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Benji View Post
    It wasn't me who brought it up and, as I have said, I don't know nor claim to know what is right when it comes to GM. I think to say that Bill Gates has done the world no good because he supports GM crops in an attempt to help solve hunger issues is a bit biased to say the least and I believe my response was actually to a member whom the article is referring "Bill Gates is full of it and has no idea what he's on about, here, check out nature foods dot com". This is exactly the sttitude of which the article refers.
    You talking 'bout me?
    I never said he was full of it, I don't agree with his promotion of GM foods.
    End of, I don't have an opinion on the man himself.
    My point in reference to Gates was more to do with the fact that Mia Freedman was idolising him because of his money, and the "he should know better" because of it???

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Smile View Post
    You talking 'bout me?
    I never said he was full of it, I don't agree with his promotion of GM foods.
    End of, I don't have an opinion on the man himself.
    My point in reference to Gates was more to do with the fact that Mia Freedman was idolising him because of his money, and the "he should know better" because of it???
    Is that what you understood from the Freedman article? That she was idolising him for his money? Because that's NOT what she was saying. She was saying he's doing great stuff with his Gates Foundations immunisation projects. Which partners with amazing organisations including the below. She wasn't 'idolising' him because he has money. She was applauding him for using that cash for scientifically-backed, incredibly beneficial, humanitarian work.

    Key Partners

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