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  1. #201
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    GluttonForPunishment is offline Bubhub Award Winner - 2011- Most Optimistic Poster and Newbie of the Year Awards
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witwicky View Post
    I forgot all about this! Brb!
    Witwicky, are you SURE you don't want my user name?


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    Witwicky  (05-03-2012)

  3. #202
    Witwicky's Avatar
    Witwicky is offline A closed mouth gathers no foot.
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    Dr. Leonard Bailey is an American surgeon who performed a heart transplant on a baby ("Baby Fae") who had a serious heart defect. He placed the heart of a baboon (!) into her chest and she died shortly after.
    I first came across this case while debating the ethics of xenotransplantation at uni and was fairly horrified with what I found, to say the least.

    The attempt at a xenotransplant (cross species) procedure on an infant was completely unethical in itself, however one of the most concerning aspects was his choice of animal.

    During an interview following the death, Dr Bailey was questioned as to why he had used a baboon's heart due to its evolutionary distance from humans compared to other primates. His response was (direct quote) - "Er, I find that difficult to answer. You see, I don’t believe in evolution.”



    This is an example of how rejection of evolution concerns me and others in the community.

  4. #203
    Witwicky's Avatar
    Witwicky is offline A closed mouth gathers no foot.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GluttonForPunishment View Post
    Witwicky, are you SURE you don't want my user name?


  5. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witwicky View Post
    Dr. Leonard Bailey is an American surgeon who performed a heart transplant on a baby ("Baby Fae") who had a serious heart defect. He placed the heart of a baboon (!) into her chest and she died shortly after.
    I first came across this case while debating the ethics of xenotransplantation at uni and was fairly horrified with what I found, to say the least.

    The attempt at a xenotransplant (cross species) procedure on an infant was completely unethical in itself, however one of the most concerning aspects was his choice of animal.

    During an interview following the death, Dr Bailey was questioned as to why he had used a baboon's heart due to its evolutionary distance from humans compared to other primates. His response was (direct quote) - "Er, I find that difficult to answer. You see, I don’t believe in evolution.”



    This is an example of how rejection of evolution concerns me and others in the community.
    I'm confused. Does he believe in creationism? Or just a scientist/dr who deosn't believe that humans evolved from apes??

  6. #205
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    (me again..yes - unpacking groceries and have you all sitting on my kitchen bench - this is internet addiction at it's peak! )



    ...Just wanted to share - I have a disc of covers by Katie Noonan in my car..one of my FAVS is 'Solisbury Hill' ..a Peter Gabriel song.
    EVERYTIME I listen to it I get shivers, I am moved extremely close to tears.
    I won't deny I am a 'spiritual person'. I totally get the pain and confusion and heartwarming feeling an individual would feel undertaking a spiritual journey.
    ..total fascination.

    Whilst I deny the existence of 'god' as he is portrayed in the Bible, it isn't with a sense of hatred. It is with a sense of acceptence and appreciation of other interpretations of what 'may' exists beyond our comprehension.

    I cannot look at an image of a Bonobo or Chimpanzee or Orangutan breastfeeding it's young without having pangs of love evoked by the simple similarities between us that I see.
    That is casting all scientific literature aside - no books, no graphs, no timelines, no numbers!! ... that is the feeling in my heart that I get when I look at these absolutely beautiful animals.
    I can't for the life of me dissconnect that and say we are not related.



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    Witwicky  (05-03-2012)

  8. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by FiveInTheBed View Post
    I apologise if it was my actions that got the other thread closed.

    I will attempt to word my posts differently in the future.

    ..agreeing to disagree is not always easily done.
    I think we've discussed our feelings about last night and yes I got tired and irritated by it all.


    Quote Originally Posted by Witwicky View Post
    It was not your actions or the wording of your posts. I think you sounded respectful and genuinely interested

    I love, love, love discussing evolution and I had just spent no less than 30 mins responding to a post in there, clicked reply and it said 'thread closed'! Anyway, it just shows I shouldn't spend so much time getting caught up in discussions on here!
    Those posts were directed at me and I think I had the right to feel the way I did. If your posts were being misconstrued I'm sure you'd feel the same. I think you see things differently when your not directly involved and its not your words that someone is changing.
    I already explained to her in the other thread why I felt that way. She didn't dismiss me and she took the time to write to me and I appreciate that.
    So its finished.

  9. #207
    Witwicky's Avatar
    Witwicky is offline A closed mouth gathers no foot.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lily of the Nile View Post
    I'm confused. Does he believe in creationism? Or just a scientist/dr who deosn't believe that humans evolved from apes??
    He believe in creationism.

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    thats really interesting fiveinthebed.
    That love and connection you feel with
    the breastfeeding primate, is so similar to what people feel to God.
    when i had faith it was so pure, music and prayer could touch my heart and convince me of a connection.
    when i lost that i was so heartbroken, it was so beautiful.


    sent from brain to Iphone to BubHub~ a game of chinese whispers.

  11. #209
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    I haven't read all the replies so just answering the OP

    I don't specifically go into the religion/Spirituality category on bubhub - but if I click "new posts" and a topic comes up that is not specifically aimed at religious people like the "Why do Bad things happen to Good People" thread, I will probably click on it without even realising it's supposed to be only for people who believe in god. I mean.. this thread for example - is in the religion/spirituality category - and is specifically aimed at people who DON'T believe in god. So if we're not supposed to comment in that category then why this post?

    Anyway, I spend a good 8 years listening to bible stories, going to religion classes and chapel and singing hymns, watching jesus movies, and having an opinion forced on me by my teachers - but to me it is all fairy tails. I don't think I'm better or worse or smarter or less intelligent than anyone else because of my beliefs, but I believe what I believe and I don't see why I need to keep that to myself, so I often will say what I'm thinking. I tend not to be quite as passionate (and possibly at times rude) as some other posters can be though!

  12. #210
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    *double posting in 2 thread - 'cause I LOVE it!!

    Any one not familiar with Bonobos... please watch this short clip - and tell me what you see??

    It is really ...ermm.. cute!


    Bonobos have sex for pleasure - just lke we do..they use it to resolve conflict, just as we do.
    They have concealed ovulation just as we do (so sex isn't ONLY for reproduction - like most other animal species)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82GUj...eature=related

    This isn't CGI - this is real footage


 

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