+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 21
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    108
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked
    18
    Reviews
    0

    Default Eggs not getting past day 3- advice

    Hi everyone, so I'm just wondering if anyone has had this happen to them and what could you do to better your chances. The egg splits into cells perfectly until day 3 and then it goes downhill. This has happened to both my ivf cycles. I've been told by fs it could possibly be a DNA fragmentation issue with the sperm or it could still be my eggs. Can someone explain it to me? Is there anything that can be done about this? Would icsi or anything like that give us better chances? Any advice, tips or stories would be so helpful. Thanks in advance!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    306
    Thanks
    33
    Thanked
    66
    Reviews
    0
    Hi Capri,

    I produce a good number of eggs, all of which fertilise however only 1 or 2 make it to day 5 and none have led to a BFP.

    I am now doing CGH testing to determine if there are chromosome abnormalities with the embies as a result of suspected poor egg quality. If all are abnormal then I have been told my eggs cannot be used for IVF as they will not lead to a viable pregnancy.

    Embies not getting passed day three could be a sperm or egg issue and depending on which they can do things to help. I would recommend getting CGH testing if you can afford it (it's around 5k and not refundable from Medicare) but I think it will give you a better idea of where you are at.

    All the best
    SS

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    421
    Thanks
    579
    Thanked
    515
    Reviews
    0
    Capri, this happened to us last cycle and we were told it could be a sperm issue as dh has very low counts and we did icsi. However, it can also be egg problem due to my age. It could also be just luck. We're doing our 2nd cycle now so will learn soon.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Gold Coast
    Posts
    1,566
    Thanks
    299
    Thanked
    161
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts
    Hi there,

    I read up on this also.. I read that from days 1-3 is egg related and 4-5 are sperm related..

    We are at day 3 now and have lost 2 in two days!

    Best of luck Hun!

    X

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,719
    Thanks
    386
    Thanked
    208
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts
    We are doing ivf icsi as I have no known fertility issues & DH has poor abnormal sperm morphology - they retrieved 20 eggs from me last Friday & by Sunday we had 4 fertilizing, one was transferred & then 2 of the 3 made it to the freeze - I too don't understand sorry!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    306
    Thanks
    33
    Thanked
    66
    Reviews
    0
    jessegirl can you pass on where you read that.

    Mine arrest at day 4 and I have been told it is definitely an egg issue so would be interested to reading where it says it is a sperm issue as I have been told not to try with my eggs again.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    973
    Thanks
    70
    Thanked
    301
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts
    SummerShine - the D1-3 egg, D4-5 sperm is really a generalisation of D1-3 = egg internal structure (non-DNA), D4-5 = DNA/chromosomes, with an unfounded assumption that if the egg was set up OK to pass the D1-3 test then it must be the sperm that brought in bad DNA to reveal its problems on D4-5.

    Quote Originally Posted by felicita View Post
    The above statement is expanded on a little in this post.

    Capri_12 - We got our first early blast on stim#7. Stims#1-5 were using really bad sperm, stims#6-8 were using low numbers of anonymous donor. All cycles used ICSI, and obviously never had anything to freeze, what with no blasts and all. We got UTD on stim#8 with yet another transfer of 2x morulas on D5.
    Since you're getting good fertilisation, then obviously the sperm are able to find the egg OK, so ICSI won't help there.
    But if you need to select for better quality sperm you can try a method of hyaluronic acid (HA) selection with ICSI. HA is on the outside of eggs, and happy sperm stick to it. You can use immature eggs to see which sperm stick to them, and ICSI the mature eggs with those sperm, or you can coat a petri dish with HA, and again only allow the sperm that stuck to be used for fertilisation.
    Another method of enhanced sperm selection is by using digital high magnification. As sperm get damaged, but before they're completely dead, they can accumulate vacuoles (regions in the sperm head that appear empty when viewed under a very high power microscope). If a sperm has one large vacuole, or many small vacuoles, then blastocyst potential of the embryo drops from 55-60% down to 0-5%. (Sorry I don't have the ref. on me atm, it's sitting in a thanked post somewhere, but can't search for them since buhub upgrade.)
    For me, the problem with egg/embryo quality was not fixed with DHEA, but was helped with extra LH during the stim phase. The cycle with 150 Pregnyl every 3 days got the early blast, the cycle with Luveris got UTD and all 5 that had fertilised grew to D5 morulas with no dropouts. (2 were transferred, of the remaining 3, two went on to form poor quality early blasts on D6 while the other died.)
    You can try polarised-light microscopy on the eggs to check proper spindle formation. Percentage of eggs with proper spindles falls with age. The cycle we checked it we learned that those with bad spindles had failed or abnormal fertilisation, so it's probably not related to D3-5 problems.
    You may just need to start adding in more interventions to try to learn about and rule out or overcome what your underlying issue actually is.
    Last edited by felicita; 18-03-2012 at 06:34.

