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    Default Delusions can be contagious!!

    Such a great read in the Sunday mail today (U lift out) by Mia freedman. If you have the time have a read. A brilliant article!!
    Last edited by Alimia; 18-03-2012 at 09:58.

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    headoverfeet is offline The truth will set you free, but first it will **** you off. -Gloria Steinem
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    Dam I've already done my morning poop.

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    headoverfeet is offline The truth will set you free, but first it will **** you off. -Gloria Steinem
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    I'm guessing it's this article? http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/new...-1226301927876

    For the non-clickers

    Mia Freedman: Vaccination can't protect babies against stupidity

    THERE isn't enough room on this website to list all the things I don't know.

    There's not even enough room in Wikipedia, which - if it were an actual book - would take you 123 years to read.

    Recently, though, there's been an explosion of people with a wildly inflated sense of their own intelligence. Suddenly, everyone's an expert.

    Me, not so much. I understand how little I know about lots of things. For example, I know less about science than scientists. I know less about medicine than doctors. I know less about tax than my accountant, less about cooking than Donna Hay and less about animals than Bondi Vet.

    There's no shortage of genuine experts who have degrees, qualifications and years of experience in their fields. Having access to Google does not make you an expert, nor does having a website or watching a YouTube video. These things simply make you someone with an internet connection.

    "Everyone's an expert today," confirms social researcher Neer Kornntsok, "partly because we feel we need to be. We receive kudos for proclaiming our definitive knowledge to others and we compete to be the first to share facts, articles and videos."

    But reading some articles doesn't put you on par with a scientist and here's where it canbecome dangerous.

    A few years ago, I worked with a lovely guy who had left school at 16. When his wife had their first child, he "did his research" and they decided not to vaccinate their daughter.

    At the time, everyone around him insisted it was safe (and vital) but he was adamant. "I've read a lot about this and I watched this amazing video," he insisted, "Vaccinations are just a way for big companies and the government to make money."

    Where do you start arguing the extreme illogic of that? Not here; I'd need more space and a wheelie bin full of rescue remedy.

    While I accept my former co-worker was a thoughtful person who meant well, I'm floored by the extraordinary assumption that he knew better than every scientist in the world _ not to mention Bill and Melinda Gates who are spending hundreds of millions of their own dollars funding vaccination programs in third-world countries to eradicate killer diseases such as malaria.

    What on earth could make a civilian believe his Google "research" is superior to decades of science?Is it arrogance?

    "The internet has made expertise a mouse click away," says Korn."And a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

    "Just ask any GP who has to contend with self-diagnosing patients, determined they can identify their prognosis and treatment. They address them more as colleagues than patients because they place their internet search on par with the doctor's years of expertise."

    Doctors really do live this every day. One of my friends who is a medical specialist says: "You find yourself getting into these exhausting debates with patients who insist they've read something that goes against what you're telling them.

    "Unless you're highly experienced, it can be extremely difficult to judge the credibility of the information you find online."

    Which brings me to the Australian Vaccination Network (AVN) which, despite its official-sounding name, is in fact a group of civilian self-styled "experts" who campaign vigorously, and at times misleadingly (according to findings by the Health Care Complaints Commission), against vaccination, both on their website and in the free talks they give around Australia, sometimes to expectant parents at pre-natal classes.

    While publicly peddling its anti-vaccination message, the AVN cleverly makes it sound like there are "two sides" to the vaccination debate.

    In fact there aren't two sides, and there is no debate.

    On one hand there is science and there is no other hand.

    Because no link between vaccination and autism has ever been found. None. Ever.

    What has been conclusively proven is that while they are not 100 per cent perfect, vaccines are the best and only way to protect babies and children from diseases like whooping cough that can kill them.

    And the personal choice argument? Well, it's a bit like arguing that driving your car drunk is a personal choice.

    You see, the lives of babies too young to be vaccinated depend on herd immunity in the rest of the community.

    So the choice made by that guy I worked with didn't just affect his family. His well-intentioned yet ill-informed decision has the potential to harm my family. And yours.

    Watching (or even producing) a YouTube video with some cherry-picked statistics set to rousing orchestral music is not the same as having a university degree or having your research findings peer-reviewed.

    I'm baffled by this growing sense that everyone has the right _ indeed the obligation _ to challenge facts that have been established scientifically, independently and repeatedly over years, even decades.

    "Do your research!" is the common faux clarion call of so-called "experts".

    These exhortations are usually accompanied by a helpfullist of links to skewed, scientifically baseless articles that back up their claims. It's easy to mislead people with random graphs and alarmist statements.

    I'm certainly not suggesting becoming a flock of sheep or suspending critical thought.

    But I don't need to "do my research" before I vaccinate. Or before I accept the Earth is round and that gravity exists. Scientists far smarter than I am have already done that research and the verdict is unanimous, thanks.

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    I tend to agree with her on the internet being a dangerous place to self-diagnose or for a layman to be making health decisions for themselves or their children.

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    Don't always like everything this writer says but I agree. Recently I have come across so many people who don't vax because they seem to have done their dodgy research. A girl from my mothers group claims that the whooping cough vaccine gives you whooping cough and that breastfed babies can never actually get whooping cough according to her naturopath. And when my baby had the rotavirus vaccine she said she didn't want her kids near me for the next month because the live virus was contagious for a month. She always says her non vaxed kids never get sick but they always get sick. Its frustrating because I really like her but how can she really believe she is an expert on this? When scientists study for years and years

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    I enjoy her articles too. Sorry not computer savy enough to have shared the link.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bumMum View Post
    Don't always like everything this writer says but I agree. Recently I have come across so many people who don't vax because they seem to have done their dodgy research. A girl from my mothers group claims that the whooping cough vaccine gives you whooping cough and that breastfed babies can never actually get whooping cough according to her naturopath. And when my baby had the rotavirus vaccine she said she didn't want her kids near me for the next month because the live virus was contagious for a month. She always says her non vaxed kids never get sick but they always get sick. Its frustrating because I really like her but how can she really believe she is an expert on this? When scientists study for years and years

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    I'm not even going to begin pointing out the irony of the original article but have bolded a part here, Live rotavirus is shed by the body for up to 14 days after the vax, thus contaminating others, their argument for this being acceptable is that it is less severe than the wildtype, so in the case she was more informed than the average parent.

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    tiggerfields is offline Priestess of Kult K'iesha... Mooo!
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    Read it this morning, two big thumbs up to Mia, couldn't agree more.

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    It is shed in their poo for seven to fourteen days. Unless they change her nappy they aren't going to come in contact. And I wash my hands etc when I change nappies like most people. And there is a difference between 2 weeks and a month. So no, she isn't more informed at all, but thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by missie_mack View Post
    LOL surely I am not the only one who can see the hypocricy in much of what she has said I don't entirely disagree with her, you have to be cautious about what you read, where it is sourced and its purpose. But by her definition she isn't qualified in this area, shouldn't take what she has read elsewhere and use it to sprout facts BUT instead decides to write a whole article about vaccination
    I thought this too... And I am not anti-vax (but will delay) but don't think it is ever a good idea to just blindly put all your faith into the medical profession. Vaccines are miraculous and have saved millions of lives. But the actual schedule is questionable in my view. Doctors, etc need to consider what is convenient and most cost efficient, not what is correct for each individual child.

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