  8. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to felicita For This Useful Post:

    BronwynCJ  (05-04-2012),Frostysmum  (18-03-2012)

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    973
    Thanks
    70
    Thanked
    301
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts
    Capri_12 - just remembered something else that actually might be extremely relevant.
    We added assisted hatching to the last couple of cycles as well. Assisted hatching thins the eggshell on day 3 using either laser (safer) or acid (riskier).
    For stim#7, the embryo growth had started to slow like usual at D3, but picked up again after the assisted hatching. Makes me wonder if my eggshells are not permeable enough to let in nutrients and/or let out waste. The embryo that had got to 8cell last resumed its growth first and became the early blast. The embryos that had got to 8cell earlier and stopped took longer to resume their growth after assisted hatching, so were behind the lead embryo at D5.
    For our successful cycle we didn't have daily updates, so can't say if the same growth patterns occurred, or if success was mostly due to the Luveris.

    (n.b. HA is a major component of cartilage, which is definitely not known for its permeability. Cells stuck inside cartilage tissue when it forms usually die by starvation because they can't get nutrients/water.)

  10. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to felicita For This Useful Post:

    BronwynCJ  (05-04-2012),Frostysmum  (18-03-2012)

  11. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Gold Coast
    Posts
    1,566
    Thanks
    299
    Thanked
    161
    Reviews
    0
    Achievements:Topaz Star - 500 posts
    Felicia- wow you are amazing! Total whizz!

    I'll try and track it down too but it's usually a google frenzy I'm in when I read and generally don't keep the documents.

    Thanks heaps for your feedback!

  12. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    104
    Thanks
    15
    Thanked
    19
    Reviews
    0
    Hi Capri_12

    DH and I have never been able to produce good quality embryos. We also have a low fertilisation rate and we used ICSI for our last two cycles but it didn't make a difference. MY FS thinks this is an egg quality issue. I had a seven month break before my last cycle in February. During the break I tried DHEA, acupuncture and a lot of supplements. Unfortunately it didn't make a difference. I received a lot of good advice on what to ask my fertility specialist last year. I'll try to find the thread.


 

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 18-04-2012, 10:38
  2. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-04-2012, 13:05
  3. Immature Eggs advice ???
    By liv01 in forum IVF
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 07-12-2011, 19:38

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
free weekly newsletters | sign up now!
who are these people who write great posts? meet our hubbub authors!
Learn how you can contribute to the hubbub!

reviews
learn how you can become a reviewer!

competitions

forum - chatting now
christmas gift guidesee all Red Stocking
BAE The Label
Versatile, premium maternity wear that you will love throughout pregnancy and long after. Cleverly designed for for all stages of motherhood so that you can 'Just be you (+1)'.
sales & new stuffsee all
Bub Hub Sales Listing
HAVING A SALE? Let parents know about it with a Bub Hub Sales listing. Listings are featured on our well trafficked Sales Page + selected randomly to appear on EVERY page
featured supporter
Medela Australia
Our goal is to give mothers and babies the best possible support for a great and long lasting breastfeeding experience. Medela have a full range of breastpumps and breastcare products, suited to every need and lifestyle.
gotcha
X

Pregnant for the first-time?

Not sure where to start? We can help!

Our Insider Programs for pregnancy first-timers will lead you step-by-step through the 14 Pregnancy Must Dos!